Why Are Struggling Parents Such An Easy Mark?

[TheWho]

On 2005-10-04 04:34:00, Helena Handbasket wrote:

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On 2005-10-03 18:40:00, Anonymous wrote:


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On 2005-10-03 18:08:00, Anonymous wrote:



"If YOU are concerned about the kids and the school, then YOU should also be concerned about this school not being accredited, don't you think?  That's a whole lot of money down the drain for a worthless diploma."

Some may feel the diploma is secondary, the welfare of the child is primary.  The child may be able to go back to his or her state and test out of the high school he or she was in and receive a diploma there."

Fine, maybe that is the case... then call it what it is!  Don't wrap it up in an air of ivy league and hang a moniker on it that sounds like a resort.



Funny how the ed-cons, schools and parents spin this crap, it's not called "Manipulation", but the minute a kid verbalizes his dislike of the hellhole, that's "Manipulation".



"

Wasnt wrapping no spin, they are TBS's plain and simple.  If the parents want a top notch education for their kids as their primary quest just take the "T" off and look for a boarding school.  When a child needs to be stablized first a parent may be looking for a TBS.  For some parents the kids were not even going to school so they wont be picky about the level of education being offered.  Once the child is acclimated the education seems to come to the forfront and hopefully the parent has chosen a school which offers a level of education that meets the parents and child needs.

[Anonymous]

Fornits is a great authority.  I would certainly believe everything written about Tim Brace by the Fornits people.

Carlbrook is an emotional growth school which happens to have decent academics.  Many of the Carlbrook kids came from top prep schools and had been kicked out for behavior, drugs or some combination of the two.  It was good that the school had sufficient academics that the kids didn't lose too much ground and could move back into prep schools or go on to good colleges after Carlbrook.  
Carlbrook has a waiting list and is pretty selective about who they take.  
I won't rehash all this- there have been other threads about Carlbrook.  No one has ever claimed to have been abused there or to have had academic problems once they left.

[Deprogrammed]

Just remember those referrers are always making money off of those referrals. So, whether or not these referral people are making and exhuberant amount or not is immaterial! The point is that they are making money period...and supporting ones own family could be as little motivation as these referrers need to keep referring to bad places.
-DP :smokin:  :wave:

I would not let my children go to SW anymore than I would let them sleep in Michael Jackson's bed. I don't care if he was aquitted, it just ain't right.

http://fornits.com/wwf/bb_profile.php?mode=view&user=2703' target='_new'>AtomicAnt

[Antigen]

Look, this is what we're really talking about. These "therapeutic" boarding schools (and adjunct forced marches and such) are all about providing "therapy" for "disorders" that are not disorders at all.

Thankfully, some oppositional, defiant psyche professionals are beginning to spill the beans on that. Thank god, thank god!

Depathologizing the Spirit of Resistance
By Bruce Levine

In 1980 the American Psychiatric Association (APA), in step with the election of Ronald Reagan and the U.S. right-wing shift, proclaimed a new mental illness: oppositional defiant disorder (ODD). Today ODD has become an increasingly
popular diagnosis for a young person who "actively
defies or refuses to comply with adult requests or rules" and "argues with adults"--symptoms
according to the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Health Disorders (DSM), the APA's official diagnostic manual. While those once
labeled juvenile delinquents are now diagnosed with conduct disorder (CD), ODD is applied to those doing nothing illegal, only bucking authority.

Two ways of subduing anti-authoritarianism are
criminalizing it and pathologizing it and U.S. history is replete with examples of both. In
the same era of John Adams's Sedition Act, which criminalized criticism of U.S. governmental
policy, Dr. Benjamin Rush, "the father of American
psychiatry" (his image adorns the APA seal), pathologized anti-authoritarianism. Rush diagnosed those rebelling against a centralized federal authority as having an "EXCESS OF THE PASSION FOR LIBERTY" that "constituted a form of
insanity." He labeled this illness ANARCHIA.
>
Historically, both direct and indirect resistance to authority have been medicalized and diseased. In an 1851 article in the New Orleans Medical and
Surgical Journal, Louisiana physician Samuel
Cartwright reported his discovery of DRAPETOMANIA, the disease that CAUSED SLAVES TO FLEE CAPTIVITY, and DYSAESTHESIA AETHIOPIS, the disease that caused slaves to PAY INSUFFICIENT ATTENTION TO THE MASTER'S NEEDS. As with anarchia, few took drapetomania and dysaesthesia
aethiopis seriously--but this was before the
diseasing of anti-authoritarianism was accompanied by Big Pharma drugs and marketing
blitzs.

