Author Topic: Redcliffer  (Read 65088 times)

0 Members and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
Redcliffer
« Reply #120 on: October 04, 2005, 06:42:00 PM »
LOOK AT THEIR CRAP?

LMAO ... that's program talk, you idiot parent!

SUCKER!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Deborah

  • Posts: 5383
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Redcliffer
« Reply #121 on: October 04, 2005, 06:45:00 PM »
Well, at this particular program they might have the opportunity to literally look at their crap or someone elses. Did you see or hear of the Phantom Duker scene??
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
gt;>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Hidden Lake Academy, after operating 12 years unlicensed will now be monitored by the state. Access information on the Federal Class Action lawsuit against HLA here: http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=17700

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
Redcliffer
« Reply #122 on: October 04, 2005, 07:33:00 PM »
Why is it that you feel like the kids bear no responsibility for being there in the first place?

My son had the opportunity to do outpatient rehab, therapy as well as NA -- problem is he was never sober long enough to get any benefit.

This is the first time he has been sober in two years.  I know WC does not cure anything -- it is a wake up call for the kid that there are consequences for their actions and that there are places and people who will not put up with their behavior.

I am not a "rogram parent" I don't "drink the kool-aid" -- I am a parent who has tried everything and had a child who knew that in the State of California - nothing was going to happen to him.

Like when he was mad at his sister so he bashed in the side of her new car -- police did nothing.

Like when he trew a phone across a classroom and injured a teacher sending her to the emergency room - police did nothing.

Like when we caught him in our home smoking weed - police did nothing.

Like when he trashed his room smashing everything and punching holes in the walls -- police did nothing...

Like when he started stealing from the neighbors and dealing to get his drugs -- Police did nothing

But ya know when he took a swing at the Redcliff staff member he had a take down and funny thing is he has not tried that again... hummm ... wonder why?

Walk a mile in my shoes and then you can judge me --

Again I ask -- what would you do?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
Redcliffer
« Reply #123 on: October 04, 2005, 08:04:00 PM »
Sounds like the police did about as much as you did. Although I find it hard to believe that he hurt a teacher and they did nothing. There are children in first grade being handcuffed and taken out of school by police officers, and they harmed no one.
Short of any humane response which is apparently not on your radar.... Ever think of hiring a big burly guy or a relative to knock him down a couple of notches?
Ya know, that's how many traditional cultures dealt with wife/child abusers. I think we should go back to that technique and leave the police to write traffic tickets.
Does your son have a father?
What did he do?
Has your son paid restitution to those he caused damages?
Or was his trip to wilderness his 'unrelated' punishment?
How was your son 'taken down'?
What restraint was used?
How many times?
What were they saying to your son when they had him pinned on the ground?
How long was he pinned?
Why do YOU think your son was so angry?
Did you ever ask? Genuinely, not sarcasticly.
A few round in the ring every now and then with someone a tad bit bigger might have had a similar effect.
Many HAVE walked a mile in your shoes, and chose not to bale. It's your choice to perceive that, and other comments, as judgment.... or not.
You were desperate when your son was showing you his level of distress, now you're desperate to convince others of how justified and helpless you were.  ::boohoo::
Does life ever get easy for desperate, struggling parents? Or are you always the victim of someone?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
Redcliffer
« Reply #124 on: October 04, 2005, 08:55:00 PM »
Quote
Why is it that you feel like the kids bear no responsibility for being there in the first place?

Did your son pick up the phone and call TEEN HELP, aka WWASP? I doubt it.

Quote
Again I ask -- what would you do?


I would have done a GOOGLE at the very least and found the hundreds, if not thousands of abuse accounts written by former prisoners and their parents.

If I HAD made the mistake of sending my kid to a program and I started realizing it, I wouldn't go into denial as most parents do. I'd pull them out immediately, apologize profusely and hope they don't shun me for the remainder of their life.

That's what I'd do...
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
Redcliffer
« Reply #125 on: October 04, 2005, 08:58:00 PM »
Quote
On 2005-10-04 16:33:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Why is it that you feel like the kids bear no responsibility for being there in the first place?



