2 cents - I will try and be as clear as I can about it, with the certain understanding that some had a different experience than I had (some bad and I will not deny that), but for me and for the vast majority of the people that I know and still speak to that went through the exact same thing that I did, it was not viewed as a torture chamber, gulag, prison, etc. And the people I talk to are largely happy and I would say more successful than most. While it is true that I did not voluntarily go there, and while it is true that I was yelled at and that I moved rocks up hills and down hills, and saw a lot of really "weird" things, I did not feel like I was in any way being tortured. In fact, I laughed while I was there, I had fun, I ate healthy and exercised, I made friendships that have lasted 25+ years, I learned things that I still find value in today. I also disagreed with many things however. I will grant you, it was not perfect, and as I've already stated I would not send my children there today (if it even still existed). But the fact is, when I see people like "Guest" (in particular) ranting about something that is in no way (not in the details or even in the most general sense) at all even remotely like the "program" that I went through I must say that it is a bit baffling. But 2 cents, I would agree with this, that many problems originated when people came to the program that were just not well suited for it - and I think the school is responsible for that, and the educational counselors are responsible for it, and I think the parents did a lackluster job in their "research". But those type situations were not the rule while I was there. It may have become like that but it wasn't the case based on my personal experience.
I've read some other things on this board over the past few days. TAC, psy (I believe it is?) - and I understand what they are saying, I see their side of it, I sense sincerity, I see a point. In fact, I would probably, if we sat down in a room and just talked, get along with them marvelously and vice versa. We would disagree on things certainly, but we could have a sensible debate on anything we disagreed about, and probably laugh at some of the more ridiculous stuff. But there are others who have taken up this sort of conspiratorial crusade and are just firing scattershot at every opinion or fact or story that doesn't jibe with their own preconceived notion. I KNEW Tim Brace. I knew DK-B, I went to CEDU first and split (no one tried to physically stop me by the way), was gone a week, went to RMA, was approximately the 30th student, lived on the campus at the same time Mel did. I did a fulltime, multiple work details, was placed on bans from virtually everyone, was "blown away", went through every propheet, 3 workshops (there was 1 additional ws my peergroup went through between the Values & Imagine - that was then discontinued). I saw many changes and trials and error and a large turnover in staff, and students (particularly early).
And then there are people like "Guest". Guest almost assuredly did NOT go to the place I went to. And yet he has a stronger opinion of it than I do - and his facts are wrong. BAD wrong in many instances. And yet "Guest" accused me of all sorts of crap and lying and gives people shameless advice and has appointed himself an authority on the subject - a subject he knows NOTHING about. Either he is lying, not who he says he is, or he NEVER went there and knows nothing about it - maybe other than some pieces of scrap he picked up here or there and is trying to make a bad quilt out of. All fabricated and simplified. And honestly, I am yet to decipher that brilliant work on "subjectivity" he composed for me. Dizzying stuff. (Off the subject a bit but I wonder if perhaps Guest isn't the "staff troll" - due to mistpealings and ynconsystuncies among other things? Well, actually, it would probably be beyond their capabilities - but if you really wanted to discredit somone's opinion you couldn't invent a better character to do it with than a guy like that.)
Anyway, I will concede that perhaps the place changed, maybe it was COMPLETELY different after I left, maybe it became some terror gulag thought reform mind control place. But my feeling is that would have taken a lot more firepower than what they had when I was around. To a large extent the staff just weren't bright enough or capable enough or creative enough to pull that off. The ones who were (if there were any?) probably wouldn't want to. At least I would hope that would be the case?
However I may seem here to people on the written page, I am not trying to bamboozle anyone - I am neither ugly nor dumb, I am not a great "follower", I am independent minded, a skeptic by nature, I am in a field completely unrelated to the "troubled teen industry". I am just some guy. And a parent. I have no agenda and no motivation other than the fact that over the weekend through some (perhaps fortuitous) turn of events, I found my way to this board. And I posted something solely based on the fact that one of the first things I read was from the friend of a parent asking for advice - and some "raving idiot" who had probably never even met any of the people being discussed flew off on some wild (and very unhelpful I would add) tangent about how Tim Brace was a child killing murderer and a death camp monster (paraphrased, but not far off). My next (and somewhat impulsive) act was to type a quick comment stating that from my experience that was just not the case.
There are worse places than the one I went to. There are better ones I'm sure. I agree with many things people have posted, about secrecy and hypocricy, and I agree that it affected people differently, but if there is a thing that I am really incensed about its by the places that care more about a $ than the kid. There are lots of them.
As a parent, and perhaps something closer to me at this point, is the complete degeneracy and crap in our public system. And I FULLY agree with TAC's comment on hippies -- just as an aside.