Author Topic: Cross Creek Manor WWASP -- Telling the Truth  (Read 23377 times)

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Offline Deborah

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Cross Creek Manor WWASP -- Telling the Truth
« Reply #165 on: June 15, 2007, 03:10:37 PM »
Bee,
No apology necessary, just wanted to correct the confusion. I understand your upset and frustration, as many other parents will who found themselves fighting to get their child out of a placement. Difficult to do once the placement has been made. The program will do everything in their power to support the parent who made the placement, including providing perjured testimony.
Unfortunately, I didn't get my son out.
http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.ph ... 512#188512
http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?p=91673#91673
http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?p=60983#60983
http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.ph ... 535#215535

Many parents have found themselves in the same situation, but I can't remember a case in which the child was court ordered. Usually it's one parent enrolling the kid without the other parents knowledge or consent.

The ICPC didn't help in my situation and dealing with Tx and Ga ICPC offices was a frustrating nightmare.
http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?p=55663#55663

You can forget about the Compact anyway. Although.... I'm not sure, it may still apply to court-ordered placements, but it no longer applies to parent placements. We have Robin Arnold-Williams, Executive Director of the Utah Department of Human Services and NATSAP to thank for that.

http://waysandmeans.house.gov/hearings. ... ew&id=1748
July 04
Reform of the Interstate Compact on the Placement of Children
The Interstate Compact on the Placement of Children plays a necessary role for ensuring that children placed across state lines receive appropriate care and supervision.  However, it has not been sufficiently amended in its 44-year existence.  APHSA, as the Secretariat of the Association of Administrators of the ICPC, and based on recommendations from its’ ICPC reform task force, has embarked on a comprehensive reform of the ICPC.  A drafting and development team comprised of a broad and diverse set of stakeholders representing state commissioners, state and local child welfare directors, ICPC administrators, the American Academy of Adoption Attorneys, court administrators, the American Bar Association, Juvenile and Family Court Judges, National Indian Child Welfare Association, Child Welfare League of America, and the National CASA Association.  We begin the work of redrafting the compact next week and will complete the process by the end of this year.


Litchfield particulary disliked the ICPC.
http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?p=55532#55532
« Last Edit: October 16, 2007, 02:47:17 PM by Guest »
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Offline Nihilanthic

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Cross Creek Manor WWASP -- Telling the Truth
« Reply #166 on: June 15, 2007, 03:29:44 PM »
BTW stay away from Dr. Phil.... he has a nasty habit of sending kids to programs himself.

Montel actually admits abuse happens in programs though, he had a show just about that once. He's alright.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
DannyB on the internet:I CALLED A LAWYER TODAY TO SEE IF I COULD SUE YOUR ASSES FOR DOING THIS BUT THAT WAS NOT POSSIBLE.

CCMGirl on program restraints: "DON\'T TAZ ME BRO!!!!!"

TheWho on program survivors: "From where I sit I see all the anit-program[sic] people doing all the complaining and crying."

Offline Anonymous

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scandalous
« Reply #167 on: June 16, 2007, 04:08:58 AM »
I am leaving for Cross Creek tomorrow, under court order, to return my son.  We put in a motion for a "stay" but it didn't come through yet.
My heart is breaking.

I really cant believe how crazy this whole thing is.. and how many people involved. I am beginning to really think the WWASP has the legal system in Arizona in its pocket.

I have joint custody, my son has always lived with me and only visited his father.. how did I end up not having a say?

As I said before, I hold the judge personally responsible for any harm that comes to my son. I also hold myself- but at least I was willing to look into what was going on. I have a hard time holding my ex husband responsible even though I blame him for a lot of things..
I really believe he has been totally brainwashed by these people. It is almost pathetic.
My son and him speak in this strange language that I don't understand.
I catch my son in phrases and ideas that I cannot really understand.
Has anyone heard about this stuff?
Why is everything " scandalous"?

My son told me they have to ask for "permission to pass" across thresholds and such... when I said that was odd, he told me was for his own protection- that if he didn't  he might die.  I questioned that and he said- "well maybe not die but being scandalous".
He seemed confused that I didnt understand.

