My son at Aspen Ranch

[Anonymous]

Thread on the recent Sagewalk death: viewtopic.php?f=49&t=28470

[psy]

Great post.  The SINGLE poster 'who' is in favor of AR is now claiming his daughter went there but for five loooong years claimed she went to another 'school'.  Very fishy.  This poster, aka 'thewho' runs an Aspen feeder group.  Nigel, BEWARE of Aspen.

Yes, but in all fairness to the guest poster, like Aunti Em mentioned, it was an Aspen program and she did turn out well while the ones that were pulled went back to their old ways, got pregnant and moved away.

If we're only talking about the same person (TheWho), his "daughter" was in ASR.  He never mentioned any other kids and due to his near fanatical support of aspen, I highly doubt he would remove his other kids if he had any.  If the above guests are TheWho as several guests have implied, he would have to be lying, or at the very least trying to pass his one story off as multiple.

Nigel.  Face the facts.  Kids have been killed in aspen programs and their "lifeSteps" use deplorable techinques.  Read about their techinques for yourself as reported by time magazine (Mount Batchelors is an Aspen program using Aspen's LifeSteps):

http://www.time.com/time/health/article ... -3,00.html

From the article:

One 18-year-old former student and victim of rape wept while recounting what happened to her during a Lifesteps seminar. Jane, who asked not to be identified by her real name, left the school in March. "They had me dress up as a French maid," she said, describing an outfit that included fishnet stockings and a short skirt. "I had to sit on guys' laps and give them lap dances," while sexually suggestive songs, like "Milkshake" by Kelis, played at high volume.

"They told me I was dirty and I had to put mud on myself for being raped," she said in reference to another Lifesteps session. "They basically blamed me for getting raped."

See.  You might find that suspect or absurd but I don't.  Why?  Because LifeSteps seminars are basically CEDU "propheets" and I saw the *exact* same thing happen at a CEDU clone I was at, down to the french maid outfit (complete with feather duster prop).  Everybody had a humiliating part to play in their skits.  I have no doubt with Aspen's identical DNA and the testimony that has come forth about their LifeSteps that the same thing continues to this very day.  Mark my words, that shit messes with your head for a long time after the program.  At first after the LGAT seminar it seems like it's some eye opening experience but eventually perspective sets in and you realize how messed up what went on was...  sort of like how a victim of child sexual abuse might not recognize what's wrong at the time, but only later figure out just how wrong it was.  Only then does such a person put 2 and 2 together and realize the effects those experiences have had on their life (a person might not realize why they are prone to promiscuity or abusive relationships or so on and so forth until that point).

It's the same with LifeSteps or any CEDU propheet LGAT variant.  There is no doubt it causes dramatic change in the short and medium terms.  The long term effects is where the damage is at.  Does it damage all participants equally?  Probably not, and some it might even strangely help in some way (subjectively).  That being said, the risk is just too high as far as i'm concerned.  I've seen a kid flip out, have a complete break with reality, and have to be dragged out of one of these sorts of seminars.  Especially if your kid is sensitive and intelligent, it's not something that will likely be a good experience.

I think Nigel is looking for a little more direction for his son besides what he was getting at home, unless there were local solutions that he did not try, then I could see him brining him home early.  But if all the local options have been exhausted then I think this is the right place for him right now to keep him safe and get him moving along a better path with a healthier life style.
Either direction will not be easy.  It takes hard work to turn around a persons behavior and habits.

Hard work on whose part?  You can't force a person to change.  Even AA folk wisdom holds that change has to come from within.  That can't be pressured or as soon as the pressure is removed the behavior returns.  Long term permanent thought reform is just not possible as Robert Lifton wrote...  However the damging effects including but not limited to PTSD can last a lifetime.

[TheWho]

I don’t think that posting a child’s death is going to dissuade a person from getting help for their child.  If I posted a child dying in a public school should we expect that people would run to remove them?  Should we expect people to decline the assistance of an ambulance because they heard cars can get in accidents and kill people?

Will kids die in programs, public schools, private schools and the local McDonalds?  Of course, but the statistics show that kids are overwhelmingly much more safer in a program environment then they are at home or in a public school system.  Especially when they exhibit at-risk behavior.  The program can offer structure and the safety of oversight from staff on a 24 hour basis.

As far as changing a person I have to disagree with you, Psy, experience says otherwise.  You can change a persons habits thru behavior modification.  Children who are potty trained don’t just start peeing in their pants once the training stops.  They are shown the benefits of having dry pants and eventually the child decides himself/herself that peeing in the potty is a better choice for them.  The methods take time but they teach the child a better life style, if this could happen overnight then the programs would only last a month, but time is needed to undue dangerous and destructive habits.  Potty training cant be attained in a day either and each child is different and requires their own time to achieve the goal.  But very few children grow up to resent their parents for subjecting them to behavior modification which lead to their consistent use of the restroom.

Once the child is placed on a healthy path and matures they will look back and see that the programs was helpful.  But since change is hard work the child will not be happy with the change occuring today and cannot foresee the benefits down the road.  The fact that the child wants to leave shows that change is occuring.  If the child was happy and wanted to stay that would raise a red flag for me and indicate the program isnt very effective or isnt a good match for him.

[TheWho]

Here is an article I came across in fornits Aspen forum which may help.

Aspen Education Group's Therapeutic Programs Featured on 'Dr. Phil'
Friday May 6, 12:14 pm ET
Aspen Ranch and SUWS of the Carolinas Get 'Thumbs Up' From Dr. Phil

CERRITOS, Calif., May 6 /PRNewswire/ -- Aspen Education Group's Aspen Ranch, a Utah-based residential treatment center for teens, and SUWS of the Carolinas, a North Carolina-based outdoor behavioral healthcare program, were featured on a May 5, 2005, segment of the nationally syndicated "Dr. Phil" show. Aspen Education Group is the nation's leading provider of education programs that improve the quality of life for underachieving children, young adults and their families.

The segment followed up on the progress of a student that Dr. Phil referred to Aspen's SUWS of the Carolinas program in December 2004. After a successful experience there, the student chose to continue his learning and growth experience at Aspen Ranch. Dr. Phil featured video clips from both facilities as well as an interview with the student's mother, Jennifer Sinclair of Ontario, Canada.

"For many, many months I saw my son spiraling downward and felt he needed some kind of intervention," said Sinclair. "With the help of Dr. Phil, that intervention happened; and we admitted my son first to a wilderness therapy program called SUWS of the Carolinas, where he was removed from all the bad influences and distractions in his life and participated in individual and group therapy. After 91 days he was sober, reflective and ready to go on to Aspen Ranch for more growth opportunities. SUWS of the Carolinas saved my child's life, and Aspen Ranch is now nurturing his self-confidence as a young man and a leader."

"Dr. Phil has been a tremendous influence on parents and youths and has been particularly instrumental in helping families discover new hope through the life-changing experiences offered by the therapeutic education industry and programs such as Aspen's," said Elliot Sainer, chief executive officer of Aspen Education Group. "We're very pleased that Dr. Phil has featured several Aspen programs over the past year, and believe this is a testament not only to the kind of quality programs Aspen offers, but to the important role our industry plays in saving families and changing lives. The ability to share these kinds of stories on a program that reaches millions of people allows us to bring hope into the lives of many families needing assistance."

Aspen Ranch is a licensed residential treatment center for troubled teens between the ages of 13 and 17 who need an opportunity to make positive changes in their lives and overcome feelings of low self-esteem and anger due to academic underachievement, substance abuse or family conflict. Aspen Ranch is noted for its unique equine therapy program that allows students to learn empathy, improve communication and enhance self-confidence and self-worth through their experience with the animal.