My son had the opportunity to do outpatient rehab, therapy as well as NA -- problem is he was never sober long enough to get any benefit.



This is the first time he has been sober in two years.  I know WC does not cure anything -- it is a wake up call for the kid that there are consequences for their actions and that there are places and people who will not put up with their behavior.



I am not a "rogram parent" I don't "drink the kool-aid" -- I am a parent who has tried everything and had a child who knew that in the State of California - nothing was going to happen to him.



Like when he was mad at his sister so he bashed in the side of her new car -- police did nothing.



Like when he trew a phone across a classroom and injured a teacher sending her to the emergency room - police did nothing.



Like when we caught him in our home smoking weed - police did nothing.



Like when he trashed his room smashing everything and punching holes in the walls -- police did nothing...



Like when he started stealing from the neighbors and dealing to get his drugs -- Police did nothing



But ya know when he took a swing at the Redcliff staff member he had a take down and funny thing is he has not tried that again... hummm ... wonder why?



Walk a mile in my shoes and then you can judge me --



Again I ask -- what would you do?







"


Sounds like it is YOU who is not taking responsibility. BE A PARENT! You expect everyone else to take control and punish your son for you. The police didn't do it, so you had to pay someone else to do it. Pathetic!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
Redcliffer
« Reply #126 on: October 05, 2005, 06:30:00 AM »
Quote
On 2005-10-04 15:07:00, Anonymous wrote:

"I appreciated the 60 minute clip that was posted.  I viewed the clip prior to sending my son to Red Cliff and it really helped me to not be shocked when he had to be restrained within 20 minutes of being there because he didn't want to do the strip search...


How would you feel about being strip searched? Is this really necessary, or is it just a good way to humiliate and intimidate a teenager?

Quote
We had given him every therapy possible.  Went to parenting class ourselves and lived through years of terror and torment.

It was only after I tossed the parenting books and told the therapists what idiots they were, that I was able to turn my own kid around. I know my kid better than they do. In my case, positive reinforcement worked better than any form of punishment.

Quote
So what if he is a little uncomfortable.  Actually his letters indicate that he likes it there and is learning a lot of great things.

Bow drilling looks great on a resume. What else is he learning? I suspect he is learning a great deal about the nature of power and coercion.

Quote
What do kids expect will happen to them if they defy their parents?



Nothing -- that is the problem


That was YOUR problem. When my kid breaks a rule, things happen. Not 'nothing.' Define defiance. I respect my kid's right to disagree. The rules are still enforced.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
Redcliffer
« Reply #127 on: October 05, 2005, 02:32:00 PM »
In one sense you are all right....

I as a parent rescued my son, made excuses for my son, spent hours with him in home school when he would get suspended.  Spent hours talking to him about what was going on in his life. Took him to countless Dr's... What I thought was helping him may have been destroying him.

I am not a lazy parent...If anything I am over involved.

But how exactly do you control a 6'1" 190 LB boy who is high and is telling you to fuck off?? How do you take away something from a kid who is almost 17 and has nothing left to take away? No car, No phone, No computer, No video games, etc...

I really don't think spanking someone who is almost as big as his father (yes he has one and we have been married for over 25 years) is practical.  

This is a kid who was expelled from school (hurting the teacher)they didn't arrest him because he didn't mean to do it ... the teacher got in the way of the phone (that is Carlifornia for you).

I know he didn't get to that place overnight and believe me neither did I.

I just think you should not lump all of the programs into the same lot as the infamous ones that anyone with half a brain and the sligest effort can see are abusive...

Redcliff restrained him once because he swung at the intake coordinator who caught his punch mid air and took him down untill he stopped shouting at them and cursing at them it was all

I did not send him to a WWASP program and I googled and read every place I could find including your site to find negative things about RedCliff.  In fact the only reason I even posted here is because I think your site has a great value --

I ruled out several programs especially anything that had anything to do with WWASP or Teen Help or any other organization the refers parents mostly because of this and other sites.

I checked Redcliff them out with the state licening commission... contrary to what you may think they will give negative as well as positive information.  I had one person tell me not to send him to a particular program in Utah..

As far as the comment "how would I like it if..."
I would not have put myself in that position in the first place.  It was not like it was a surprise to him.

What I am in all sincerity asking you is what could your parents have done differently to help you? Thus the question... What was I supposed to do...

What finally did help you? If you want to be helpful and not hateful then reply -- if not then I won't post again - rather chalk this up to a bunch of angry people who enjoy confrontation without offering any real suggestions to those who do seek you out and give you feedback.

I would be interested in anyone who has had personal experience with RedCliff specifically --

Thanks!
Jackie
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline AtomicAnt

  • Posts: 552
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Redcliffer
« Reply #128 on: October 05, 2005, 11:46:00 PM »
Quote
On 2005-10-05 11:32:00, Anonymous wrote:

"In one sense you are all right....



I as a parent rescued my son, made excuses for my son, spent hours with him in home school when he would get suspended.  Spent hours talking to him about what was going on in his life. Took him to countless Dr's... What I thought was helping him may have been destroying him.



I am not a lazy parent...If anything I am over involved.



But how exactly do you control a 6'1" 190 LB boy who is high and is telling you to fuck off?? How do you take away something from a kid who is almost 17 and has nothing left to take away? No car, No phone, No computer, No video games, etc...



I really don't think spanking someone who is almost as big as his father (yes he has one and we have been married for over 25 years) is practical.  



This is a kid who was expelled from school (hurting the teacher)they didn't arrest him because he didn't mean to do it ... the teacher got in the way of the phone (that is California for you).



I know he didn't get to that place overnight and believe me neither did I.



I just think you should not lump all of the programs into the same lot as the infamous ones that anyone with half a brain and the sligest effort can see are abusive...



Redcliff restrained him once because he swung at the intake coordinator who caught his punch mid air and took him down until he stopped shouting at them and cursing at them it was all



I did not send him to a WWASP program and I googled and read every place I could find including your site to find negative things about RedCliff.  In fact the only reason I even posted here is because I think your site has a great value --



I ruled out several programs especially anything that had anything to do with WWASP or Teen Help or any other organization the refers parents mostly because of this and other sites.



I checked Redcliff them out with the state licening commission... contrary to what you may think they will give negative as well as positive information.  I had one person tell me not to send him to a particular program in Utah..



As far as the comment "how would I like it if..."

I would not have put myself in that position in the first place.  It was not like it was a surprise to him.



What I am in all sincerity asking you is what could your parents have done differently to help you? Thus the question... What was I supposed to do...



What finally did help you? If you want to be helpful and not hateful then reply -- if not then I won't post again - rather chalk this up to a bunch of angry people who enjoy confrontation without offering any real suggestions to those who do seek you out and give you feedback.



I would be interested in anyone who has had personal experience with RedCliff specifically --



Thanks!

Jackie



"


I was thinking. I do that sometimes. It was the tone of your initial post that put me off. It was almost as if you delighted in seeing your son restrained and strip searched. You said, "So what if he is a little uncomfortable" That it makes it sound as if you are enjoying his having to go through a punitive experience. The post was inflammatory. It is clear you feel a great deal of anger towards him.

I am sorry that you and your son are having such severe difficulties. I would urge caution when sending a drug user into a wilderness program. They are not a drug rehabilitation program. If your son is addicted to heroin or something like it, the withdrawal can be fatal if not properly handled.

I don't know what I would do if I were in your shoes. I just don't like the methods these programs use. I don't believe for a minute that the tough part of tough love has any benefit at all. I was a troubled teen. My sister was too. I have a great deal of empathy for the kids in these positions. No one chooses to be the bad guy. I know that feeling one has when is being forced to do something that he feels if completely unfair. They would have had to restrain me, too. It isn't a nice feeling. It also isn't helpful, it only builds a sense of anger and powerlessness.

I also object to the idea of forced behavior modification (mind control, brainwashing). To me, forcing a mind set onto someone is always just wrong; regardless of context. At some point I have to say it is his decision to be this way regardless of the outcome and no amount of bad behavior warrants the kind of intervention these programs entail. Not even to (theoretically) save the kid's life. A parent can only do so much. The rest is up to the teenager. There are lines even a parent cannot cross.
 
I don't have a teen, yet. My boy is only eight. We have already had our troubles with him. He began being violent at age two and three. His behavior became extreme when we divorced. He was expelled from a dozen day care situations. We took parenting classes, read the books and involved therapists. Two CSTs were performed. They all gave us programs that called for discipline, structure, and consistency. They wanted us to send him to a special school (we did not). Everything we did made our boy worse. At some point, something inside me clicked. My son was exactly like I was. Then I had my chance. My ex moved into another state temporarily and our son stayed with me full time. I took to flooding him with attention; hugs, praise, playing with him, talking to him. I did away with ALL punishment. I endured his tantrums and his anger and his violence. Of course, at 6 years old, he could hit and kick me and not really do damage. It worked. His rage and anger just seemed to fade away and we became very close to each other. He became very approval seeking. It only took a few weeks before the school principal phoned and told me what a great job I was doing and how he seemed like a completely different kid. Discipline was there. I gave him jobs. By the time his Mom came back, he was in charge of breakfast, the trash, and clearing the evening dishes and he took these responsibilities seriously. He was proud to point out to me how well he did them. I never had to make him or force him to do anything. He went through all of second grade with As and Bs and no reports of violence. I hope and pray I do as well when he is a teenager.

 The moral of the story for me is that if you treat someone with love and respect, they will return love and respect.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
Redcliffer
« Reply #129 on: October 06, 2005, 02:16:00 AM »
Quote
On 2005-10-04 16:33:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Why is it that you feel like the kids bear no responsibility for being there in the first place?



My son had the opportunity to do outpatient rehab, therapy as well as NA -- problem is he was never sober long enough to get any benefit.



This is the first time he has been sober in two years.  I know WC does not cure anything -- it is a wake up call for the kid that there are consequences for their actions and that there are places and people who will not put up with their behavior.



I am not a "rogram parent" I don't "drink the kool-aid" -- I am a parent who has tried everything and had a child who knew that in the State of California - nothing was going to happen to him.



Like when he was mad at his sister so he bashed in the side of her new car -- police did nothing.



Like when he trew a phone across a classroom and injured a teacher sending her to the emergency room - police did nothing.



Like when we caught him in our home smoking weed - police did nothing.



Like when he trashed his room smashing everything and punching holes in the walls -- police did nothing...



Like when he started stealing from the neighbors and dealing to get his drugs -- Police did nothing



But ya know when he took a swing at the Redcliff staff member he had a take down and funny thing is he has not tried that again... hummm ... wonder why?



Walk a mile in my shoes and then you can judge me --



Again I ask -- what would you do?







"


Man, where do you trolls come up with these scripts?  Try some originality, please, we have heard this lames-ass-excuse so many times I have lost count.

 :smokin:
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
Redcliffer
« Reply #130 on: October 07, 2005, 08:27:00 PM »
Atomic Ant --

Thank you for the time and the thought you put into your post.  You are right the initial tone on my part didn't translate very well on the internet and I guess I am pretty angry and no, I didn't want the restraint to happen to him but at least I knew it was a possibility.

His drug problems were marijuana to quote him directly "I smoked all day every day" and drinking "everything he get his hands on".  He tried cocaine and meth and crack....

Where was I :???:  

You are wise to trust yourself enough to take matters into your own hands as quickly as you did and trust your instincts when he was small.

Thanks again for the feedback rather than calling me names -- maybe the reason that us "trolls" have familiar sounding "scripts" is because there are a lot of hurting kids and parents out there with no where to turn.

Thanks Again for your insight.  That is what people need to hear in a free exchange of ideas..

Jackie
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
Redcliffer
« Reply #131 on: October 07, 2005, 09:01:00 PM »
Quote
I did not send him to a WWASP program and I googled and read every place I could find including your site to find negative things about RedCliff. In fact the only reason I even posted here is because I think your site has a great value --

I ruled out several programs especially anything that had anything to do with WWASP or Teen Help or any other organization the refers parents mostly because of this and other sites.


Well, that's good to hear.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Notafriendofredcliff

  • Posts: 23
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Redcliffer
« Reply #132 on: November 26, 2005, 02:08:00 PM »
I haven't posted in a long time.  There was so much going on, and we had no luck removing my stepson from Redcliff by legal means.  His mother's permission, and the permission of her 3rd ex-husband (representing himself as the boy's father), along with approximately $31,000 (including the cost of his abduction) was sufficient reason for Redcliff to keep him as long as possible, against my husband's wishes.

FINALLY he did graduate.  It took 80 long days. We went to Utah and attended the parent's seminar.  Trust me, nobody wants to go through that.  It was ongoing hours of listening to Dr. Dan drone on about things that had absolutely no relevance.  I went because I expected them to tell us what to expect, and about aftercare.  Nope, it was just Dr. Dan enjoying hearing himself speak.  People were nodding off.  The boy had his FIRST SHOWER IN 80 DAYS.  It took about 3 weeks to finally chisel all the filth off him.  It's a wonder they didn't all have lice.

Fortunately, one good thing came out of this long saga.  The boy revealed enough about his home life to his therapist there that we were able to gain custody of him.  

We objected to him being sent to Redcliff because it was done without my husband's knowledge or consent, and against the advice of the boy's evaluating psychologist, who said it could be counterproductive.  It was established that all he needed was some regular local counseling to deal with anger issues (and now we know...boy, did he ever have reason to be angry!) and a more stable home environment.  For that, he was abducted by strangers and taken to Utah.  We had never had any problems with him other than him being quite spoiled, and having a sense of entitlement.  

That has sure changed.  We brought him home from Utah, and it has been chaos ever since.  The experience has nearly ruined him.  Of course, he had to enter high school late, so he will likely end up in summer school to attempt to catch up.  But he likes his new school.  Other than that, he hates everything.  He resents having rules to follow (very REASONABLE rules, I might add) and he has blatantly lied to us more times than I can count.  He has gotten into trouble, and he refuses to accept that he is grounded as a consequence of his actions.  Every day is a constant battle.  We've tried to talk to him about the merits of being honest and trustworthy, and he just says that's a bunch of crap, and he doesn't care if he's trustworthy, and why would anybody spend any time thinking about trust?  He is extremely disrespectful and cruel.  He says he is not going to respect the rules, that he shouldn't HAVE any rules, etc.  We read some of his written therapy assignments, in which he says how important trust & truth are, and how he wants to be a better person.  He now admits, he learned to play the Redcliff Game, and knew what was expected of him to make him worthy of graduating.  All the kids learn the game.  He just took longer than average.

Redcliff was advised within a few days of accepting him into their program, that his psychologist warned this was not right for him. They were given a copy of his evaluation.  I told him in a letter that the psychologist said he shouldn't be there, and we were trying to get him out.  Because I did that, I was banned from writing to him.  Now he says his Redcliff therapist told him a different story.  She allegedly told the boy she spoke to his psychologist, and she read the evaluation, and she stressed that he DID say he needed to be there.  We contacted the psychologist and he said he never heard from anyone from Redcliff.  Because he has done nothing but lie since he arrived, I wouldn't be inclined to believe him, but he volunteered the information.  And the therapist had lied to us on at least one occasion that we know of, so who knows what the truth is.

Regardless, I would say to any parent who is considering Redcliff:  Don't buy into the advertising.  Keep in mind that the success statistics they quote on their website were compiled by people who are (directly or indirectly) affiliated with Redcliff (one is actually on their board of directors). Do your research.  It DOES NOT WORK.  In our case, they knowingly accepted a kid who didn't need it, accepted him under false pretenses, refused to allow his father to withdraw him, and turned him into a frighteningly angry young man.  We sleep with our wallets and car keys.  His mother turned her relatively normal son over to Redcliff. He had some very justified anger issues over his home life. She expected them to fix him, when she was the one who needed fixing. After 80 days, we returned home with an extremely angry, unmotivated, sarcastic and cruel young man.  Redcliff is nothing more than a lucrative business, operating at the expense of children and their families, and a feeder program to get kids into even more lucrative boarding schools.  They should be ashamed of themselves.  They feed off the desperation of parents, promising to repair their broken children, and teach them responsibility, accountability, and integrity.  I mentioned integrity the other day, and he said "What is that?".  When I explained, he dismissed it as something he had no interest in. So what DID he learn at Redcliff?  He learned how to build a fire without matches, and he learned how to use a knife.

Even though we told Redcliff that nobody in the family could afford to send him to boarding school....it was NOT an option, they continued to provide him with brochures, and even the field staff told him to keep pressing his parents to let him go on to boarding school (I have the field staff's journal notes to prove it).  That's where the big money is, so they try to lure the kids on board.  The kids don't know any better.  They don't understand it's all a big money making scheme.

So, overall it was one big disaster.  He has been set behind in school, his attitude is frightening, and we have a LONG road ahead of us.  Every day is a new challenge, or a repeat of an old challenge.  Nobody from Redcliff has called to ask how he's doing.  They don't want to know.  They took a good kid and created a monster.  They are still counting the cash.  And we are trying to save a kid they destroyed.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
Redcliffer
« Reply #133 on: November 26, 2005, 07:49:00 PM »
I'm sure all the behavior you are seeing from your stepson is exactly how he was acting at his mother's house. It is not a result of his time at Redcliff. I don't know anything about Redcliff, but the boy you are describing is a troubled teen who needs more therapy than you can provide with him living in your home. You will not be able to live long being held hostage by this boy. You can continue to blame it on the ex-wife and on Redcliff, but the bottom line is that the boy has serious issues and you attempting to set limits is not going to work.  Good luck.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Notafriendofredcliff

  • Posts: 23
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Redcliffer
« Reply #134 on: November 26, 2005, 10:36:00 PM »
I'm baffled.  We hadn't experienced this kind of behavior from him in the past.  He underwent an independent and thorough psych evaluation (prior to Redcliff) which determined he was a normal teenager with some valid anger issues.  We now have him in regular ongoing therapy, and I imagine we will for a long time.  

Maybe Redcliff has more success with a child who is deeply troubled, on drugs, etc.  But it was obviously overkill in his situation.  They KNEW his problems didn't warrant his placement there.  It WAS, as the psychologist warned (and Redcliff IGNORED), counterproductive.  

He went in relatively normal and came out a mess.     Magic Wilderness Therapy.  You say you know nothing about Redcliff.  I'm happy to educate you. Basically a child is dropped off there, or the parents arrange for an abduction, the child arrives, is strip searched, blindfolded while being driven to a remote location, and required to hike in the desert all day. They have a weekly session with the therapist in the field.  80 days of living in the desert, eating oats and lentils, isolated from family and friends.  The result is not surprising.  Maybe that's why so many of the kids go on to boarding school.  It's conceivable Redcliff exacerbates their problems, leaving them ill-prepared to return home.

Attempting to set limits is not going to work?  What would you recommend then? No limits?  Isn't that a bit irresponsible?

Thanks for the commentary, but all you said is that the blame doesn't belong with his mother and/or Redcliff (and you can say that knowing NOTHING about Redcliff, which is pretty amazing), and that we will not be able to meet his needs while he lives in our home.  I assume you are suggesting he needs an out-of-the-home placement (which he has just experienced for 80 days, much to his detriment).  We are dedicated to helping him in a loving family/home environment.  We knew it wouldn't be easy, but we weren't prepared for the person he had become while at Redcliff.  

I wasn't really seeking advice, I just wanted to finish the story for the helpful people who had been following it, now that I have solid knowledge of their methods and results.  Our experience with Redcliff was nothing short of disastrous.  Others may have different opinions / experiences.  I'd be happy to hear from any of them, and I hope they will post on this forum.  The more accurate information parents can access, the better decisions thay can make for their children.  Too many are only reading the propaganda.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »