Author Topic: Changes at Pathway?  (Read 17534 times)

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Offline Anonymous

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Changes at Pathway?
« Reply #45 on: July 03, 2003, 02:38:00 PM »
Quote
On 2003-07-03 10:39:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Hugs,

You sound like a bloody clone/drone and you don't even realize it do you?



You poor sap.


Well, I am at peace with myself. I am at peace with my family and we are a closer knit family than at anytime in our past. I understand what things cause it not to be so and can fix them before extensive harm is caused. I have a good paying job. I have great working environment.
hmmmmmmmm  If this is being a clone/drone.... how can I get more of it??????

How is your life going right now???? I hope as well as mine. I can only wish these gifts find their way into your heart as they have for me.

Hugs   :smile:
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Offline Antigen

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Changes at Pathway?
« Reply #46 on: July 03, 2003, 04:35:00 PM »
Quote
On 2003-07-03 08:37:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Ok, now that I have your attention the only way you can get these things back is to be willing to be honest with your feelings.

Not true. As stated pretty succinctly by EMSR earlier in this topic, the only way to get back these basic necessities for good mental health is to lie and say you're an addict and then to come to actually believe it.

Quote
Have the anger if that is what is there but UNDERSTAND why it is there and deal with underlying causes."


I understand why it's is there. Anger is a good and wholesome, healthy and normal response to the scenareo you just described. The anger is there because you're a sadistic bitch.

Boundary, n.  In political geography, an imaginary line between two nations, separating the imaginary rights of one from the imaginary rights of another.
-- Ambrose Bierce,  The Devil's Dictionary

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Offline Anonymous

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Changes at Pathway?
« Reply #47 on: July 04, 2003, 12:25:00 PM »
Quote
On 2003-07-03 13:35:00, Antigen wrote:

"
Quote

On 2003-07-03 08:37:00, Anonymous wrote:


"Ok, now that I have your attention the only way you can get these things back is to be willing to be honest with your feelings.




Not true. As stated pretty succinctly by EMSR earlier in this topic, the only way to get back these basic necessities for good mental health is to lie and say you're an addict and then to come to actually believe it.



Quote

Have the anger if that is what is there but UNDERSTAND why it is there and deal with underlying causes."




I understand why it's is there. Anger is a good and wholesome, healthy and normal response to the scenareo you just described. The anger is there because you're a sadistic bitch.




Again.... this is wonderful. You guys are actually thinking about things. The old me would react to your personal attack on me but who I have become realizes that the issues are yours and you own them for your hateful remarks. Other than that, lets look beyond it to what you say because it is important and has merit.

Is it sad that your personal freedoms were taken away? YES I wholeheartedly agree. Were these freedoms extreemly important to you? WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Appparently so, for which I am eternally greatful. So far your argument ONLY looks at yourself and what harm was done to you personally. So I ask the following and will be general about this but takes in many scenarios. What appies to you take in.... What doesn't let go.... but THINK ABOUT IT SERIOUSLY if you have the stomach to.

How about my personal freedoms? How about the personal freedoms of the rest of my family that FOR YEARS YOU TRAMPLED ON by your drug use? I have the right to go to bed and sleep and not have to be up all night worrying about where you are, what you are doing, are you still alive. I have the right of hanging on to the items and money I EARNED you stole from me to pay for your drug habbit. I have the right to not be threatened with bodily harm while you are strung out on drugs or desparate to leave the house to get another fix. Your siblings  and your mom have the right not to be terrorized by you because of your uncontrollable anger. Talk about being able to function normally after Pathway... lets talk about your brother or sister whom still have nightmares because they feel unsafe because you are coming back home again or they are afraid to make friends due to their memories of you or your drug buddies harm to them. I have the right to look my neighbors in the eye and not be ashamed of my child's actions that caused him to break into their homes to steal alcohol and money for their drug use. They have the right not to feel their security was raped by you.

I could go on and on and on and on!!!!!! But again YOU KNOW ALL THIS DON'T YOU? I certainly do and everyone of these postings NEVER MENTION ALL THE HARM THAT HAS OCCURED BY YOUR OWN HANDS!!!  Some will say because I was molested as a child... I am regretfully sorry. I believe in the death penalty for such offenses. Whatever anger event caused a change for the worse in your behavior only improves by looking at it. The question is how do I break down that wall and let you see inside  and right what wrongs I can? So this is why I brought you to Pathway. Your own behavior was so aggregious that YOU left me no choice. Thank God for Pathway.