SUWS of the Carolinas is a licensed treatment program for students 11 to 17 years of age who are suffering from low self-esteem, family conflict, substance use, defiance issues, attention deficit disorder, and other emotional and behavioral problems. SUWS of the Carolinas utilizes outdoor experiences and peer interaction in combination with individual and family therapy to help positively change the lives of young people who are experiencing difficulties at home or in school.

[Anonymous]

Here's another article found here on fornits that might help.

Teen dies on Redmond wilderness school hike-From KTVZ.COM news sources

http://www.ktvz.com/global/story.asp?s= ... =Printable


 
SageWalk Website assures parents of prospective participants that student safety is top concern
 
Autopsy performed, but cause of death east of Bend not yet revealed



A 16-year-old Portland youth collapsed and died on a hike with Redmond-based SageWalk Wilderness School, about 70 miles southeast of Bend, Lake County authorities said Tuesday.


Lake County Deputy Sheriff Chuck Pore' identified the teen who died Friday afternoon as Sergey Blaschishen, but told NewsChannel 21 he had yet to receive the medical examiner's findings on an autopsy performed Sunday in Lakeview, regarding the cause of death or other details.

Pore' labeled as "procedural" a suspension of the school's (http://www.sagewalk.com) BLM permit to operate on public lands.

But he confirmed that Blashishen had reported feeling ill and collapsed a short time later.

The teen's mother, Lyudmilla Blashchishena, told The Oregonian she was told her son vomited, then passed out during the hike. She said he did not suffer from any medical conditions.

She said her son dropped out of Parkrose High School last year and had worked construction and lived with an uncle before asking to be palced in the SageWalk program. "He asked me to place him in the boot camp," she told the newspaper. "He really wanted to change his behavior.

Here is the complete news release from the Lake County Sheriff's Office and a statement issued by SageWalk's executive director.

---

MEDIA RELEASE



LAKE COUNTY SHERIFF INVESTIGATION 090529



At about 2:30pm on Friday, August 28th, 2009, members of the Lake County Sheriff's Office, the Deschutes County Sheriff's Office, and Law Enforcement of the Bureau of Land Management responded to a report of the death of a juvenile male at a wilderness camp in northern Lake County. According to the initial information given to the Lake County Sheriff's Office, the juvenile was attending the Sage Walk Wilderness Camp. The juvenile had been received at the Sage Walk camp facility the day before, after having passed a sports physical. At the time of the incident, the youth had been participating in a hike which is a part of the behavioral program of the wilderness camp.


The initial report received by the Sheriff's Office was of a sick male, followed by information that CPR was in progress. Air Link air ambulance was requested by Deschutes County Sheriff out of Bend. CPR continued for approximately 45 minutes until the air ambulance arrived. Subsequently, the 16 year old male from Portland was declared dead at the scene.


Due to the remoteness and inaccessibility of the northern part of Lake County, Deschutes County Sheriff responded and secured the scene until Lake County law enforcement arrived.


Deputies interviewed camp counselors and other juveniles that had been on the hike. An autopsy was performed on the youth on Sunday, August 30th.


Pending the results of the Sheriff's investigation, the Bureau of Land Management has suspended the permit for the wilderness camp to operate on BLM Land.

Chuck Poré, Deputy Sheriff

---

Statement from SageWalk:


SageWalk Wilderness School is saddened to confirm the unfortunate death of one of our students on Friday, August 28th. At this time, the exact details of the incident are still being determined. We do know that our EMT-trained staff worked tirelessly with the student until the AirLink emergency helicopter arrived on the scene, at which time the student's care was turned over to the AirLink medics. SageWalk considers student safety our number one priority and takes this incident very seriously. Over the course of our 12 year history, our program has adhered to the highest standards of care and we currently meet or exceed all industry and state standards. We were the first wilderness program to be individually accredited by the Northwest Association of Accredited Schools, and we are licensed by the State of Oregon to work with students who are experiencing issues with substance abuse and are also licensed by the State of Oregon as both an Outdoor Youth Program and Private School.



Due to the limited information available, HIPAA regulations, and out of respect for the student's family, this is all we are able to communicate at this time.