While drapetomania has given way to ODD and CD,
dysaesthesia aethiopis has given way to attention deficit hyperactivity disorder (ADHD). The vast
majority kids "with ADHD" are capable of paying attention and being cooperative in environments that they are comfortable in. Studies show that they will pay attention to activities that they have chosen, that they find stimulating, or for
which they are getting paid. They routinely pay
attention to what interests them but tend to blow off school, especially homework. In 1992 the then APA medical director proudly described the relationship between the APA and pharmaceutical corporations as a "responsible, ethical partnership," and, in 2001, the Journal of the American Medical Association estimated that four to six million ADHD-labeled U.S. kids were taking Ritalin and Ritalin-like drugs.

Young people often ask me why psychiatrists and
psychologists don't understand that it is normal for kids to rebel against being controlled. The answer, I believe, is that many psychiatrists and
psychologists are not in touch with how extremely obedient they are. Acceptance into medical school and graduate school requires lots of As, and achieving a PhD or MD means jumping through many
meaningless hoops, all of which require much
behavioral and attentional compliance. When compliant MDs and PhDs begin seeing noncompliant
patients, many of these doctors get uptight and anxiety is often a prelude to diseasing that
which is quite normal. (Homosexuality was a DSM
disease until 1970s gay rights activists forced its removal). [AND STILL CONSIDERED ONE IN MANY PROGRAMS] In the institutions where I trained, there were a small minority of medical and graduate students who challenged authority, but
they were commonly labeled by higher-ups as "having issues with authority" and were pressured to seek psychotherapy for that condition.

Many substance abusers, while routinely destructive to themselves and others and not to be romanticized, are often anti-authoritarians. Researcher Craig MacAndrew developed a scale that distinguishes alcoholic and drug abuser personalities from "normal" subjects. The most
significant "addictive personality type" had discipline problems at school, were less tolerant of boredom, were less compliant with authorities and some laws, and engaged in more disapproved
sexual practices. Many indigenous cultures are
communitarian, anti-authoritarian cultures, and it is no accident that so many indigenous people have resorted to substance abuse in the face of overwhelming powerlessness thrust upon them by the dominant culture.

Among anti-authoritarians, some prize only their own liberty, but many care so strongly about social injustice that their pain over its absence can overwhelm them. They feel alienated, and their great desire is to connect with like-minded souls. But it is not the 1960s or the 1890s and there are no well-known "scenes" where they can find others in "the movement" or "the cause."
So they often get depressed and become self-destructive, and some seek treatment.

In every generation there will be:
(1)authoritarians, the passionate of whom
are fascists, (2) bourgeois/yuppies, who enjoy
anti-authoritarian books, music, and movies but don't act on them, and (3) genuine anti-authoritarians, who are so pained by exploitive hierarchies that they take action. Sometimes
anti-authoritarian action is obvious, more often it is subtle, and too often it is futile. Only rarely do anti-authoritarians take effective direct action that inspires others to revolt, but every once in a while a Tom Paine comes along.

So control-freaks take no chances, and the state-corporate partnership criminalizes anti-authoritarianism, pathologizes it, markets drugs to "cure" it, and financially intimidates those who might buck the system.

These days the managed-care police are working
feverishly to speed patients out of treatment. Along with pressuring me to refer my clientele for drugs, these cops--more benignly--often demand that I assign homework. And so for clients whom I believe would identify with Emma Goldman, I "assign" her autobiography.