Little things leak out but even though he wants to leave the program, he is still protecting it in some odd way. Perhaps because he has to go back.
Or perhaps because 6 months was enough to program him more than I could have anticipated...

How can you get testimony about abuse from a kid who no longer seems to see abuse as abusive, or even questionable? How can you get them to tell you about strange things they have experienced when they no longer seem to understand what is strange?

I have a question perhaps those survivors among you can answer...

my son has always been extremely creative-
have any of you found that you have lost your ability to be creative or to find inspiration? Does that come back over time if lost? Is there any ability to be spontaneous after this sort of programming?

Thanks for your advice and answers.
I will check in on Monday when I get back in town.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Oz girl

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Cross Creek Manor WWASP -- Telling the Truth
« Reply #168 on: June 16, 2007, 04:20:05 AM »
I am sorry to hear about your awful situation. i once heard a radio interview with Shelby Earnshaw from Isaccorp on this show

http://www.anniearmenlive.org

Perhaps you might want to give them a try.
The broadcast station is called World Talk Radio.

I would not place any hope in Dr Phil. While Aspen is his favourite place to send kids he also once sent a Girl to Provo Canyon School. This is where WWASP king pin Robert Litchfield got his start. Good luck
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
n case you\'re worried about what\'s going to become of the younger generation, it\'s going to grow up and start worrying about the younger generation.-Roger Allen

Offline Nihilanthic

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Cross Creek Manor WWASP -- Telling the Truth
« Reply #169 on: June 16, 2007, 05:54:13 AM »
Habeas corpus is a wonderful thing.

Also, check with www.isaccorp.org.

I'm bowing out of this thread now. I'm really tired of seeing shit I can't do anything about and it bringing me down. No offence to you but I've been at this since april 2004.

Unless I can do something about it I'd rather not know. I'm sorry about what you and him are going through... all I can say is be mean, get a lawyer, find out your rights, and be as cruel and mean as you can to his father. The less money he has the less he can do to you in court. He's done this to your child, and you need to do something about it.

And do not let him get transfered to Tranquiltiy Bay... not on your life.


Good luck,

Niles
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
DannyB on the internet:I CALLED A LAWYER TODAY TO SEE IF I COULD SUE YOUR ASSES FOR DOING THIS BUT THAT WAS NOT POSSIBLE.

CCMGirl on program restraints: "DON\'T TAZ ME BRO!!!!!"

TheWho on program survivors: "From where I sit I see all the anit-program[sic] people doing all the complaining and crying."

Offline Anonymous

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Re: scandalous
« Reply #170 on: June 16, 2007, 11:57:12 AM »
Quote from: ""Bee""
I am leaving for Cross Creek tomorrow, under court order, to return my son.


How can you possibly help it if he runs away, though?

I mean, what if he were to somehow get his hands on a bus ticket and end up in some other state, with somebody you definitely don't know and completely out of your hands?

What if you were to leave a few hundred dollars in cash lying around and he just kinda took it and went?

And what if he were to realize the error of his ways and, by pure coincidence, come back after the stay was issued?

Use your brain, lady!!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Deborah

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Re: scandalous
« Reply #171 on: June 16, 2007, 02:34:12 PM »
Quote from: ""Bee""
How can you get testimony about abuse from a kid who no longer seems to see abuse as abusive, or even questionable? How can you get them to tell you about strange things they have experienced when they no longer seem to understand what is strange?


