A cult?

[BuzzKill]

I know what I think it means Greg. I have thought about it. I just wondered what you thought - if you had thought about it.

The words do stand on there own. But there are a lot of other words. But basicly, He was just warning that Following Him would be a divisive thing. He is Lord and Savior. He comes first. This can and will cause problems (espically in the latter days) and He was giving warning.

I'm logging off for tonight. I'll see you guys tomorrow.

[GregFL]

On 2005-05-11 19:37:00, Anonymous wrote:

"At first I thought this was a joke.  It's not.   :eek:



http://objective.jesussave.us/kidz.html"

heheheheehe

and I quote:

"If you find an Atheist in your neighborhood,
TELL A PARENT OR PASTOR RIGHT AWAY!

You may be moved to try and witness to
these poor lost souls yourself, however
AVOID TALKING TO THEM!

Atheists are often very grumpy and bitter and will lash out at children or they may even try to trick you into neglecting God's Word."

Don't talk to them Kiddies...they may TELL YOU THE TRUTH about JAAESSUS!!!


oh my, how funny!!!!!

[GregFL]

On 2005-05-11 19:29:00, BuzzKill wrote:

"I know what I think it means Greg. I have thought about it. I just wondered what you thought - if you had thought about it.



The words do stand on there own. But there are a lot of other words. But basicly, He was just warning that Following Him would be a divisive thing. He is Lord and Savior. He comes first. This can and will cause problems (espically in the latter days) and He was giving warning.



I'm logging off for tonight. I'll see you guys tomorrow.



"

BALONEY.

Again, you see thru rose colored glasses...Jesus says FORSAKE your family and you shall get a hundredfold back for your sacrifice, not the other way around. You are reading it and getting out of it the Jesus you want, not the jesus who spoke. Take the bible for its word or dismiss it for what it is but to twist and turn it into something palatable is intellectually bankrupt.

Care to read it again?

And every one that hath forsaken houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my name's sake, shall receive an hundredfold, and shall inherit everlasting life.

He was saying, LEAVE ALL THIS BEHIND AND I WILL REWARD YOU A HUNDRED TIMES YOUR LOSS.

No concern for the wife, the kids, the families of the FORSAKEN....right Buzkill?

Now tell me Buzzkill, how is this Woman friendly, to command men to abandon their wives and children and follow him?

[GregFL]

On 2005-05-11 19:52:00, Anonymous wrote:

"http://objective.jesussave.us/shutdown.html


"

Oh my, that is so funny, and it is funny because they take it serious. "DONT TALK TO ATHEISTS..ALERT YOUR MOM, DAD OR PREACHER!

hehe
 
they might as well say... CALL 0, ask for GOD and have the atheist smited!

hehee

Unreal that this is 2005 and this crap goes on. These unfunny part is these people involve themselves in our government and want to push this crap on the rest of the world.
And that "lamby" character...who boy, maybe they should dismember it and burn it to please god a la animal sacrifice in the old testament? Man, that would be even funnier!

These people that run this website are morons!

[GregFL]

OMG, I just saw "professor Graffenstein"

Talk about dishonest propaganda!!!

Unreal!

[GregFL]

On 2005-05-11 20:12:00, Anonymous wrote:

"you gotta read this...

http://objective.jesussave.us/propaganda.html



You'll alternate between rage, incredulation hysterical laughter. :flame:  :rofl:  :rofl:  :rofl: "

Yes, Evolution is unscientific...better we believe the "science" of talking snakes, angels raping women and creating a race of giants, boats with two of all kinds of animals on them, magical people rising from the dead,people created from clay and ribs,light created before the sun, Adam the first man naming all the animals in the world,animal sacrifice to please god,  and a god that murders and orders the rape and destruction of innocent women and children...among hundreds of more absurdities.

Yep, that science sure is evil....and that bible...SCIENTIFIC BEYOND CRITICISM!!!!!


Tell me someone, what does it take to buy into this mindset?

[GregFL]

On 2005-05-11 19:56:00, Anonymous wrote:

"from the quiz..



Kid:  Proffesor, what are fossils and where did they come from?



Answer:  fossils are the buried remains of the wicked men and animals that perished 4000 years ago in that flood.







 ::bigsmilebounce::

Anyone ever stop to think that any substantial flood leaves a sediment deposit that is readable in the strata, and that a worldwide flood would leave massive evidence in the sediment layer all over the world, and that NONE EXISTS?

Hell, even major ancient comet impacts can be read in the worldwide strata layer...where is the flood evidence in the  strata? Creation science Answer... misappropriate the fossil record and claim it as evidence of the flood. Conjur up superduper supernatural explanations for where all the water went.

  If ever there was a modern day misnomer, it is "creation science" That is like saying "supernatural mathematics".


Science 101 people. YOU CANNOT START WITH A FOREGONE CONCLUSION AND GO LOOKING FOR EVIDENCE, DISMISSING OR REDEFINING ANYTHING THAT TENDS TO LEAD AWAY FROM YOUR FOREGONE CONCLUSION. IT NO LONGER IS SCIENCE, IT IS DOGMA. THIS IS WHY SCIENTIFIC THEORIES ARE CALLED THEORIES, TO GIVE ROOM FOR NEW INFORMATION TO CHANGE, MODIFY OR CORRECT THE CONCLUSION. THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS "CREATION SCIENCE", IT IS RELIGION DRESSED UP LIKE SCIENCE , A DRAG QUEEN IF YOU WILL, PRETENDING TO BE SCIENCE. Take this knowledge and use it to think.  Class dismissed.

Now, it is nothing new, this "creation science" fraud. Hell, back in the dark and middle ages if a scientist even whispered things such as "the stars don't seem to be revolving around the earth" or "I think the earth may be round" the HCIC (head christians in charge  ie; the catholic church) would torture him as an infidel and he would die a excrutiating death.  "creation science" is the modern day version of this time honored christian tradition of squelching the voice of science.

Why? Because the bible stories fail in the light of real science. There was no flood, the earth isn't 6000 years old,snakes donkeys and bushes can't talk, people don't raise from the dead, and an omniscient god doesn't need to create beings for the sole purpose of "glorifying" him. Omniscient beings don't get mad, don't have ego "issues", dont' seek vengence and don't kill and maim, rape and plunder, and don't get pleased from burning animal flesh.

Further, god killing himself on the cross and then rising for eternity  in perfect heaven..get this....IS NOT REALLY A SACRIFICE, now is it?  A real sacrifice is having your babies dashed against rocks and then your head shaved, nails cut  and then raped by a middle eastern ancient hebrew man that hasn't bathed in a month, all with god's blessing.

This is just unreal that a book written by a bunch of barely literate people that condradicts itself on almost every page and is ultraviolent, cruel, misogynic, and advocating slavery could be taken as the literal word of supernatural god thousands of years later, and also attemped to be used to discredit good science.

Believe in God all you want, but when you march these books out, the Koran, the bible, etc...be ready for people to actually read them and think about what was written, not try to conform the words to a modern day society.


They are not nice books, they are not Loving and full of grace. In the inverse, they are the books that have for the last several thousand years, marched people off to kill and enslave people. Today, as we speak, people are dying thruout the world in the name of "pick you favorite god". Jews vs palestinians, American christians vs middle eastern fundies....and on and on and on.  It never stops until and unless we move past this ancient, bloody, rediculous unsupportable supernatural  world view.

End of rant.

[GregFL]

:tup:

[Deborah]

Most excellent rant Greg!!!

[GregFL]

On 2005-05-06 06:26:00, Anonymous wrote:

"The authority comes from fact.  God fulfilled no fewer than twenty nine specific prophecies spoken at least five hundred years earlier about him, all in one day!  



He will be betrayed by a friend  Psalm 41:9/Matthew 26:49



The price of his betrayal will be thirty pieces of silver  Zechariah 11:12/Matthew 26:15



His betrayal money will be cast to the floor of God's temple  Zechariah 11:14/ Matthew 27:5



These are only 3, but if you want more I'll type more.  

Sure, give us more, because these three are all a product of backward looking wishfull thinking.

Suppose I, for example, stubbed my toe today. In my delusion state I believe I, the modern day son of god, have my events and experiences forecast in the bible and I flip thru furiously until I find a passage "and on this day, his toeth was stubbith"

Viola, A prophecy! Never mind the bible doesn't say, in the year of 2005, gregfl, a brilliant (ha) survivor of an abusive rehab,will stubbith his toeth... So sayeth the lord. Hell, it says stubbith toeth and it happened!! It isn't important that it happened to another guy in a battle 2000 years ago, it is now a prophecy! This is the mindset of those of you that have such weak faith in your own story you must search for connections that are not there.

This is what you and the other dishonest bible thumpers are doing. We must dismiss New testament Prophecy about Jesus on intellectual grounds because it was written after his death, and a prophecy written after it happens, well, is not a prophecy at all, is it?

That leaves us with old testament propecies as they relate to Jesus.  Lets explore your old testament references...

you claim "he will be betrayed by a friend and cite Psalm 41.  Great. We must assume you are talking about Jesus, but this passage is old testament PAUL talking about his personal life and asking god to take care of it for him.. This is intellectually dishonest wishfull thinking, backward looking frantic searching.

Prophecy is forward looking...IE: if it said And Judas will betray the Virgin born son of God in 200 years, now we would be onto something.  READ YOUR BIBLE IN CONTEXT because this entire passage has NOTHING to do with Jesus.

Next, you say "his" price of betrayal will be 30 pieces of silver and cite Zechariah 11:12. Again we assume you are talking about Jesus but in this passage we  now we found you have JUMPED TO YET ANOTHER GUY , they are not talking about JESUS and The betray by JUDAS at all, but instead are talking about what was occuring to Lebanon ,and relating a personal experience by and  as told by Zechariah, a 'prophet' in the bible. To wit:

And it was broken in that day: and so the poor of the flock that waited upon me knew that it was the word of the LORD.

And I said unto them, If ye think good, give me my price; and if not, forbear. So they weighed for my price thirty pieces of silver.

And the LORD said unto me, Cast it unto the potter: a goodly price that I was prised at of them. And I took the thirty pieces of silver, and cast them to the potter in the house of the LORD.

Now, this is the 'prophet' Zechariah describing an event that happened to him. No mention of the future, but of an event occuring then and now. Then later we have new testament writers adopting this story as a prophecy, but This was not "and Judas will throw thirty coins on the floor of a temple" this was "I gave the potter at the temple 30 coins because god told me to".


Prophecy? with a bunch of creative writing and wishfull thinking..er...whatever.

Your third example is really just the second one again.

Your prophecy is just creative backward looking, and not only are you and modern day christians guilty as hell of doing this, so were the new testament writers.


Buzzkill, here is what I recommend you stop doing. Stop taking christian websites and speaker verbatim because....THEY ARE DISHONEST AS FUCK.

IF someone says ...X is a prophecy fortelling Greg Stubbing his toe in the bible. Go to the passage. Figure out who is talking about what. If indeed you find one "prophecy" that is clear and concise, indisputable and not "backward looking"..well, you may amaze even yourself.
You certainly would amaze me.


Bible prophecy is another intellectually dishonest lie told by people with an agenda.

[GregFL]

By the way,in case you ever wondered how "psychics" and "faith Healers" work, this is one of the tricks of the trade.

They put out non specific information and let others fine tune it for them.

The psychic like John Edwards may say " I sense a presence, a male presence, has anyone had a father die, starting with a B. IF no response is had, the get even more broad... How bout a son, an uncle, a close friend?  Still no answer from the credulous...the dip further, maybe this was a child, a distant friend that use to be close? They keep ignoring their misses until they get a hit...

Dipshit Debbie pipes up, My Cousin Bruce Died in a car accident 3 years ago, and our physic says "YES, this is what I see"! He then fine tunes his "prediction" to match the reactions of his willing participant.

If he was a real psychic he would say, with a degree of accuracy, "your brother bruce is going to die tomorrow" but no, we don't hear that.

See the difference?

Lets talk about Faith Healers for a second, because they are GUILTY AS FUCK as well. A common ploy, among many ploys of these guys, is calling out non-specific healings.  "Someone right now is being healed of Sugar diabetes..please come forward".  Bullheaded Bettie Jumps up on stage, proclaims she is better and attributes it to this statement. Now that she is hooked, he makes her jump thru all the signs, dancing, fainting, etc. Another willing participant in a passion play of self fraud. A real Healer would make a finger or thumb grow back, and arm or leg, heal a real sick person. Same trick used but with a slight modification.

You Bible prophecy people use this same self- deluding mind trick, but you USE IT ON YOURSELVES and you are even worse because you take SPECIFIC EVENTS and twist them and ignore the context they were written in to convince yourselves of a supernatural occurance where none exists.

Now a real "prophecy wouldnt pussy foot around. It would name dates and times, people and events. You just don't see this in the bible, you only see vague backward viewing references, text taken out of context and ignored.


BULLSHIT X 10.

[GregFL]

Hey, are those David Letterman Top ten signs?

That is funny as hell, because it makes so much sense!

Thanks for posting that.

[Nihilanthic]

:rofl:  :rofl:  :rofl:

Ok, I think its time we went back to taking on programs and program parents instead of people who are on our side, isn't it?  

Still, nice little flamewar!

Those who beat their swords into plowshares will plow for those who don't.
-- Anonymous

[Anonymous]

This thread is a waste of time. It's fairly entertaining to read the debate and all... but seriously- nobody is changing anyone's mind here.

[GregFL]

Debate? HA! There is no debate here. The christians always claim special pleading when it comes down to an actual factual debate, because their bible is unsupportable by reason, logic, and common sense.


The point of the thread was never debate. The point was to belittle all mormons by claiming one religion the superdaddy supernatural while the other one a cult.

The later entries were a parody of this dangerous mindset that leads people now and thruout history to killing each other in the name of the lord. It is absolutely hysterical to watch someone belittle other people while professing belief in things like the genesis story. COM'N!

Amen. Now go and please god by dismembering and burning a bull on the alter. Be sure to first seperate the fat off the kidneys, or you may be Smoted!