Fornits

Fornits Home for Wayward Web Fora
An open discussion about the troubled parent industry

however, for cooltherapy, in trusting that what you say about your life is true, i have to ask you why you are doing this? i say this respectfully now. i made the mistake of grouping all of you as whining brats. however, if you are truelly self-made as you have explained why would you waste your time pursuing carlbrook in some legal contest? there is so many things more important to do then live in resent of that which is unimportant. i was vile before, now i say with respect, carlbrook had some mistakes, but only threw the actions of individuals. your ultrasound situation could of happened at any school. but it should cost the job of the supervisor, not the entire school. theraputic boarding schools, in my opinion were set-up to babysit because the child could not be controlled by the parent. and they do their job well. if you take out the tbs then there is no median between freedom and prison (in short). now some people in this forum have personally attacked tim brace. i would trust him with my life. that is why i know the posts are delusional. so i ask again, if the freedom to talk to your parents was so imperative, why did your parents admit you? everything was cut and dry prior to admission. why would you spend your time and energy to pursue this any further?

Bryan,

I do this because of the nights I've spent awake worrying about it. Some of my friends think it's a little absurd, others completely behind me. It's irrelevant to me how people feel about it. I had nightmares pretty regularly for 5 years after I graduated. It took 6 different counselors before I found the guy who ultimately saved me from those dreams. I haven't had a nightmare in 6 months (when he said I was ready to move on and didn't need to see him anymore). Why did it take so much effort and so many years to get through that? PTSD.

What really keeps me up at night... and the reason that I put forth the energy now... is the thought of kids who are there right now. No, not everyone will have the same response that I did. Not everyone is quite so sensitive. But for the few who are... (those who feel trapped and spend 16+ months biting their tongue when they felt things were unfair only to leave the school feeling hollow, censored, and weak) ...I'm going to say my piece.

I felt WEAK after I left. I arrived at Carlbrook VERY extroverted, outgoing, wild... I dabbled in drugs, skipped a lot of school, and ignored my parents' requests. I needed to be pushed in an alternate direction - but not at the cost of losing my identity. I started college right after leaving Carlbrook and felt isolated from my peers. I was shy, very quiet, and thus, made no friends. I dated a series of men who took advantage of my weakness. This furthered my negative self-image.

It is taking time but I am finally able to interact with large groups of people. I have a very nice group of friends... many don't know anything about my life before graduate school. It's difficult to talk about... and, frankly, everyone has an opinion and thinks they can fix me. It makes it worse. Not many people go through the bizarre things that we did. And regardless of whether you believe that they were abusive or fair... that shit was fucking strange. Have you watched Jesus Camp? It made me sick.  

So that's why I take time out of my severely busy schedule to make a point to hold this school accountable. Regardless of whether we had close relationships with the staff members, there is so much behind the scenes that, as students, we were unaware of.  

And this is where I hop on my soapbox.. Forgive me if you know this... but I've learned this through years of research and chatting with various CBK teachers, ex-teachers, staff, ex-staff, graduates, graduates of other programs...etc.........

Tim Brace? Yeah... What he doesn't mention to us in Monday Assembly is that he's been involved in AT LEAST 5 schools that have been shut down by various state governments. He is not alone. Many of the board members' names pop up affiliated with schools that have since been deemed abusive. You can say they were different? These staff members changed their practices to better fit into the standards of our modern day society? No. Read the workshop scripts. They. Are. Identical. Speak with the graduates of these other institutions, some of whom are now into their 40s. Same experience. Same staff. Same nightmares. Same fucking situation. Check out the CEDU documentaries on YouTube. You'll hear your beloved Tim Brace's name mentioned a few times in there. More importantly, chat with the people who created those videos... you'll hear even more when they're not on tape.

The school's caring nature? Nah. Call up Hope Bowling, Stephen Davidson, Mama Saunders.... they'll tell you how much the school cares about peoples' livelihoods. Teachers are fired with absolutely NO NOTICE and are often not given an explanation (not required by VA law). New staff members were hired on at 1/2 the pay. But, truth is, many of these (more recent) ex-teachers/ex-advisers won't say anything to you. This is because Carlbrook had them sign a waiver for 6 months severance to never speak about the school again. To receive these moneys (which many of them are desperate for because of the SHITTY economy in South Side Virginia) it is mandated that they do not speak to former students, former staff members, sometimes current staff members, or even ABOUT Carlbrook to unrelated parties.

