Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform > The Troubled Teen Industry

Carlbrook

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E Adams:
I did not intend to comment anymore on this board but 2c, maybe I can try and clarify some things. First of all, I am just some guy that happened to have the fortune and/or misfortune (depending?) of attending RMA for 2+ yrs in the early 80's. I obtained a college degree afterwards, but not in anything REMOTELY connected to psychology or counselling. I make my living in finance and in the equity markets which means that I am in absolutely no way qualified to make any kind of even a blind stab at some sort of curriculum design for "troubled kids". I can only tell you what I observed and what I went through, how it affected me, how it influenced friends who went through the same or similar experiences that I've had, and maybe my opinion which people will no doubt disagree with (here for sure).
Second of all, I AM a parent. I have 3 children. And the short answer is No, I would not send my kids to the place I went. I would hope not to have to even consider sending them anywhere. I cannot foresee or imagine a scenario where I would. I hope I am a good enough parent that they won't have the issues I had - with authority, decisions, etc etc etc.
Well, the last 2 questions are quite large ones - and loaded. The quickest way to answer is to group them together and say that in all fairness I did get things out of the program. Most people I know also got tools or benefits out of the program. The problem is that for some people, due to whatever reasons (but valid ones I would say), the process of getting there was too great of a stress and in the end outweighed the benefit. And I think this is true. It was inefficient to put it mildly. The problem is that if a parent was willing to pay, the school was going to take them, regardless! I don't know that but it would be interesting to see how many potential "wealthy" kids were turned down or denied becasue they didn't fit the program. If you could pay, you fit - that is my feeling. I have seen every kind of turnout too, I watched the documentary (some horror stories there for sure), I've seen some people get really messed up after. It CAN be very intense, too intense, particularly if things are taken personally (which happens, legitimately). And the staff were all over the map - some meant well, some were dumb as crap, some were clinically detached, some were Hannah Arendt-described clerks, some legitimately loved the kids and wanted them to improve - but there were some who were just too far overboard or such preening idealogues that they could see nothing but a rose colored picture, and some were in it just for the money or power or whatever. There was also some weird idolization elements of the director, past directors, Mel, J Lennon, etc. It wasn't a science -- not in the hiring process certainly, not in admissions - and that was obvious. And the program wasn't always uniform. And some of the kids, frankly, were ill equipped to deal with the intensity of it all - some of the stuff was probably just wrong. For some it failed miserably, no doubt. This is due to lots of things, to educational counselors, to uneven staff, to lack of common sense on the part of facillitators, to parents in many cases, to a blind faith in some "system", or what have you. On message boards like this it is often oversimplified but many were complicit: How did some 17 yr old kid end up being "blown away" by bearded men or hiding on the side of a mtn in the first place? So no, I certainly wouldn't have done it the way it was done. So how do you give someone the beneficial tools that some kids no doubt DID receive there without shredding up the rest of them in the process - I have no idea. Maybe you can't. If you had 100 people like me no one would have cried, no one would have copped out, no one would have bought into the program at all. So it sounds contradictory: Did I get something out of it? Yes. Do I know other people who did? Yes. Would I send my kids? No way. It's just not worth the risk. If you're naturally skeptical, have a sense of humor and don't get overly swept away by torrents of emotion then the place was no terror camp. Not to say I never felt any anxiety because I did, but I also figured I could handle anything the emotionally shaky guy in my dorm could. If you are not looking at it farther out, perhaps it was terrifying. So I don't really have an answer to that but I can tell you this: 2 weeks ago someone did call me about their daughter, 14, lots of trouble, out of control, etc, and asked for my advice, what I thought about sending her to some "boarding school". My answer was a question: "Does she have an aunt?" That probably sums up how I feel about these places in general. In my PARTICULAR case, I was not traumatized and am actually glad I went. This fact is in NO way an endorsement. I hope that this is at least somewhat clear to some of the more reasonable people on this board. And please, really, I am not in the mood to argue or name calling, and I am STILL not a staff member, I am NOT compensated in ANY way for typing this (not even by aunts), and I've already gotten the picture quite clearly that I MAY be some type of "subjective" moron so.... thanks for all the love in advance. -E

try another castle:

--- Quote ---My answer was a question: "Does she have an aunt?"
--- End quote ---

OMG, I so wish more people would do this, and consider having the kid stay with a relative for a while, like they used to do in the good old days. Even Maia talks about this in her book.

