Thanks for the reply, FL. I remember john and other staff mentioning other programs too....but this was always in a critical, dismissive way. I've had discussions with other oldtimers regarding art's awareness or lack thereof. There's little point in debating such a thing however, since those who are clearly pro-seed always seem to fall on one side (he is the most aware person I've met, etc.) while those critical of the seed fall on the other side. (that he was an egomaniac, etc.) It's similar to the divide amongst democrats and republicans regarding GW Bush. Whether or not you think he's a great president or a dumbass depends mostly upon party affiliation.