Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform > Aspen Education Group
Split from ASR: Private School or RTC
TheWho:
You see one problem I struggle with is I hear that all TBS?s are the same and they are all abusive. Yet when I post my experience with one of the TBS?s I am accused of ?using your limited experience with ASR as a basis for the entire industry?.?. If you had a bad experience with HLA I can believe and accept that and they should be exposed. But I have heard posters indicate time and again about how bad ASR is and this is based on their limited experience with a different school.
I read extensively here and recognize there are differences from school to school, I find it strange that many claim to also read but don?t see this distinction?? anyway??.I Don?t recommend all TBS?s to parents, only the programs I know of, but if you flip that around, people who have knowledge of one TBS here on fornits many times conclude that they are all bad ? this is a double standard.
Troll Control:
--- Quote from: ""TheWho"" ---You see one problem I struggle with is I hear that all TBS?s are the same and they are all abusive. Yet when I post my experience with one of the TBS?s I am accused of ?using your limited experience with ASR as a basis for the entire industry?.?. If you had a bad experience with HLA I can believe and accept that and they should be exposed. But I have heard posters indicate time and again about how bad ASR is and this is based on their limited experience with a different school.
I read extensively here and recognize there are differences from school to school, I find it strange that many claim to also read but don?t see this distinction?? anyway??.I Don?t recommend all TBS?s to parents, only the programs I know of, but if you flip that around, people who have knowledge of one TBS here on fornits many times conclude that they are all bad ? this is a double standard.
--- End quote ---
I think I can help you with this. Almost ALL programs are built upon a foundation that has proven to be ineffective at best (i.e. any noticeable changes in the subject are created by the subject, not the program) and damaging at worst. These programs share one ideology and it is deeply, deeply flawed.
The basis by which one can claim "all programs are the same" is that NONE OF THEM ARE VOLUNTARY and that being said TREATMENT CANNOT BE FORCED UPON A SUBJECT. All programs fit this description and are therefore, BY DESIGN, ABUSIVE TO THE PATIENT. So, they are ALL THE SAME - forced treatment.
So the very model upon which these places are built is inherently abusive.
Now, what you're referring to is various and sundry forms of allegory abuse that occurs at these places where kids are beaten, starved, raped and sometimes even killed. You say that all these places are different based on this TYPE of abuse, and that's true.
HOWEVER, they are all COERCED TREATMENT facilities and so, by mental health guidelines are ABUSIVE, as treatment can ONLY BE ENTERED INTO VOLUNTARILY.
So, what you're saying is that there are all kinds of abuse and not every faciltiy PHYSICALLY abuses kids in the same manner, and IT'S TRUE! The elephant in the room that you are not seeing is that they are ALL ABUSIVE based on their ideology.
OK?
RobertBruce:
I agree that we shouldnt use generalizations but I think if you read a little closer youll find that they arent quite as prevalent on here as you think.
For example you claim that many posters on here state that all TBS's are abusive. I agree that some do but I think more often than not what youll find is that rather than stating every TBS abuses kids people state that the methods, specifically coercive therapy used by (so far as I know) all TBS's are in fact abusive.
Now more of a concern then generalizations I think is you once again discounting peoples experiences.
Why do you continue to do this? Simply because you didnt hear about something in no way suggest it never occured. A great many things happen in the world that arent mentioned on the 6 o'clock news. Espically when people are actively trying to cover them up as they do in this industry.
Also back to the original topic, I wonder do you support the health department visiting resturants?
TheWho:
--- Quote ---The basis by which one can claim "all programs are the same" is that NONE OF THEM ARE VOLUNTARY and that being said TREATMENT CANNOT BE FORCED UPON A SUBJECT. All programs fit this description and are therefore, BY DESIGN, ABUSIVE TO THE PATIENT. So, they are ALL THE SAME - forced treatment.
So the very model upon which these places are built is inherently abusive.
--- End quote ---
I think it can be said that when it comes to children there are no voluntary treatments. I don?t believe many kids approach their parents and say ?Mom, Dad, I think I would like to speak to a therapist?. If we were held to this requirement not many kids would get help. Until a child is 18 it is up the parents to get them the treatment needed. The child may not be a happy camper his/her first few days there, but eventually they come to feel safe and find it becomes a place where they can talk about any issues they may have, get back on track. There couldn?t be a safer place for most of these kids and I believe kids cant begin to heal until they feel safe and this is the first step. The therapy can be introduced after they settle in.
--- Quote ---Now, what you're referring to is various and sundry forms of allegory abuse that occurs at these places where kids are beaten, starved, raped and sometimes even killed. You say that all these places are different based on this TYPE of abuse, and that's true.
HOWEVER, they are all COERCED TREATMENT facilities and so, by mental health guidelines are ABUSIVE, as treatment can ONLY BE ENTERED INTO VOLUNTARILY.
So, what you're saying is that there are all kinds of abuse and not every faciltiy PHYSICALLY abuses kids in the same manner, and IT'S TRUE! The elephant in the room that you are not seeing is that they are ALL ABUSIVE based on their ideology.
OK?
--- End quote ---
No, I am not. The treatment may be involuntary at first, sure, kids need a little push. How many kids say they don?t want to join the swim team or track. Some parents will goes as far as saying? You wont get a cell phone unless you join an extra curricular activity? I know this may seem abusive to some, but most kids end up enjoying it after they get exposed to it.
As far as the kids getting physically abused, at a TBS, this is an overwhelming minority and the perpetrators are dealt with quickly like they are when it happens in our local public school system and local programs.
TheWho:
--- Quote ---I agree that we shouldnt use generalizations but I think if you read a little closer youll find that they arent quite as prevalent on here as you think.
For example you claim that many posters on here state that all TBS's are abusive. I agree that some do but I think more often than not what youll find is that rather than stating every TBS abuses kids people state that the methods, specifically coercive therapy used by (so far as I know) all TBS's are in fact abusive.
Now more of a concern then generalizations I think is you once again discounting peoples experiences.
Why do you continue to do this? Simply because you didnt hear about something in no way suggest it never occured. A great many things happen in the world that arent mentioned on the 6 o'clock news. Espically when people are actively trying to cover them up as they do in this industry.
--- End quote ---
You keep repeating that I dismiss people?s experiences, where did you read this? If you felt I did at any point, let me know and I will apologize. I listen to each person that speaks to me and I recognize their experience.
--- Quote ---Also back to the original topic, I wonder do you support the health department visiting resturants?
--- End quote ---
I didn?t see this as the original topic? But to answer your question, Yes, I do.
Bob, do you have any people to add (that I might have missed) for 2001 - 2002 data?
You can answer this in the "Thewho" thread. Didnt mean to side track the topic
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