If I had been sent to stay with my aunt and cousins in san diego... shit.. i probably wouldnt be on this board. Simply having my cousins around probably would have calmed me down significantly.

Im not boo-hooing about it. Just thinking about how a change of scenery within the family can do a world of difference, if there is a family member willing to help.

anythinganyone:

--- Quote from: "E Adams" ---If you're naturally skeptical, have a sense of humor and don't get overly swept away by torrents of emotion then the place was no terror camp.
--- End quote ---

Did you consider yourself to have been completely honest (or at least, for the majority) with peers and staff.  Not an accusation, I'm just curious.  I actually concurred with most of this post, and I think some people are better equipped to deal with programs, and I do believe programs can have some benefit (though it depends on the people running it and the staff).  I can remember a particular staff member who was pretty helpful and caring and treated me like a human being.

Anonymous:
Thanks for taking the time and trouble to answer thoughtfully Adams. I guess the reason why I asked about what you would do with a kid who was in your shoes is that a lot of people who go through this system claim something to the effect of "well sure their methods were pretty fucked up or intense but so was my behavior". I am willing to accept this i some cases But this to me reflects very much the idea that a punitive approach is the best way. This approach does not really address the reasons behind the behavior which is why I beg this question.

E Adams:
I appreciate that no one has called me any names yet and appreciate the replies. I've thought about that place and the experience more over the past weekend than I have in the previous 10 yrs and frankly I am surprised I have the opinions that I do.  
The thing about those places is that kids behavior does change THERE - superficially, and almost immediately. You adapt for the sake of survival. But that's not a "cure". Thinking about it and speaking to some friends last night it seems (and this is just and observation and not scientific) that most of the people we knew who "looked good" and got really into the program real fast were the ones who had the toughest time later.  I did the stuff, participated, but I never "bought into" the "program" - if that's sort of clear? Yes, I was honest (meaning I didn't "lie" but I also used discretion in what I would tell), I copped out in propheets, I ran and cried in the I&Me, etc.  But I never flung myself into the deep end like a lot of folks did and I knew it was weird. I knew that sort of stuff wasn't going to happen when I got out. I looked at it like an experience, not as a lifestyle or a philosophy. I think some did. Some tried to fit into that box. I don't know if that's clear but it's hard to explain 2 rather intense years in a paragraph, especially if you type like I do.
There were heroin addicts in my peer group for instance, guys who came cuffed from CYA, mohawks and safety pins and a girl busted out of a drug flop house. They were not doing well before they came. By the end of my stay the kids were getting younger and less "bad".  Some you had to wonder: Why are they HERE?? I mean, it seems pretty obvious to me that you don't need to yell the same things at a 14 yr old cute preppy girl who snuck out of her house in a small town in TX and drank her dad's wine that you would to a 19 yr junkie who had lived on the street. The distinction was occasionally blurred. Lines were crossed, a lack of common sense often prevailed. I had problems with that sort of thing. And the hypocrisy.  You didn't talk about it but you needed to notice it.
One thing I liked about the place was that the "students" were, for the most part, very bright. They were of above avg intelligence, from varied backgrounds - and very interesting.
And about punishment - nothing was "called" punishment except for maybe Wd's and fulltimes. I guess, yes, the bottom line is that I think some people were better equipped to handle it and some weren't. As a kid you could even see that. But the distinction wasn't made, not by staff or admissions. There was never some Eureka moment where someone said: well, you know, maybe mary shouldn't be here?
The big thing was, like a joke in my peergroup, was something the staff would tell us in raps - if we were defiant or rebellious or wanting to leave or whatever it was: "If you leave! You'll be DEAD in 5 YEARS!!"  And the guy next to you, and you can tell, he's thinking: What? For getting kicked out of Country Day School?????
Some of that was absurd. It was just never tempered.  Shotguns to kill fleas.

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