If that isn't worrisome enough... why don't you give them a call and ask for your records? Not the application forms... the BINDER that they kept in the Carriage House that contained all of your therapeutics, health, etc. If you graduated before 2009, they will not have it for you. 2008 and earlier graduates' information was shredded by the staff when they first started to hear murmuring from former students. I could give you further details of this, but I am not sure if there are current employees who could be damaged by the information.

This isn't even getting into the workshops, groups, negative sculptures, stumps, suspension, etc.... and I won't go there tonight. Mostly because I think that it's a waste of time. Some people liked that stuff, others didn't. But the points mentioned above SHOULD worry you. They should make you think. They should make you question the people who you're holding so close to your heart.

And, as someone mentioned above, you can chose to continue to ignore this. That's fine with me. I'm not looking for allies. I'm not looking for someone to join my "crusade." I'm just looking for Carlbrook to be held accountable for once. It's time for them to write their own honor list. All of the board members and higher-up advising staff should be on permanent stumps. A handful should be in prison for fraud. The rest of them? They're lost in the romance of it all. And it's hard not to be. It's hard to evaluate yourself... hard to admit that you could be causing damage.

Anyway, signing off. Maybe this helps give you a clearer view of why I might feel so passionately about this. I know it certainly helped me to sit and write it.

I'm having a hard time understanding why you would like to be a part of the whistle-blowing activities if you feel this way... But this being said, all of your "suggestions" have been done. And lawyers have been talked to. Statute of limitations is an issue - as is the lack of a class action lawsuit in Virginia.

I was diagnosed with PTSD by more than one doctor after I graduated. Whether you think that the school is harsh or not, there is no reason a child should suffer with PTSD after attending boarding school. It is inappropriate.

No one compared this to jail. No one said that it was worse. No one said that all of the kids at Carlbrook were well behaved or deserved any sort of *special* treatment... but I don't think it's wrong to expect that the students be treated as humans. Students should have the right to refuse to partake in exercises. Students should have the right to communicate whatever they need to their parents. My calls were monitored and cut off if the staff felt that I was crossing any "boundaries." I was punished for speaking openly with my father about my feelings towards the school 12 months into the program. I was honor council, d-com, friends com, etc. But I was not permitted to discuss any grievances.

I got sick while there and was denied prompt medical treatment. The issue developed quickly and when I finally made it to the doctor, I needed an ultrasound to ensure that I hadn't developed breast cancer. My parents weren't informed until they received a bill in the mail for the ultrasound.

Whether you think it's morally wrong or not, depriving minors of sleep is not a legal activity. 12 hour therapy marathons have not been proven to work in any setting. And I'm going to be bold here and point out that it doesn't appear to be working for Carlbrook, either. Many of the students I attended with have since committed suicide or ODed. This occurs far too often.

Bottom line: Carlbrook has some illegal practices. There are many staff members who are unlicensed and overseeing therapeutic exercises. You lose all rights when you are signed into the school and your parents don't *truly* know what's going on there until well after you've graduated.

The secrecy, money, and "therapeutics" all need to be reviewed by someone who is trained to do so. Hopefully this will happen. Tons of schools just like Carlbrook have been shut down for doing the exact activities that Carlbrook partakes in.

So, your opinion has been heard... but unfortunately for Carlbrook, the legal system likely will disagree with it if their cover is ever blown. Here's to hoping that it is.

Yes! Carlbrook kids are ready to speak... help!

Class action lawsuits cannot be filed in Virginia.... guess that's why the former CEDU and Cascade staff members decided to move all the way out to a tobacco plantation in Virginia.

What other options are there? This school is using many of the same emotionally abusive tactics that were used at CEDU. What exactly is CEDUWATCH? Is this here so that we can just list places that should be shut down? Or is there anything that could be done???

Just something that I posted on a blog earlier... thought that it might be relevant on fornits, too....


