Peninsula Village

[Anonymous]

ok this is math and I like books and history so please forgive me,
but my calculator says that if there are 75,000,000. people under the age of 24 and 5000 kill themselves in a year then people under the age of 24 have a suicide rate of .00006666%
I wonder how high PV's rate is

[TheWho]

I think you would need to determine how many of the 75,000,000 people fit the category of “at riskâ€

[Anonymous]

I think you would need to determine how many of the 75,000,000 people fit the category of “at riskâ€

[TheWho]

I think you would need to determine how many of the 75,000,000 people fit the category of “at riskâ€

[Anonymous]

Exactly, very good point, some were "at risk" and maybe some were not "At Risk".  We would have to satisfy this unknown (80/20, 90/10 for example) and then compare subsets of equal mixes so we can compare equal cross sections of both PV and Non PV kids.  Then try to determine if the kids who comitted suicide were part of the "At Risk" population or the not "At risk" population... then compare the results to kids who never attended PV to see which is higher.

This would be great information if we could get it.

We can't because places like PV won't allow it.  They wouldn't dare submit themselves to peer reviewed, long term, clinical studies.  They wouldn't allow an independent audit to find out how many kids were actually diagnosed by independent, qualified medical professionals to be in need of placement outside the home.  They know they'd be run out of town on a rail.

[TheWho]

Exactly, very good point, some were "at risk" and maybe some were not "At Risk".  We would have to satisfy this unknown (80/20, 90/10 for example) and then compare subsets of equal mixes so we can compare equal cross sections of both PV and Non PV kids.  Then try to determine if the kids who comitted suicide were part of the "At Risk" population or the not "At risk" population... then compare the results to kids who never attended PV to see which is higher.

This would be great information if we could get it.

We can't because places like PV won't allow it.  They wouldn't dare submit themselves to peer reviewed, long term, clinical studies.  They wouldn't allow an independent audit to find out how many kids were actually diagnosed by independent, qualified medical professionals to be in need of placement outside the home.  They know they'd be run out of town on a rail.

Kind of figured, there isn’t much data out there that is organized and controlled.



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[Anonymous]

Exactly, very good point, some were "at risk" and maybe some were not "At Risk".  We would have to satisfy this unknown (80/20, 90/10 for example) and then compare subsets of equal mixes so we can compare equal cross sections of both PV and Non PV kids.  Then try to determine if the kids who comitted suicide were part of the "At Risk" population or the not "At risk" population... then compare the results to kids who never attended PV to see which is higher.

This would be great information if we could get it.

We can't because places like PV won't allow it.  They wouldn't dare submit themselves to peer reviewed, long term, clinical studies.  They wouldn't allow an independent audit to find out how many kids were actually diagnosed by independent, qualified medical professionals to be in need of placement outside the home.  They know they'd be run out of town on a rail.

Kind of figured, there isn’t much data out there that is organized and controlled.



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Yeah, there's a reason for that.  The facilities won't allow it because they know they'd be blown out of the water.

[TheWho]

Yeah, there's a reason for that. The facilities won't allow it because they know they'd be blown out of the water.

Well, I am not so sure that is the reason.  I have heard of these places allowing studies to be performed, I just don’t think they see much value in it that’s all.  What does/could the school gain from the studies?



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[Anonymous]

Yeah, there's a reason for that. The facilities won't allow it because they know they'd be blown out of the water.

Well, I am not so sure that is the reason.  I have heard of these places allowing studies to be performed, I just don’t think they see much value in it that’s all.  What does/could the school gain from the studies?



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I dunno, maybe to find out if what they're doing has any negative or positive impact on the kids they are entrusted with?

Yep, you're right.  Why would they want to muck up their fantasy world with such messy things like research or facts or evidence?

 :roll:  :roll:  :roll:  :roll:  :roll:  :roll:  :roll:  :roll:  :roll:  :roll:  :roll:  :roll:  :roll:  :roll:

[TheWho]

Yeah, there's a reason for that. The facilities won't allow it because they know they'd be blown out of the water.

Well, I am not so sure that is the reason.  I have heard of these places allowing studies to be performed, I just don’t think they see much value in it that’s all.  What does/could the school gain from the studies?



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I dunno, maybe to find out if what they're doing has any negative or positive impact on the kids they are entrusted with?

Yep, you're right.  Why would they want to muck up their fantasy world with such messy things like research or facts or evidence?

 :roll:  :roll:  :roll:  :roll:  :roll:  :roll:  :roll:  :roll:  :roll:  :roll:  :roll:  :roll:  :roll:  :roll:

Every business satisfies themselves of where they stand with outgoing quality and with their competitors (market share), whether it be feedback thru customer service, returned goods or surveys conducted by themselves or independent agencies.  Long term clinical studies would be very expensive and if their feedback has been positive (from other sources)  and all the beds are full why spend the extra cash on something they feel they already know the outcome of?  


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[Anonymous]

Every business satisfies themselves of where they stand with outgoing quality and with their competitors (market share), whether it be feedback thru customer service, returned goods or surveys conducted by themselves or independent agencies.  Long term clinical studies would be very expensive and if their feedback has been positive (from other sources)  and all the beds are full why spend the extra cash on something they feel they already know the outcome of?  


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Because to those of us who have suffered through their bullshit, the money isn't important.  

Because we're talking about health care basically and that puts it in a different class than a normal business.

Obviously not all the feedback HAS been positive so therefore it would be necessary to implement research and studies.

[TheWho]

Because to those of us who have suffered through their bullshit, the money isn't important.

It is to them.  Since the schools are not funding it then maybe and independent party would be willing to pay for the studies.

Because we're talking about health care basically and that puts it in a different class than a normal business.

I agree, I would like to see studies done myself.  I just don’t see it happening unless the schools feel it would benefit them or the students somehow.

Obviously not all the feedback HAS been positive so therefore it would be necessary to implement research and studies.

The schools are well aware of the feedback and the fact that not every child is helped.  I think if it got to the point where parents were not happy with their individual results and their particular model was not effective enough to help enough kids to keep the beds full then they would seek and independent agency to conduct a study to measure the effectiveness and determine which areas need to be improved upon.



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[Anonymous]

The schools are well aware of the feedback and the fact that not every child is helped.  I think if it got to the point where parents were not happy with their individual results and their particular model was not effective enough to help enough kids to keep the beds full then they would seek and independent agency to conduct a study to measure the effectiveness and determine which areas need to be improved upon.



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Yep, because its all about the parents being happy with their conformist little robot, not about what's actually best for the kids.  What's Anne's Frank Zappa quote about parents wanting Tame Child Creatures???

[ZenAgent]

The schools are well aware of the feedback and the fact that not every child is helped.  I think if it got to the point where parents were not happy with their individual results and their particular model was not effective enough to help enough kids to keep the beds full then they would seek and independent agency to conduct a study to measure the effectiveness and determine which areas need to be improved upon.



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Yep, because its all about the parents being happy with their conformist little robot, not about what's actually best for the kids.  What's Anne's Frank Zappa quote about parents wanting Tame Child Creatures???

PV shills out their "success" stories - a group of former patients regularly attend recruiting sessions, spout KoolAid, go on vacation with the clinical staff's families...

Maximize the show ponies, minimize and discredit the "failures".

[TheWho]

The schools are well aware of the feedback and the fact that not every child is helped.  I think if it got to the point where parents were not happy with their individual results and their particular model was not effective enough to help enough kids to keep the beds full then they would seek and independent agency to conduct a study to measure the effectiveness and determine which areas need to be improved upon.



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Yep, because its all about the parents being happy with their conformist little robot, not about what's actually best for the kids.  What's Anne's Frank Zappa quote about parents wanting Tame Child Creatures???

The parents are the direct customers, so yes they do need to be kept happy.  As far as the robot thing or Anne Franks quote you sort of lost me.



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