P.S. a happy note for you guys.Due to the accreditation process at Pathway, they have recommended that the bathroom doors will now be closed for all clients unless they is a clinical conditions (person is suicidal,tends to self mutilate, or other clinical reasons that make it necessary.) Pathway changes due to sound reasoning and new interpretations of health code. Sorry if it was not the website that caused this but it does not matter. The decision is a reasonable one and will be tried. As rules in the past, most of them were made because they were "EVENT DRIVEN". Something happened and a rule was made to address the issue. Not all rules apply to all conditions and they are willing to look at it. KUDOS again for Pathway. Other programs I cannot comment on... I am not a member of other programs... I can only speak about the one I do know.

 Hugs    :smile:
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Offline METALGOD8

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Changes at Pathway?
« Reply #48 on: July 04, 2003, 02:40:00 PM »
To Anonoymous Hugger:

Go ahead and keep that "positive attitude" You'll need it in a few years. Cant make sense of beating a dead horse anymore.

MG8 :smokin:
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Offline Anonymous

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Changes at Pathway?
« Reply #49 on: July 05, 2003, 11:27:00 AM »
If you are still in Pathway then what you say has no relevance here. Your kids been brainwashed but will figure it out after he's out.
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Offline Antigen

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Changes at Pathway?
« Reply #50 on: July 05, 2003, 12:05:00 PM »
Look, Hugs, first, you're presuming an awful lot about us; people you've never even met. When I got shangaid into the Program, I was not stealing, I dared not ever holler at my parents for any reason, never hurt anyone and was not strung out on drugs. I was an honor role student, played in the band, sung in the chior, played a part in the play and was on the tennis team.

Like your younger children, I lived in constant fear of going into the Program from the time I was about 8 and started to realize that that was probably in my future no matter WHAT I did to avoid it. Until I was about 12, it was only a little painful being teacher's pet and Mommy's good little Program protege. Ok, so kids teased me or shunned me, no big deal, they were all just a bunch of druggielosers anyway, or they had druggieattitudes and I was better than that. Hmph!

Of course, puberty hit like a runnaway freight train and it suddenly became very important to have the respect and affection of my peers, especially the male variety. But I couldn't let it show. Nope. According to Program dogma, any kind of sexual tendencies before the age of at least 21 was a sure sign of druggiedome! And I couldn't be angry or moody or anything but euphoric on Jesus and the Program because THAT was, of course, one of the "signs". A need for privacy? Well, I couldn't tell my mother that I didn't want her barging into my room unnanounced. So I just started sleeping in the nude. That worked... for awhile....

With that kind of isolation and scrutiny and no one to turn to, I became very, very depressed. Of course, according to your paranoic world view, a teenaged girl who is depressed must necessarily be a druggie in need of your special, singular brand of treatment.

So I hid it for a good long while. But when it got to be too much, I finally skipped school for the first time in my life, took my $137 out of the credit union, packed a bag and hitchiked to Massachusetts. Of course, running away is also a sure sign of druggiedome and. Once I realized that none of my relatives were going to stand up to my crazy mother's threats of legal action and just let me be a goddamned kid for Christ's sake, I went back home and waited for "the day" like a death-row inmate.

Your "signs of adolescent drug use" are nothing but signs of the normal, though sometimes uncomfortable, phase of life called adolescence. Don't even begin to try and tell me that every kid that goes into Pathway is a properly diagnosed addict or that the Program addresses addiction in any kind of productive way. I know better.

Second, don't hand me your long sad story of nobel martyrdome about your terrible, horrible kids and how mean they have been to you. You're not talking to a scared, stupid teenager here. I have a 19 year old daughter of my own. Here's how that works. Sometime, over a decade ago, for love or money or whatever reason, you decided it was a good idea to lay down and spread `em. That's how you came to have children. The children had no say in the matter and so they owe you not a goddamned thing. If you do a good job and your kids are grateful, well that's nice. If not, don't blame the kid.

And, having laid out your real motivation in all this so well, PLEASE spare me any future bullshit about how it's all for the children, it's not. The Program is all about feeding your martyrdome complex to get you to give up your money, your time, your energy and your very progeny. Always has been.

When a well-packaged web of lies
has been sold gradually to the masses
over generations, the truth will seem
utterly preposterous and its speaker
a raving lunatic.      

--Dresden James

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Offline SurvivorEMSR

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Changes at Pathway?
« Reply #51 on: July 05, 2003, 04:11:00 PM »
Antigen, I really have a lot of respect for you. Thanks for posting. EMSR
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #52 on: July 05, 2003, 09:19:00 PM »
KUDOS ANTIGEN! TOOSHAY!

An excerpt from a cool song, found to be by me to be most fitting in this topic. There may be others,  :rofl:


Life planned out before my birth, nothing could I say. Had no chance to see it all moulded day by day. Looking back I realize, nothing have I done, left to die with only friend alone I clench my gun.

Soldier boy, made of clay, now an empty shell, 21 only son, but he served us well. Bred to kill, not to care, do just as I say. Finished here, greetings death, he's yours to take away.

Back to the front! You will do what I say, when I say, Back to the front! You will die when I say, you must die, Back to the front!

You servant, you coward, you blindman

BACK TO THE FRONT!!!!!


Hug that!  :rofl:




Excerpts from Metallica's Disposable Heroes
off of the Master of Puppets CD.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #53 on: July 06, 2003, 03:51:00 PM »
Click This -->>
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #54 on: July 06, 2003, 08:17:00 PM »
"Your "signs of adolescent drug use" are nothing but signs of the normal, though sometimes uncomfortable, phase of life called adolescence."

Thank you for posting EMSR.  I am sorry that if that is all that was going on in your life, you were subjected to Straight.  How they worked  or did not work, only you can testify to. I was not there. As crazy as you make mom sound and it may be the truth, I would still like to hear what she had to say about what you call "normal adolescence". I had recomended Pathway to two separate families who were having problems involving drug use at least to investigate if they could help them. Both were told that their child was not involved enough in drug use to be candidates for Pathway. It sounds like there were no safeguards on your program. I am sorry for that. I try to speak about what I know and not what I am unqualified to state with certainty as you may have figured out by my postings so far. My first signs that I needed more help than to just he "he will grow out of this" was a police call to go to the emergency room in the middle of the night for a drug overdose. The doctors were not sure my child was going to live that night. I needed no more proof that my child needed help I was unable to give on my own and I acted in his best interest. This unselfish act has saved my child's life and afforded him a "chance" to sort out life in time. That has happened, or at least to a far greater extent than I had not acted. No one could convince me that what I did was worse than the death of my child. Most of what I read in here about Pathway is anger that 1 they could not afford it which is not my problem or that of Pathways. 2. They failed to complete the program because they wanted to do what they wanted to do when they wanted to do it. To them I say life will have nothing but turmoil as long as it is approached with such uncaring for one's self and others.3. They completed the program and did what they did to get thru it and never use the opportunity given to look at themselves. If they have done this and remained clear of drugs and alcohol then God Bless. If life is still very troubling, I hope for your sake you attend N.A. or A.A. meetings and reach out for the help you can get.

     In my earlier postings I went thru the methods I used to select a program. It does not sound to me that I acted with malice. The result is that my child is here, smile, is happy, communicates feelings,solves problems better than before the experience.

    So I will end here tonight. I am sad and upset. My child been reaching out to another at N.A. to keep coming to meetings who had been fighting this disease without much help from her parents. She hung herself last night at home. I wonder....... no... it is not my place.

Hugs :???:
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #55 on: July 06, 2003, 09:30:00 PM »
"My child been reaching out to another at N.A. to keep coming to meetings who had been fighting this disease without much help from her parents. She hung herself last night at home. I wonder....... no... it is not my place."

There you go again!!!!! Madame propagandist hard at work. I don't believe you, I think you're making this up. I'm sure that 'suicide' your attempting to pan off here on us ought to be listed in tomorrow's Detroit Free Press. I'll be sure to look.

Here are some other propagandists that got into this act LONG before your mind rapist career got up and running. You may have heard of them, Mel and Betty Sembler, creators of Straight INC. who nowadays they call their creation Drug Free America Foundation (DFAF).  They created a "memorial wall" over on their site dedicated to non-existent people who also like your 'child's DA friend" you claim have killed themselves.

 http://dfaf.infopop.cc/6/ubb.x?a=frm&s= ... =428601289

"HUGS  :???:" ..... I don't hug mind rapist liars....
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Offline Antigen

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Changes at Pathway?
« Reply #56 on: July 06, 2003, 11:14:00 PM »
Quote
On 2003-07-06 17:17:00, Anonymous wrote:

I had recomended Pathway to two separate families who were having problems involving drug use at least to investigate if they could help them. Both were told that their child was not involved enough in drug use to be candidates for Pathway.

Translation: No money and/or at least one parent was too smart to be suckered in.

Quote
On 2003-07-06 17:17:00, Anonymous
It sounds like there were no safeguards on your program. I am sorry for that.
What a load! I've heard from several PFC graduates with the same story. I've read the "signs of addiction" and called the place with a sad, sad story about a 13yo daughter who yells at me, wears too much makeup and keeps secrets. Guess what? According to whoever took the call (you, maybe?) my darling little ficticious daughter was very, VERY likely experiencing the "early stages" of the "disease of addiction." One think I learned in the Program that really has proven to be true; ya' can't shit a shitter.


Quote
I needed no more proof that my child needed help I was unable to give on my own and I acted in his best interest. This unselfish act has saved my child's life and afforded him a "chance" to sort out life in time. That has happened, or at least to a far greater extent than I had not acted.


Oh, puh-leeez! spare me the self agrandizement. Do you have any evidence, aside from your very subjective anecdotes to support your stayed belief that 1) your son would not have learned from his mistakes and been just fine, just like 99% of other high school kids who puke and pass out at some point or that 2) PFC's methods do more good than harm?

If PFC is comepletely different from what it was before the name change, then I guess you're sophisticated enough to get with the 20th century and draw on long term outcome studies, right? You look at a large group of kids with similar demographic backgrounds and issues. You select similar numbers of these study subjects from those who went through different programs and a control group who went through no program. And then you compare, 6 months, a year, 5 years down the road, how things turned out for them.

Is that something like how you base your claim that PFC is the greatest thing since sliced bread? Or do you do just like they did in the old days; blame the 90% failure rating on primal flaws in those individuals? Or, better yet! Start a rumor going around that the kid who's complaing is pushing crack on everyone who talks to them. Then get them all in the intake room and piss test them. At the least,  they'll all be afraid to talk to him and so they and their parents won't hear any criticizm of the Program. And maybe, if you're lucky, you can get one or more of them to break under pressure, implicate the kid and thereby discredit another critic. Then treat yourself to a nice boston cream pie or something for a job well done, right?

Do tell?
Quote
No one could convince me that what I did was worse than the death of my child.

The question is, how did you come to regard your son as dead? Lady, you have been scammed on a grand scale.

Quote
Most of what I read in here about Pathway is anger that 1 they could not afford it which is not my problem or that of Pathways.

I haven't read one post about anyone complaining they couldn't afford it. People who don't have anything worth stealing generally don't make good marks to begin with. I've seen a lot of people posting that it wasn't worth the money. You sound like one of those guys who calls a girl a lezbo if she turns him down.  :rofl:

Quote
2. They failed to complete the program because they wanted to do what they wanted to do when they wanted to do it.

Oh wise and omnicient hugs! Please, honor us with the secret of your all-knowing-ness! How in the hell do you prepose to know why anyone has done anything they have done? It's not asif you're allowed to talk with people who leave your cult and find out what they were thinking.

Quote
To them I say life will have nothing but turmoil as long as it is approached with such uncaring for one's self and others.

Your reality check has just bounced. One of these poor souls for whom you pretend to feel such empathy and compassion is too busy pulling a 3.70 in college to triffle with the likes of you. Most people who get their families the hell out of these mad houses before too long get themselves back together pretty well. And, in the interest of historic perspective, that's always been the case.

Fred Collins, one of the first to successfully sue your cult for a substantial sum, used it to pay for tuition to finish his Doctorate at mathamatics at Stanford. A good many posters to these forums could buy and sell your whole block without thinking about it, and most of those did it on their own, without even average family support, because their programmed parents were not about to become "enablers" to bad, bad, druggie children who weren't following their programs.


Quote
3. They completed the program and did what they did to get thru it and never use the opportunity given to look at themselves. If they have done this and remained clear of drugs and alcohol then God Bless. If life is still very troubling, I hope for your sake you attend N.A. or A.A. meetings and reach out for the help you can get.

In other words, the Program never fails, it's perfect like God. Is that it? But it's not a cult, no!!!  :rofl:

Quote

     In my earlier postings I went thru the methods I used to select a program. It does not sound to me that I acted with malice.

No, just rank stupidity.
Quote
The result is that my child is here, smile, is happy, communicates feelings,solves problems better than before the experience.

STILL no evidence to suggest that he wouldn't have been here, happy and communicating. But here's the kicker. He could do all of those things right now, every day, with admirable competence, grace and poise, but if he steps to you one day and say "Mom, there are some things about the program that are just messed up" Oh My God!!!! No!!!! he'll be a loser, in your eyes. And God forbid he ever have a drink of champaign to ring in the new year! He could corner the software market, move in next to Bill Gates, have a loving family and kids, but if he drinks or smokes a join, he loses your affection and acceptance. How can you people NOT see how utterly fucked up that is?

Quote

    So I will end here tonight. I am sad and upset. My child been reaching out to another at N.A. to keep coming to meetings who had been fighting this disease without much help from her parents. She hung herself last night at home. I wonder....... no... it is not my place.



Hugs :???: "

Exactly. An awful lot of Program people seem to do that. Funny, I went to school with hundreds of other kids, some with serious family problems, most did drugs at some point. And yet, not a single one has offed themselves in the over 20 years since. I wish I could say that about the people I saw go through the Program.
Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent disinclination to do so.
 Douglas Adams, _Last Chance to See_
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #57 on: July 07, 2003, 07:48:00 AM »
Well, there was a very sad article in the Detroit Free Press about several drownings in the Great Lakes, but NOTHING in their about your "child's NA friend".

http://www.freep.com/news/mich/drown7_20030707.htm

Didn't a thing about it on channel 7 WXYZ or WWJ/WJR radio. Nope......nada........

'Young woman hangs herself', if it were true, hell yeah it would of made news around these parts.......

OK, that idea fell apart on you, so what's next on your agenda "HUGS"????
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #58 on: July 07, 2003, 11:14:00 AM »
I am sorry. I misunderstood the day of the event but my sadness hass not lessened. Apparently it was learned this last Saturday. The event occured the week before. Here are the details....

Kathryn L. Kovala

Kathryn Louise Kovala, 16, of Brighton died June 21 at the University of Michigan. She was born Dec. 24, 1986, in Lincoln Park to Thomas E. and Amy C. (King) Kovala.
Ms. Kovala was a student at Brighton High School and a member of AA and NA.

She is survived by her mother, Amy King of Brighton; father, Daniel Flavin of Brighton; brothers, Vincent Kovala at home and Jesse Kovala of New Boston; sisters, Jacqueline Kovala and Roxie Flavin, both at home; maternal grandparents, Ellis and Clydene King of Oscoda; paternal grandparents, Michael and Clarice Kovala of Madison Heights; and several aunts and uncles.

Services will be held at 10 a.m. Wednesday, June 25, at the Episcopal Church of the Incarnation of Ann Arbor. The Rev. Joseph Summers and the Rev. Susan King will officiate. Interment will be in Holy Sepulchre.

Visitation hours are 2-8 p.m. Tuesday, June 24, at Herrmann Funeral Home, (810) 229-2905. A prayer service will be held at 8 p.m.



Since this is a public obituary notice, I have no problems in sharing it with you yet it still brings sadness to me. This should be verifyable for those who wish to find anything they can to discredit what I have to say. That is truely their issue.  I have shared with you things to think about. Hopefully you do. If not,.... Oh well, I tried. I feel I have met my need to post in here and nothing else need be said. Good luck in your struggles.

Hugs  :???:
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #59 on: July 07, 2003, 11:23:00 AM »
like the old saying goes,
Don't let the door hit ya where the good lord split ya!  :rofl:  :rofl:
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