It took me over three years post-graduation from Carlbrook to realize what was done to me. For all of the grads/parents of grads posting shortly after graduation... JUST WAIT! Things change. Once the nightmares set in, you'll see. That's when it became clear to me.

I've been gone for nearly 5 years and still have nightmares 2 or 3 times a week.

I think that parents get on these blogs and forums to try and convince one another that they didn't make a serious mistake. You guys HAVE to believe in Carlbrook because of what it would mean if the school was, in fact, abusive. I can't imagine how that would feel - but I do know that once my parents finally heard me and accepted that maybe their view on what *I* went through for a year and a half wasn't correct, I felt so relieved.

I don't know a damned thing about Monarch but I am RELIEVED that your kid isn't at Carlbrook. A week long visit was unheard of at that school.

To recent Carlbrook grads who are surfing the internet and trying to find some support: be patient with yourself. You will not understand what has happened for a while. Don't pass judgement on anyone who has a negative view simply because you disagree. I burned a lot of bridges this way when I first graduated. There is a support group on facebook titled "Carlbrook Student's for Accountability and Oversight in Troubled Teen Field." When you are ready, join us.

Parents thinking about Carlbrook: READ THE DISCUSSION BOARDS ON THIS GROUP. I was an extremely successful student... most of this information is not coming from your standard "trouble maker."

What kind of support can leading members of fornits give Carlbrook students who are deciding to take legal action? There has been some talk and a bit of research but it seems that everyone is pretty lost when it comes to how to approach this.

Depends on what they were banned for:  flooding?  posting porno?  

It looks like just a couple of links posted challenging Carlbrooks use of aggressive group therapy got the wall shut down. It was initially deleted and there was a response asking why.. it was 4 or 5 posts that were very simple... and then the wall was gone.

Now... here's what the facebook group says:
Description:This is a private group restricted to Carlbrook faculty and student alumni. It is intended as a forum for open discussion, support, feedback and general updates. Welcome.

notice... feedback. maybe not so much?

People who also graduated 5 (or more) years ago and still HATE Carlbrook: it is definitely time to get over it.

Feeling that this is probably targeted towards me.

Never said I HATE Carlbrook. You say to "get over it," but I have met people on this forum who went through a very similar experience to ours and it took them 30 years to come to terms with the pain it has caused them. THAT is what this forum is for. There are other websites with other forums for what you're talking about. It took me a while to realize the pain I was left with after leaving Halifax. I DON'T think about it all the time, everyday, whatever. But, I do think about it enough that it bugs me. It comes back more in my dreams. There is NOTHING that has happened to me in my life that 5 years later is still giving me nightmares. I'm glad you made it out comfortable and happy. But I didn't. So to tell me to just "get over it," now, that's a little closed-minded, don't you think?

You say that you don't think of the "tools." These are sayings that I hear over and over in my head. I am happy to use the term "brainwashed." Anytime I am angry with someone, no matter how cruel the transgression, I hear "forgiveness is my single function, peace of mind my single goal." A nice way to view life, but not something you want on repeat in your head. There are so many other of these "tools" that are on repeat for me.

But more than that - the things that happened to me in the workshops started to really haunt me. Things like the statue exercise in animus are continuously in the back of my head and the pain is just as fresh as it was in the moment.

I see Carlbrook's primary goal as breaking a student down and then building him back up, giving him confidence and common sense that he may not have had before. I think that my experience was fucked. They succeeded in the "breaking down" process, but my high sensitivity required more in the "building up" strategy. The lack of enough support to rebuild myself plus a VERY difficult last few months combined into a terrible experience. I was too scared to be held back to say anything. My depression was so incredibly unbearable but I had to hide it if I wanted to graduate. That's the big problem with the school, in my opinion, the fear factor. I was terrified to move in any direction. You can say they didn't abuse us, but in my mind, instilling that fear is abuse enough.

There is much more to my Carlbrook story but I think you've probably caught the drift. I am glad that you didn't have the experience that I did, but to tell me to just "get over it" isn't necessarily fair. You have not walked in my shoes. I have not been brooding over this for 5 years, avoiding life. I, too, successfully made it through college with great grades and have started grad school. I am not a "negative new kid" who never grew up. This is VERY different.

-CT