They have to be re-educated on what constitutes abuse. It can take some time and may require a therapist's help in sorting out the confusion.

http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.ph ... 692#152692
http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?p=37315#37315
http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?p=37375#37375
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
gt;>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Hidden Lake Academy, after operating 12 years unlicensed will now be monitored by the state. Access information on the Federal Class Action lawsuit against HLA here: http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=17700

Offline Anonymous

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Cross Creek Horror
« Reply #172 on: July 20, 2007, 12:28:49 AM »
I was sent to Cross Creek Manor in December of 2004(the 22nd to be exact.) This place was awful. I'm not going to say that the living conditions were horrible, because they weren't. It was the mental abuse. I have always been rather independent and from the moment I got there I knew it wasn't for me. After I had been there for a month I had finally succumbed to the fact that I wasn't going to work the program,( and I had 2½ years until I would be 18.) It was January and I hadn't spoke or seen my parents in 1 month. I got one of the first few letters from my father. My older sister had passed away and they had her funeral the day I arrived in LaVerkin, UT.
From this point on I was lost. The director, Ron Garrett, was constantly picking your mind, calling you horrible things, slut, whore ext. Every wonderful expierence I have ever hadI was told was "not-working", from even the most innocent ones like canoeing with my father, or hunting etc. Garrett would ask you questions, and you had to be honest, because if you lie he'll put you on staff budy, however I was also put on staff budy Many times for giving an answer that he didn't like.

now if you wonder waht "staff budy" is let me explain:
no hairties, talking, eye contact, pen, pencils, books, shoe laces, only 1 thin sweatshirt(and it gets quite cold in Utah, especially coming from FL), 5 minutes to undress, shower, wash your hai and body, get dressed brush your teeth, with the bathroom door open. This brings in the humiliation aspect of it. you couldn't blow your nose, scrath your head,face or anywhere with out prior permission. you went to the bathroom with 5 girls at a time, usually about 4 times a day, or as soon as the staff felt like taking you. leaving the door unlocked,with you feet on your hands, once you moved your hands you had 10 seconds to be out of the stall. and when you weren't in school, you were in the punishment room: "worksheets" in this room you would sit for about 10-13 hours per day. the only thing you did in this room is listen to tapes about authors, inventors,artists etc, along with the tapes were questionarres. no breaks, no talking, no human contact. aat one  point Ron Garrett kept me on this punishment for 3½ weeks, during which I was restrained by 2 staff members for asking a question. I weigh about 120 they together about 400. My hardest point was when Ron and I had a fight, he drug me into the bathroom and I was forced to look into the mirror and ask to repeat these words: I am a mean, nasty girl, and I deserve every pain I have gotten. Shortly after this my parents came and took me home. I spent 10 months and 6 days in hell.
 IF YOU ARE A PARENT READING THIS AND CONDSIDERING SENDING YOUR CHILD AWAY. DON'T!!! I AM 18 YEARS OLD NOW, AND I WAKE UP CRYING 4 TIMES A WEEK FROM NIGHTMARES. I HAVE NOT FORGIVEN MY PARENTS, BECAUSE UNLESS YOU LIVE EVERYDAY IN A PLACE LIKE THAT NOT KNOWING WHEN YOU WILL SEE HOME AGAIN YOU CAN'T UNDERSTAND. THINK ABOUT, THEY PROMISE YOU A BETTER CHILD, BUT I WAS NEVER ALLOWED ANY EXPERIENCES, OTHER THAN WHAT THEY WANTED YOU TO EEXPERIENCE. THAT IS BRAIN WAHSING. TALK TO YOUR KIDS. MY ENTIRE FUTURE WAS AFFECTED. WHEN I WAS SENT AWAY I HAD A 3.8 GPA. THE CLASSES THEY OFFERD THERE HAD NO AP CREDIT AND MY GRADUATING GPA WAS A 2.4. DONT DO IT. PLEASE IT'S NOT WORTH WHAT ME AND YOUR KIDS WILL HAVE TO LIVE WITH FOR THE REST OF OUR LIVES.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline psy

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Re: scandalous
« Reply #173 on: July 20, 2007, 12:31:14 AM »
Quote from: ""Bee""
How can you get testimony about abuse from a kid who no longer seems to see abuse as abusive, or even questionable?