In the first 50 pages of Living My Life, Goldman
tells how in the late 1880s the Haymarket martyrs gave her unhappy life a cause and how that cause
energized her to leave her boring husband and move
from Rochester, New York to New York City where she quickly hooked up with a lover, a mentor, and a community of like-minded souls.

I am happy to report that Living My Life provided instant self-help for one middle-aged, female client of mine, an anti-authoritarian previously diagnosed with substance abuse, depression, and several personality disorders. She has a passion now for reading and foregoes booze when captivated by a good book, and so the 993 pages of Goldman's epic provided a longer detox treatment than that provided by many insurance companies. Now this woman is fairly certain that she would not have become depressed or abused alcohol if she too had had a cause and community, and she has become energized in her search.

Z

Bruce E. Levine is a clinical psychologist and
author of Commonsense Rebellion: Taking Back Your Life from Drugs, Shrinks, Corporations, and a World Gone Crazy (Continuum).
 
 - end -
 
 http://www.brucelevine.net

Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction.
--Philosopher, Blaise Pascal

[Anonymous]

On 2005-10-04 10:44:00, Anonymous wrote:

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On 2005-10-04 10:11:00, Anonymous wrote:


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On 2005-10-04 09:29:00, Anonymous wrote:



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On 2005-10-03 20:16:00, Anonymous wrote:







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On 2005-10-03 19:55:00, Anonymous wrote:











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On 2005-10-03 19:39:00, Anonymous wrote:











There's just one little problem with this scenario, instead of sending the kid away, his folks should have sought marital and family counseling to address their pathological parenting.  Parents are blaming their kids, when the problem is grounded in the parent's own pathology.















One can only wonder how this kid feels today about CEDU, for all we know, he could be one of the Fornits posters accusing CEDU of being a cult (which is was).















 :smokin: "

I was just applying some of the logic that seems to be popular around here."

That logic being that contrary to what the teen hurt industry would have us all believe, it is the parents, not the kids, who need help.





Yep, those of us who know a thing or two about this industry, have known that for a long time.





It's the parents who are emotionally troubled.





 :grin:





"

Woops == I think you sort of stepped in it (by accident).  The poster said he was using your logic not theirs, therefore you just slammed yourself.  Ouch  I have done it myself plenty of times, no biggie.  I dont think you mentioned that you read the book (oversight?)"

Look Spazola ... the point being it's the parents, not the kids, whose emotional IQ needs "adjusting".  

Yep, you heard it hear first.  

ANTI-TEEN HELPERS ... WE HELP STRUGGLING PARENTS JUST SAY NO TO EMOTIONAL GROWTH SCHOOLS FOR THEIR TEENS.

 :grin:

[Nihilanthic]

:nworthy:  :nworthy:  :nworthy:

Wow ginger, you fixed the quote tags and contributed more wisdom  :grin: [/worship]

Back to carlbrook and the academics.

If the "academics" are self taught and you keep taking it until you get a good grade, how hard is it to get a scholarship based on your grades?

Unless, of course, Carlbrook is different...

EDIT: WOA, HOLY QUOTES BATMAN! Could you cut out some of that? Jeezus.

Where powers are assumed which have not been delegated, a nullification of the act is the rightful remedy.
http://lfb.com/?stocknumber=FF7485&code=10247' target='_new'>Thomas Jefferson: Kentucky Resolutions, 1798

[ This Message was edited by: Nihilanthic on 2005-10-04 13:35 ]

[Anonymous]

Carlbrook has a full academic faculty.  Nothing is self-taught.  There is a normal academic day- not as much homework as most prep schools because of the emotional growth work.  It is year-round school, so kids can repair their transcripts and catch up.  There is an honor roll.

[TheWho]

On 2005-10-04 13:33:00, Anonymous wrote:
"

On 2005-10-04 10:44:00, Anonymous wrote:"

On 2005-10-04 10:11:00, Anonymous wrote:
"

On 2005-10-04 09:29:00, Anonymous wrote:
"

On 2005-10-03 20:16:00, Anonymous wrote:
"

On 2005-10-03 19:55:00, Anonymous wrote:
"

On 2005-10-03 19:39:00, Anonymous wrote:
Look Spazola ... the point being it's the parents, not the kids, whose emotional IQ needs "adjusting".  