CONTACT:

Mike Bednarz, MS, MBA
Executive Director
SageWalk Wilderness School

---

The state Legislature passed a new law governing wilderness schools after the September 2000 death of a 15-year-old student with Bend-based Obsidian Trails, which later closed.

William "Eddie" Lee of Scappoose died after an instructor held him face-down on the ground as punishment for an emotional outburst during a hike east of Burns.

Early this year, the Government Accountability Office listed 10 examples of youths who died at wilderness schools, and thousands of reports of abuse, as Congress considered legislation to require federal oversight for outdoor therapy programs.

At that time, a spokeswoman for SageWalk's parent company, Aspen Education Group, told The Bulletin that the bill went too far, and that schools already licensed by states and accredited by reputable groups should be exempt from federal regulations.

[Anonymous]

Many kids have been killed by Aspen Ed Group programs.  If you want to have the best chance of your kid staying alive and getting help, stay away from any AEG program.  They have a legacy of killing children in the name of 'helping' them.

[TheWho]

Many kids have been killed by Aspen Ed Group programs.  If you want to have the best chance of your kid staying alive and getting help, stay away from any AEG program.  They have a legacy of killing children in the name of 'helping' them.

Typically when statments like this are made without any evidence it is just the opposite.  In this particular case I know it to be the opposite.  Do you have a link to any statistics that support this?  Do you know how many kids kids each year who are attending public school?  Kids whose parents could not afford or decided against getting their children help?  The number of kids who die in programs is just a small fraction of those killed in public school.  This websight would crash if we printed the non-program kids and discussed each of them each time one died.

[Anonymous]

Matthew Meyer      Lone Star Expeditions

Rocco Magliozzi   12   SUWS

Name Unknown      Aspen Achievement Academy   Suicide-hanging

Brendan James Blum   14   Youth Care (& Pine Ridge Academy)

Sergey Blashchishena   16   Sagewalk


RIP boys.

[TheWho]

The reason fornits lights up so much when a child die is because it is such a rarity and doesn happen too often.  Just to place it in perspective:

One American dies in a hospital from a medical error or a lethal infection every 6 minutes  =  90,000 per year

One American killed by a traffic accident every 12 minutes = 43,443 per year

One American accidentally poisoned to death every 27 minutes = 19,457 per year

One American killed in an accident at home every 29 minutes =18,048 per year

One American killed in a fall every 31 minutes = 17,227 per year

One American killed by a drunk driver every 31 minutes = 16,885 per year

One American murdered every 32 minutes = 16,137 per year

One American drowned every 159 minutes = 3,306 per year

[psy]

The reason fornits lights up so much when a child die is because it is such a rarity and doesn happen too often.  Just to place it in perspective:

You're doing the math wrong.

It's (#ProgramDeathsYearX / #KidsInProgramYearX) compared to (#PublicSchoolDeathsYearX / #KidsInPublicSchoolYearX).  I'd wager the likelyhood of death in a program is a lot higher than the likelihood of death in a public school or elsewhere.  Sadly, there are NO statistics on this so my guess is as good as anybody else's.  Kids DO die in programs, however, and what's really shocking isn't so much the fact that they died, but how they died and how their last days were spent (often with bruises all over their bodies, scars, untreated sores, etc...).

Even still the whole death debate misses the point that the kids who survive generally end up pretty messed up.  Just ask around the MySpace or Facebook pages for any particular program.

Again.  Any parent considering an apsen program should check out the Time Magazine Article on Mount Bachelors describing aspen's LifeSteps and decide whether they think that's really healthy for their child.

[Anonymous]

No child deserves to be abused before they are murdered, and all seem to be abused from what I am reading, and then they lose their life, murdered. I pray all come out of the wood works and let the world know what kind of sick bastards are ruining their children s lives. No child should die in those places. Not a one.

[NIGEL]

Hi again,

As I'm sure you know, I am not an expert on this subect, but since I started the topic, I thought I would let you know how my son is doing.  Last report from his therapist (yesterday) is that he is doing even better with both his academics and his relationships(my son agrees with this assessment).  When I talked with him, he wanted to make sure I knew that he was putting forth his best effort.  When he was at home, he basically had given up on everything, including the hobbies (guitar and art) that he loved.  My faults as a parent were that I would always get on him for all that he did wrong, and I didn't find the time to tell him that I was proud of him and that I loved him.  I am doing my best to make sure he knows that I see him working on things and that I am very proud of him.

I would say that I am somewhat happy with The Aspen Ranch right now, but I promise that I am keeping my eyes and ears open.  My son is very open with me and I know he will tell me if there is any abuse going on.  He hasn't complained so much about the adults, but has about the kids.  The school itself is a little too rigid and structured for my tastes, but that is probably what most of these kids need.  I write him every night (he writes me about once a week), and I call him every week.  My next visit is in early October.  I will keep reporting on my thoughts if people are interested.

[psy]

Do you know if Aspen Ranch uses Aspen's LifeSteps?

[TheWho]

Hi again,

As I'm sure you know, I am not an expert on this subect, but since I started the topic, I thought I would let you know how my son is doing.  Last report from his therapist (yesterday) is that he is doing even better with both his academics and his relationships(my son agrees with this assessment).  When I talked with him, he wanted to make sure I knew that he was putting forth his best effort.  When he was at home, he basically had given up on everything, including the hobbies (guitar and art) that he loved.  My faults as a parent were that I would always get on him for all that he did wrong, and I didn't find the time to tell him that I was proud of him and that I loved him.  I am doing my best to make sure he knows that I see him working on things and that I am very proud of him.

I would say that I am somewhat happy with The Aspen Ranch right now, but I promise that I am keeping my eyes and ears open.  My son is very open with me and I know he will tell me if there is any abuse going on.  He hasn't complained so much about the adults, but has about the kids.  The school itself is a little too rigid and structured for my tastes, but that is probably what most of these kids need.  I write him every night (he writes me about once a week), and I call him every week.  My next visit is in early October.  I will keep reporting on my thoughts if people are interested.

Thank you Nigel,  your reports back can help other parents who are in the research phase and trying to decide if placement is a good idea for their son/daughter.
 
The structure of the program is what makes it successful.  The kids eventually feel very safe knowing what to expect each day and the ever-present  consistency.  They stop wasting time trying to test the rules and instead start focusing on their studies and themselves.  It can be a long process so be patient.
Don’t beat yourself up too much looking back on how you interacted with your son before he was placed.  I went thru the same thing when my daughter went.  It’s a good opportunity to step back and look at what worked and what didn’t so that you can make the proper changes for when your son comes home.  He is making changes in his life so changes should be made at home also.  He will appreciate you speaking openly to him and sharing how you feel.

I look forward to you updates.

[NIGEL]

I have not heard my son describe anything that sounds like "lifesteps" and the parent brochure they gave us didn't mention it.  I have asked my son what they do in their group therapy sessions (he also has individual sessions) and he said that they mainly talk (and argue) about something that the team either did that day or wants to do.  The team (a group of 12 kids) have activities (ropes course, chores, hikes, problem solving, taking care of the horses) and then they go and debrief.  One thing they had my son do (he will argue and debate anyone on anytopic) was he had to carry a piece of paper around with him and whenever he started to argue, another student could ask for the paper and write their name on it.  At the end of the week, my son turned it in and talked about his thoughts on whether he learned anything from the exercise.  My son actually said that he thought it helped him realize that he was arguing too much, and mostly about trivial items.  He has reported back to me that he is doing his best to recognize how he is perceived and is arguing less.  He went on to say that he will never stop debating (I smiled when he said this), but that he is learning how to control himself.

So, while both my son and I are seeing progress, he still desperately wants to come home (I'm sure most, if not all the kids would rather be at home).  I am doing my best to evaluate both my son and the program, and making sure that when I do bring him home, he has the best chance to stay home and not be so self-destructive.