Very simple.  Ask them in detail how they were helped.  Get that on record.  That speaks volumes more than descriptions of abuse ever could hope to.
« Last Edit: July 20, 2007, 12:34:23 AM by Guest »
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Offline Anonymous

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Cross Creek Horror
« Reply #174 on: July 20, 2007, 12:31:33 AM »
I was sent to Cross Creek Manor in December of 2004(the 22nd to be exact.) This place was awful. I'm not going to say that the living conditions were horrible, because they weren't. It was the mental abuse. I have always been rather independent and from the moment I got there I knew it wasn't for me. After I had been there for a month I had finally succumbed to the fact that I wasn't going to work the program,( and I had 2½ years until I would be 18.) It was January and I hadn't spoke or seen my parents in 1 month. I got one of the first few letters from my father. My older sister had passed away and they had her funeral the day I arrived in LaVerkin, UT.
From this point on I was lost. The director, Ron Garrett, was constantly picking your mind, calling you horrible things, slut, whore ext. Every wonderful expierence I have ever hadI was told was "not-working", from even the most innocent ones like canoeing with my father, or hunting etc. Garrett would ask you questions, and you had to be honest, because if you lie he'll put you on staff budy, however I was also put on staff budy Many times for giving an answer that he didn't like.

now if you wonder waht "staff budy" is let me explain:
no hairties, talking, eye contact, pen, pencils, books, shoe laces, only 1 thin sweatshirt(and it gets quite cold in Utah, especially coming from FL), 5 minutes to undress, shower, wash your hai and body, get dressed brush your teeth, with the bathroom door open. This brings in the humiliation aspect of it. you couldn't blow your nose, scrath your head,face or anywhere with out prior permission. you went to the bathroom with 5 girls at a time, usually about 4 times a day, or as soon as the staff felt like taking you. leaving the door unlocked,with you feet on your hands, once you moved your hands you had 10 seconds to be out of the stall. and when you weren't in school, you were in the punishment room: "worksheets" in this room you would sit for about 10-13 hours per day. the only thing you did in this room is listen to tapes about authors, inventors,artists etc, along with the tapes were questionarres. no breaks, no talking, no human contact. aat one  point Ron Garrett kept me on this punishment for 3½ weeks, during which I was restrained by 2 staff members for asking a question. I weigh about 120 they together about 400. My hardest point was when Ron and I had a fight, he drug me into the bathroom and I was forced to look into the mirror and ask to repeat these words: I am a mean, nasty girl, and I deserve every pain I have gotten. Shortly after this my parents came and took me home. I spent 10 months and 6 days in hell.
 IF YOU ARE A PARENT READING THIS AND CONDSIDERING SENDING YOUR CHILD AWAY. DON'T!!! I AM 18 YEARS OLD NOW, AND I WAKE UP CRYING 4 TIMES A WEEK FROM NIGHTMARES. I HAVE NOT FORGIVEN MY PARENTS, BECAUSE UNLESS YOU LIVE EVERYDAY IN A PLACE LIKE THAT NOT KNOWING WHEN YOU WILL SEE HOME AGAIN YOU CAN'T UNDERSTAND. THINK ABOUT, THEY PROMISE YOU A BETTER CHILD, BUT I WAS NEVER ALLOWED ANY EXPERIENCES, OTHER THAN WHAT THEY WANTED YOU TO EEXPERIENCE. THAT IS BRAIN WAHSING. TALK TO YOUR KIDS. MY ENTIRE FUTURE WAS AFFECTED. WHEN I WAS SENT AWAY I HAD A 3.8 GPA. THE CLASSES THEY OFFERD THERE HAD NO AP CREDIT AND MY GRADUATING GPA WAS A 2.4. DONT DO IT. PLEASE IT'S NOT WORTH WHAT ME AND YOUR KIDS WILL HAVE TO LIVE WITH FOR THE REST OF OUR LIVES.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

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Cross Creek Manor WWASP -- Telling the Truth
« Reply #175 on: July 20, 2007, 01:41:49 PM »
bump for this warning to parents
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

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Cross Creek Manor WWASP -- Telling the Truth
« Reply #176 on: July 22, 2007, 04:46:15 PM »
Quote from: ""Guest""
bump for this warning to parents


For the few that bother to take the time.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »