G.T. Now

[GregFL]

On 2005-02-03 13:34:00, Anonymous wrote:

"So let your daughter fall and learn from her own mistakes. Oh you are very wrong about the addiction thing. I do belive in it and I do believe in AA for WILLING participants

There is great debate among us here on this subject.

There is little debate among people that went to these programs that they wish they didn't.  Very few (but some) people as adults think it was a positive life experience, and for some it causes a train wreck in their lives.

[DC]

Will do, i may be back...to ask some questions.

[Helena Handbasket]

On 2005-02-03 13:14:00, DC wrote:

"I appreciate your 4 cents, I really do.  The things that you mention are all sound ideas.  What if i told you that I hid everything, all the time, and still money and items came up missing?  What if I told you I had daily progress reports set up with her teachers and she still continued to cut class and fail?  That she didn't care anymore.  What if i told you that I did work on assignments with her and try to help her with her grades?

These problems are all associated with behavior related to taking drugs.  I am saying that I had her seeing psychologists and psychiatrists, took her to group therapy, damn near did everything I could.  I can't think of anything I didn't try, and I still failed.  

She is not afraid to talk about GT, we have had many discussions.  I even told her that I would pull her from the program if there was anything she felt she couldn't tell me, she understands this.  She is adament that there is no abuse.  She has no bruises, she doesn't come home upset, but more like the little girl she used to be before the drugs.  This program is close, there would be talk about things going on, but there is none.

I guess I am asking the wrong people.None of you believe the things I believe (regarding the disease of addiction).  through my observation of GT, I was curious to see why you all felt the way you do.  My conclusions are that none of you are addicts, making it impossible to understand the concept.  And also that you were put in your programs against your will and now still hold on to the grudge.  I will also say that I do believe that in the times that you were in these programs they were probably a bit different.  That maybe they did abuse you, I'm sorry about that.  No child should be abused.  i do not see the point that I am in fact abusing my daughter, I see it as saving her life.

Thanks again"

I would say try, try again.  Honestly - I don't know how many different variations of parenting there are... but like the other anon said - you do have to wonder why some kids "go outta control" even with the best parents.  Parenting is a creative process too.

Parenting a teenager AINT EASY!  Hell, even the most well - adjusted stereotypical "Good Kid" has issues they don't quite understand.  Open lines of communication are key.

Have you tried family therapy?

[DC]

Sara,
I really did do everything.  i was at my wits end.  We were in family therapy for a year and it didn't change a thing.  I switched thrapists, i did it all.  Rehab was the last option.  
Your questions have all been good ones, I appreciate the time and thought put into them.  I am sorry for being combative.  I was frustrated.
Thanks for all your help.

[GregFL]

On 2005-02-03 14:09:00, DC wrote:

"Sara,

I really did do everything.  i was at my wits end.  We were in family therapy for a year and it didn't change a thing.  I switched thrapists, i did it all.  Rehab was the last option.  

Your questions have all been good ones, I appreciate the time and thought put into them.  I am sorry for being combative.  I was frustrated.

Thanks for all your help."

Thanks for coming here, and mostly, thanks for coming around and listening.

Good luck with your daughter. I think I speak for everyone when I say we wish her the best

[Anonymous]

Thanks Greg, that really means alot.  I think maybe you have helped me to see some things in a different way. I don't know if its the guilt or what, but I love her so much and I want to do the right thing.  I didn't want to think I made a mistake...again.  I think thats why I took things so personal.  i know i can admit when I am wrong.  When I came here i didn't see things the way I do now. i think you guys are alright. i will keep you informed.  Thanks to all.

[DC]

Sorry, that was me...anonymous.  What can I say, i forgot

[Helena Handbasket]

On 2005-02-03 14:41:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Thanks Greg, that really means alot.  I think maybe you have helped me to see some things in a different way. I don't know if its the guilt or what, but I love her so much and I want to do the right thing.  I didn't want to think I made a mistake...again.  I think thats why I took things so personal.  i know i can admit when I am wrong.  When I came here i didn't see things the way I do now. i think you guys are alright. i will keep you informed.  Thanks to all. "

As far as I'm concerned, the door is always open! Definitely keep in touch. :smile:

[jjpinks]

Thank you for answering my questions, but I have some more for you.


You said, "I hid everything, all the time, and still money and items came up missing?  What if I told you I had daily progress reports set up with her teachers and she still continued to cut class and fail?  That she didn't care anymore.  What if i told you that I did work on assignments with her and try to help her with her grades?"

What if I told you that I did those things too? What if I also told you that 99% of teenagers do those same things to some degree as well. Yet, there is a very small percentage of those whose parents feel that "shipping the kid off" will help and that the kids are going to learn from these mistakes as they mature.


You said, "These problems are all associated with behavior related to taking drugs"

Wrong! I wasn't an addict. Hell, when my parents put me away, I was all of 13 years old! I don't think that I have ever seen a 13 year old addict in my life!

You said, "She is not afraid to talk about GT, we have had many discussions.  I even told her that I would pull her from the program if there was anything she felt she couldn't tell me, she understands this.  She is adament that there is no abuse.  She has no bruises, she doesn't come home upset, but more like the little girl she used to be before the drugs.  This program is close, there would be talk about things going on, but there is none."

Have you not listened to what these people are saying to you? They are telling you that as long as she is in the program, she CAN NOT tell you anything negative about it for fear of being punished for it. I wish that you would listen to people that have a little more experience with this than you do.


You said, "And also that you were put in your programs against your will and now still hold on to the grudge."

I am speaking for myself only here when I say that yes, I am still hurt when I think about my parents sending me to the place that they put me at the age of 13. I am now 34 years old and have put alot of the pain behind me but yet whenever I try to ask my parents how they came to the conclusion that I needed to be in a "program", I get brushed off. I am telling you here and now that no matter how bad my kids may act when they are teenagers, I will never NEVER put them away anywhere!

Sorry, I am a little emotional tonight.

N

[Cayo Hueso]

DC...I am so sorry for what happened to your daughter!!

Please check your private messages

You don't get everything you want. A dictatorship would be a lot
easier.
--GW Büsh, Governor of Texas. Governing Magazine, 7/98

[jjpinks]

DC I too am very sorry for what has happened to your daughter. And I am also sorry if I am coming across harsh. But all of this is bringing up emotions and feelings that I haven't felt in a long long time. You think that you have everything under control with your mental state and one little thing can bring soooo many emotions to the surface. I just want to hug your daughter and let her know that she did nothing to deserve being raped. I don't think that I am mentally prepared to go into any detail about what happened to me (and I don't want to diminish your problems either) so I will leave it alone. I do however, wish that you would just go and get her and bring her home to be with you. You and I both know that her being home would be the best thing for both of you.

I just wanted to add that.

N

[GregFL]

On June 1, 2001, an oldcomer beat a newcomer because he was reading a book.

On July 6, 2001, an oldcomer slapped a newcomer after finding that the newcomer had been innocently drawing.

On October 23, 2003, police reported that a teenaged patient was "enforcing the rules with other patients" -- the same violation Pavlescak cited in 1990.

On January 2, 2004, police observed Growing Together's 54-year-old clinical director, Laura Hughes, restraining a teenaged girl on the ground after she "had been disrespectful and disobedient to Growing Together staff throughout the day."


sigh..some thing never change.....

[Anonymous]

On 2005-02-03 13:01:00, ~-=Sara=-~ wrote:

"

My daughter was never beligerent, never threw fits, but she did steal money, stay out all night, steal from her friends, get raped by a supposed friend and used many different and dangerous drugs, etc...   By the time we decided on GT, she knew that she needed help.  She had been in AA and had a sponsor for a year before her relapse.

In a nutshell - do everything differently that you were doing that didn't work before.



To prevent the stealing of money - lock it up, keep your credit cards with you at all times (They don't take that much space under your pillow).  I've lived with theives before - once you remove access, they quit trying.



Cutting off access to the cash will in some ways limit access to the substances, but not completely.  There are inexpensive alarm systems that you can employ to secure the house at night, preventing sneaking out.



As far as school goes, you could set up a daily attendance card with her teachers - having each teacher sign to verify that she's been in class.  Keep a signature card handy so you can verify teachers signatures.



Actively be involved in homework.  When she gets home from school, give her some down time to decompress from the day, then set a Homework time, where she does her homework... maybe at the kitchen table, where she can see you, and where you two (or three, including mom) can help and actually TALK about the schoolwork.  Make it interesting.  It's a creative process.



As far as her being raped - she needs actual counseling from a clinical psychologist, maybe a psychiatrist.  Even if she seems "fine".  Part of her substance use may be a result of burying that pain, and stuffing itside is HARMFUL.  The format of GT is not what she needs.  In fact, repressing and regressing a rape victim back to childhood may be disasterous.  Don't take my word for it... talk to a psychologist in clinical practice.



If she was out of control, she was out of control for a reason, and until that reason is indentified, addressed and fixed - all the children's songs, peer discussions, and rigid structure are not going to help.



There's my 4 cents.




"

  Oh my god -  you make sound so simple.  You obviously do NOT have children (and rightly so).
  Why don't you go write a book with your child problem  solutions.  
  Oh- and I really enjoyed your reply about locking up your cash and valuables until they loose desire.  That was a JEWEL!

[Helena Handbasket]

  Oh my god -  you make sound so simple.  You obviously do NOT have children (and rightly so).

  Why don't you go write a book with your child problem  solutions.  

  Oh- and I really enjoyed your reply about locking up your cash and valuables until they loose desire.  That was a JEWEL!"

They were suggestions.  Like 'em or leave 'em.
And as far as my "jewel" goes - does it make sense to keep beating your head against a brick wall?  If you keep scouting for the cash and cards, and you don't find them for say, oh, six months, wouldn't you get sick of trying?

Moreover, wouldn't you get the message that someone knows what you're up to, and you're flat out busted?

So let's hear your ideas for the book! :grin:

[Anonymous]

On 2005-02-03 18:07:00, ~-=Sara=-~ wrote:

"

  Oh my god -  you make sound so simple.  You obviously do NOT have children (and rightly so).


  Why don't you go write a book with your child problem  solutions.  


  Oh- and I really enjoyed your reply about locking up your cash and valuables until they loose desire.  That was a JEWEL!"

They were suggestions.  Like 'em or leave 'em.

And as far as my "jewel" goes - does it make sense to keep beating your head against a brick wall?  If you keep scouting for the cash and cards, and you don't find them for say, oh, six months, wouldn't you get sick of trying?



Moreover, wouldn't you get the message that someone knows what you're up to, and you're flat out busted?



So let's hear your ideas for the book! :grin:"

   How about treating the ROOT instead of the symptons?!  Why not confront the child with his/her negative decisions/behaviors (stealing), and discuss WHY she feels the need to be sneaky, dishonest?!  What is she buying with this money she's stealing?  How are these actions going to cause her more problems in the future if she doesn't stop them NOW (criminal, etc.)??
  Let her know it's unacceptable behavior... that you love her but you won't sit back and allow her to continue this.  Help her figure out HONEST ways to EARN money.  Let her know there will be consequences if this happens again, then FOLLOW THROUGH.
  That's where I would start.  Not buying a safe for my wallet in my own home, and avoiding dealing with her about it face-to-face.