Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform > The Seed Discussion Forum
Another 73/74 Seedling Grad
GregFL:
--- Quote ---On 2006-01-04 07:13:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
--- Quote ---
On 2006-01-02 07:29:00, GregFL wrote:
--- Quote ---
On 2006-01-01 21:15:00, Anonymous wrote:
The magic did wear off. It was the magic of honesty.
--- End quote ---
Okay, Im calling major bullshit on that statement. THe seed was perhaps one of the most dishonest places ever conceived of.
--- End quote ---
Greg,
I wasn't refering to the Seed's honesty I was refering to mine.
Although I did run into folks that wouldn't rest until I agreed with them, even when they were wrong, I believe that the ideas and perceptions about myself "I" came to were indeed true. As I have revisited any of the issues I had then, over time they still hold valid and the guys who held my feet to the fire are still appreciated.
As to your poor reception upon returning to the Seed, I'm not surprised. Good or bad, that environment was controlled and protected. Opening themselves up to a "possible" threat wouldn't have been prudent. The fact that they didn't have some way to show appreciation of grads is too bad. Woulda, coulda shoulda...
I never had the urge to go back.
Neil"
--- End quote ---
Okay, I better understand now. Thanks.
GregFL:
Neil...armed and dangerous with phpBB tags.
:grin:
I cleaned them up for you in the last two posts.
GregFL:
--- Quote ---On 2006-01-04 07:32:00, Anonymous
Based on my experience, which was founded on doing things for myself, it's hard to see how the process is blamed for a failure. I have always put the success or failure on the shoulders of the indivdual.
--- End quote ---
I generally think this is true as well, but you are getting into a muddy area here. What is failure, success? These are terms we define individually.
Generally however, holding a gun to your head and pulling the trigger could be categorized as failure, as was done by one kid before group one day. What causes a seed atendee, in the midst of all that "awareness" and "love" to kill himself? What causes a seed grad to stick a needle in his arm in front of his family with a lethal dose of drugs inside?
What drives people to do such things?
There is ample evidence that psychological torment can and does cause these things. There are also stories from the day from pyschologists that were treating kids released from the seed that were suicidal and had feelings of worthlessness. There is a story of a 15 year old girl that ran from the seed in st pete and hid in the woods near her home for a week, to scared to go home..and this after attempting to slit her wrists in the bathroom and then instructed by staff not to tell her parents (honesty?). And then there is the story of a seed grad that got in his car and drove from florida until he was broke and ran out of gas in Illinois because he knew his father was making plans to recommit him to the seed. This kid also choose to take a much harder path that involved other abuses in order not to reendure the Seed, and was scared to even speak to his father again for years. That kid was me, and the seed ripped to shreds my family because I chose to take an intellectual and personal stand against the program dogma after graduating the seed. I am not alone either Neil, many a kid ended up choosing the autonomy of their own mind over the mind-rape of the seed cult, and a huge price was extracted from us kids.
Neil, I am glad you feel the seed gave you a good result. But as Ginger says, there was a price to pay, and that price was paid by the many other kids that felt oppressed, tortured, coerced, scared. The price was paid by kids that weighed the costs and choose to run from their families and ended up a continent away, their family ties forever broken. The price was paid by kids that put guns to their heads, that jumped off bridges, that Overdosed on drugs, that otherwise died suspiciously, by kids that felt lost and rejected and spiraled into depression and mental illness.
This treatment model has shown itself, in all its incarnations from CEDU to the seed, from straight, Inc. to KHK, and from Wasp and other programs, to cause harm to a significant portion of the attendees. While doing this, it also has kids that claim it saved their life.
So again, who pays the price for the saved kids? That is the question being proferred.
GregFL:
--- Quote ---On 2006-01-04 07:32:00, Anonymous wrote:
That is a very difficult field and The Seed certainly wasn't 6 flags over hwy 84 and I'm pretty sure that no kid went there without some sort of problem.
--- End quote ---
Every human every day has "problems". Kids went to the seed for "druggie attitudes", shoplifting, being the little sister or brother of a seedling, being "dry druggies", you name it, they went there,and as young as 9.
But even if a kid had a drug overuse problem, How does this justify turning your 14 year old over to strangers who lock him up, make him admit to being an addict, barely feed him, give him little sleep, and cuss at, scream and belittle him, sit him around people discussing sex and rape, and lock him away with criminals and sexual deviants, among other treatment modalities of the seed?
The seed was controversial for a reason. It was snake oil sold by a snake oil salesman.
Anonymous:
Greg,
Thanks for the insight.
It doesn't seem that my story is of much consequence here. Obviously bad shit happend for folks and that sucks. If I'm fucked up becasue of the Seed, I'd rather not know it at this point. I have many dragons to slay (the photography industry, the Condo owners assoc, the baseball park, the Scout troop and my retirment account) and discovering that The Seed did a bunch of bad shit to a bunch of people and probably me too, doesn't help me now with those dragons.
Sorry you and others had such a bad time and it sounds like maybe still are. I sincerely hope that you have or will find peace with all this.
Neil
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