Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform > The Seed Discussion Forum

Conversion: the "Three Day Miracle"

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GregFL:
As far as the physical harm, I did know of it occuring in St Petersburg. Mostly they would threaten  with bringing your parents in to do it. I don't think this was a long lived practice. I remember a girl with a black eye, and I have a St Pete Times article about a man being talked into coming in and repeatedly hitting his son in the face in front of staff.

 If you tried to escape you were thrown to the concrete floor and piled on. This I Saw first hand and even shamefully participated in it. If you misbehaved, they would stand you up, send you home with the biggest strongest kid and dare you to try to escape.

The violence It wasn't overt but it did happen (and is documented in the press) and was more used as an intimidation.

Still others have personal stories about being very young and physically assaulted at the Ft Lauderdale branch.

The boxing ring in Cleveland. I am told that small kids were purposely put in with big kids and took a beating in front of everybody.

These stories have been told. I think that the seed was so intense, our  minds were so full of other stuff, and that the violence angle really didn't mean much, at least to me at the time.

I also understand at other times and in other locations, things were milder. The seed morphed often as funding came and went, groups swelled and downsized, staff members came and went. And as time went on the average age of the inductee climbed to over 18...this is why so many of us have such varied experiences. The program was non- linear in its modalities.

cleveland:
That quote is perfect.

The worst part of the whole experience, was that I was supported in the belief that I was (or had been) a bad person; that my former friends were liars, users, freaks and 'Druggies' (even if they'd never used drugs, they had a 'druggie' attitude); and that the Seed ideology and the staff that enforced it were virtually faultless.

I internalized the belief that, without the Seed, I was a loser. That I myself had 'fucked everything up' before I turned my life over to the Seed, and that on my own, I had been a bad influence on my friends, family, and society (I was 'part of the problem').

As part of the Seed, I saw other people as sick and deluded, and maybe bad. I saw myself as 'better' than others, but also knew I was potentially bad, because only the Seed made me 'straight.' And I always felt anxious, because, to my shame, I wasn't as perfect as I hoped to be.

Today, I see this same attiude in churches, schools, political parties - this cult-like certainty about right or wrong, black and white. I see it on the right, or course, but also on the left. It's human nature, if we allow ourselves to throw away reason, and allow ourselves to be manipulated, especially regarding things we feel ashamed of, like our bodies, sexuality, imperfection, social fears.

Whew! In some ways, I am glad that I went through the Seed, because I really think I was given an inside view of human nature. I had to tear myself down and build myself up, once as part of the Seed, once as an 'ex-Seedling.'

However, I wouldn't wish that on others. There must be a better way!



_________________
Wally Gator[ This Message was edited by: cleveland on 2004-09-18 10:02 ]

Antigen:
You're right, Greg. It is a long and convoluted story, and not all that important. I rather expect it to go away too.

Know what's really messed up? I know Cleveland branch must have closed by `76 at the latest. So then, you're talking about up to around `82, right? For all that time, The Seed wasn't taking involuntary clients? I sure wish I had known that. I lived my life dreading intake till, in late `80, I wound up at Straight. All that time, before I knew Straight existed, I could have been very nearly sane if I had known my mom couldn't force me into The Seed. Hell, at the very least, I wouldn't have "volunteered" all those Sunday afternoons making sandwiches in Plantation Elementary's kitchen!

It continues to amaze me to talk to law students -- college
graduates all and smarter than the average bear -- who will
seriously tell me about how dangerous mj is and how it
destroys the lives of those who use it and who, in the
very next sentence, will tell me how they and their
friends -- now CPAs, engineers, med students -- used
pot regularly through high school and college.  And
they don't see the contradiction between these statements.

We're not just talking ignorance here -- we are talking
deep down, serious, religious indoctrination.


--Buford C. Terrell, Professor of Law, South Texas College of Law
--- End quote ---


_________________
Ginger Warbis ~ Antigen
Seed sibling `71 - `80
Straight South (Sarasota, FL)
   10/80 - 10/82
Anonymity Anonymous
Some days, it's just not worth chewing through the leather straps.

Scout:
Wally...I sure remember the name... I was also in Ft. Laud from 79'- 84'as a graduate and have many of the same memories and know all the folks you speak of.  For me, I had been a graduate for a few years and lived away from the seed but still felt I had no real direction but more than that, I didn't feel like I fit in anywhere.  When I came back down to the seed, it was like home.  I immediately moved in with the chicks, got a job, and spent every waking moment living and breathing the seed.  I remember I had a day off from work and I decided to stay home, you know, take some time for myself, relax, spend some time by the pool at Cranbrook Apts.  That was the last time I ever did that for 5 years.  I felt so guilty and selfish.  Everyone spent every available moment at the seed and if you didn't, something was wrong with you.  It always seemed wrong to me that it was okay to lie and take a day off from work to go into the seed, and it was perfectly okay with staff.  In fact, a person was almost praised for doing so.  There were so many times when I just wanted some time to myself but I was never alone.  The girls I lived with were very nice and I really made some life-long friends.  I am still friends with some to this day.  

I left because I wanted to have a life.  It took a while before I could re-adjust to the outside world because I had been taught to be so anti-social, reserved, judgemental.  Dating was a nightmare mainly because I had done so little of it, I didnt know the first thing to do.  In the 5 years I was in Ft.Laud., I didn't have one date and I was in my early twenties. It was pretty pathetic and I didn't see the opportunity happening anytime soon.  I really don't see how Art could expect any of the people there at that time to be satisfied with that lifestyle... which is why he wisend-up and started setting people up.  I think he realized if he didn't let people start having relationships with someone of the opposite sex, he was going to have a mutiny on his hands.  I have heard of a few leaving because they got in trouble "playing games" (In the outside world, it's simply flirting or light conversation with someone you are attracted to) or seeing someone on the sly.

Anyway, it is a little embarrassing and has taken a while to admit that I was a part of a cult.  While I was involved, I believed I was part of the greatest thing on earth and I could not see anything else.  Sure, I had doubts, questions, but I attributed them to not being grateful and if all these great people felt this way, I must make myself feel the same.  So many times when Art was in front of the group and everyone would be just gushing with admiration, I would think to myself, he's just a man, a person, just like us.  Doesn't anybody else see that??? He was good man with good intentions at the start but that changed when it slowed down and fewer and fewer people were coming on the program.  I think he realized he had to do something to keep us there.  That's when he would say in a rap that it's the "cream of the crop that are at the seed", the best, because "you have to be your best all the time to stay there"  and it's a "priviledge" to be at the seed.  So, of course, who wanted to look like a schmuck and leave and get on with their lives???  Art gave many people the chance to start over, and for many, he did save their lives, but he also used his power and influence to hold on to the ones that remained from about '84 till it closed in 2002.

I have enjoyed reading the posts and hearing names from the past.  It's strange.  It's like we were all a part of this group and will forever have a common link between us.  I am not bitter because I had the courage to leave and make my way in the world, but I understand those that are.  Do I have regrets...sure, I wish I had wisened-up sooner and left Ft.Laud. but I am grateful I did.  I have a wonderful life now.  

bye til next time......Scout

GregFL:
Welcome Scout! Admitting you were in a cult, after the initial embarrasement wears off,is actually kinda cool. When I tell people my story they are usually astonished and just gotta hear more. I truly believe that the years you were there were the most strange..not the most abusive or the worst on the kids, but nevertheless it seems the people got older and stayed longer and if anything worshipped Art even more. I cracked up when someone posted that during football games if anyone blocked a pass to Art there would be a rap about it...what a hoot!



  You lived at Cranbrook apartments, eh? NExt to the lauderhill Mall?  That is where my confrontation story with Art took place...

I lived in Ft Lauderdale until from about 1976 to 1980, but I was post seed and wanted nothing to do with it.

You got in after Art ran for congress and after my incident at the poolside.

Any idea where Maggie or John or Suzie is?  Would love to here from them.

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