Yep, you heard it hear first.  

ANTI-TEEN HELPERS ... WE HELP STRUGGLING PARENTS JUST SAY NO TO EMOTIONAL GROWTH SCHOOLS FOR THEIR TEENS.

 :grin: "

This is getting quite tedious.  Let me say this and then I will let you have the last word, you seem to need it more than I.
Some parents believe in outsourcing their kids to others to fill in where they cannot or to try to fix what they feel is broken.  Others hang in at home and either win or loss.  Some parents are fully engaged in their kids lives and others not so much.  But the majority of parents truely care about their kids and their happiness and wellbeing and THINK they are doing the right thing when making decisions regarding their children.... I sense your situation was different than the above statement and you fall outside of the majority and thats why you may be seeing things the way you do, no one here is judging you and you deserve to be angry and have Animosity towards all parents.

[Son Of Serbia]

On 2005-10-04 14:27:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Carlbrook has a full academic faculty.  Nothing is self-taught.  There is a normal academic day- not as much homework as most prep schools because of the emotional growth work.  It is year-round school, so kids can repair their transcripts and catch up.  There is an honor roll.  "

Yeah, Cedu used to spout the same bullshit, but that's all their education was: bullshit.  This is best examplified by the fact that so many of Cedu's most vocal ex-student supporters (here at fornits) lack even the most basic writing skills (Ie: capitalization, spelling, proper punctuation, etc).

As for the so-called "Emotional Growth Therapy":
I fail to see how being screamed at and verbally
abused on for hours at a time (often while being deprived of sleep), qualifies as real "work".  Furthermore, I can't imagine how any
real "school" could in good conscience, justify short-changing their students academically in favor of exposing them to such despicable treatment.

Sorry, but you're really not making a very strong case for Carlbrook.

[Anonymous]

I am a former Carlbrook student and I am now in college.  The academics were fine.  I had some really great teachers and some bad ones- just like at my home high school.  I took 3 AP courses and got 4s and 5s on the exams.  I received college credit for the courses.  The biggest problem is that some of the teachers don't stick around.  It is not the easiest teaching job since they don't get the summers off, which is one of the big draws of teaching for most people.  Most of the kids at Carlbrook were pretty strong students to begin with. There were a few who struggled, and they had extra required study halls.  Out of my graduating class there were a lot of college acceptances.  Kids tend to apply to a lot of schools because there is no telling what role the past behavioral problems will play in admissions.  One kid in my group had 1550 SATs and got into some great colleges.  A lot of kids tend to stay in the south and go to the small,selective liberal arts colleges like Rhodes, Sewanee and Wofford.  There are also kids at UNC and Furman.  The academics at Carlbrook aren't that different from any other private school. The one problem is that everyone came from a different background, so there are different levels of kids in the math classes, for example.  
I actually stayed at Carlbrook past my graduation from the program in order to finish high school.  It didn't make sense to attend yet another school. The college counselor at Carlbrook is really good and knows how to help kids get into good schools. Not everyone is rich- and many families took out loans and even sold houses to afford Carlbrook. It was important to get financial aid and merit awards.

[Antigen]

I think you guys should check out the tables tags. They're real easy. Using angle braces instead of square brackets, do this:

[table bgcolor="000000" text="999999" border="20"]

Your asounding wisdom

There is so much in the bible against which every insinct of my being rebels, so much so that I regret the necessity which has compelled me to read it through from beginning to end. I do not think that the knowledge I have gained of its history and sources compensates me for the unpleasant details it has forced upon my attention.
--Helen Keller, American lecturer

[Helena Handbasket]

Wasnt wrapping no spin, they are TBS's plain and simple.  If the parents want a top notch education for their kids as their primary quest just take the "T" off and look for a boarding school.  When a child needs to be stablized first a parent may be looking for a TBS.  For some parents the kids were not even going to school so they wont be picky about the level of education being offered.  Once the child is acclimated the education seems to come to the forfront and hopefully the parent has chosen a school which offers a level of education that meets the parents and child needs."

Then knock it off with the "Academy" bullshit.  Look up the root of academy - it kinda brings to mind, well academics.  The jury is still out on Carlbrook, and others that may be a different breed of these places, but in what we've come to know about some of these warehouses, where the only allowed reading material is a bible (if you're allowed that), and you can be disciplined for being caught listening to the daily news, and where it's commonplace to disallow a "Student" from even attending classes so that they may "focus on themselves" - the word academy doesn't wash.


Yeah, "Hopefully" the parent pays attention and can recognize when a kid wants to play by "the rules"... but what set of rules?  Have you stopped to think, and maybe listen to others that there are asshole parents out there that just wanna stick it to a kid for being such an "inconvenience"?  Or maybe they're just plain stupid, and wouldn't know an Academy from Alcatraz.  Who gets to grow up with a sub-standard education? Who gets to fight to make up for it if they get the time while trying to juggle a life on top of remedial education?

If Carlbrook is a great place - just provide the proof.

[Anonymous]

Why does anyone need to provide proof to you whether Carlbrook or any other school is a great place? You keep slamming all the schools as a whole, and when someone points out that you are wrong, you demand proof.  The issue isn't whether Carlbrook is a great place. Many posters on this forum have pointed out that many of the Carlbrook grads go on to good colleges and that the academics at Carlbrook are strong.  You have seen the list of colleges and a faculty member has confirmed the academic success of the grads.  I'm sure Carlbrook isn't Exeter, but it obviously does not fit into your basket of abusive, deceptive teen jails.  
A poster on another thread who was the parent of a Carlbrook kid had some issues with the school.  It isn't a perfect place.  It does seem to work for some kids.

[Helena Handbasket]

On 2005-10-04 15:18:00, Anonymous wrote:

"I am a former Carlbrook student and I am now in college.  The academics were fine.  I had some really great teachers and some bad ones- just like at my home high school.  I took 3 AP courses and got 4s and 5s on the exams.  I received college credit for the courses.  The biggest problem is that some of the teachers don't stick around.  It is not the easiest teaching job since they don't get the summers off, which is one of the big draws of teaching for most people.  Most of the kids at Carlbrook were pretty strong students to begin with. There were a few who struggled, and they had extra required study halls.  Out of my graduating class there were a lot of college acceptances.  Kids tend to apply to a lot of schools because there is no telling what role the past behavioral problems will play in admissions.  One kid in my group had 1550 SATs and got into some great colleges.  A lot of kids tend to stay in the south and go to the small,selective liberal arts colleges like Rhodes, Sewanee and Wofford.  There are also kids at UNC and Furman.  The academics at Carlbrook aren't that different from any other private school. The one problem is that everyone came from a different background, so there are different levels of kids in the math classes, for example.  

I actually stayed at Carlbrook past my graduation from the program in order to finish high school.  It didn't make sense to attend yet another school. The college counselor at Carlbrook is really good and knows how to help kids get into good schools. Not everyone is rich- and many families took out loans and even sold houses to afford Carlbrook. It was important to get financial aid and merit awards.  "

Okay.  I won't give you an "A" for Creative Writing, maybe Math is your strongpoint.

I'm going to assume that students at Carlbrook attend regular classes that afford them a competitve education.

What's it like otherwise?  Give us "a day in the life at Carlbrook".  What rules did you have to follow?  Were you allowed to be alone?  Allowed to leave the campus to grab a burger?  What kind of recreation were  you allowed?  Were you allowed to call home?  Write letters?  What did you do on the weekends?

What was "against the rules"?

_________________
Where are we going, and what are we doing in this handbasket??[ This Message was edited by: Helena Handbasket on 2005-10-04 18:55 ]

[Anonymous]

Don't you notice this poster posts nothing specific about day-to-day life. They are very vague and post no information which actually suggests they were there. This forum attracts a few program trolls who pose as ex-students who are thankful for being sent to private kiddy prison.

If you believe in your program so much, why not post your name?

We can all make up stories, especially ones as vague as yours are, troll.  :wave: