G.T. Now

[Anonymous]

Of course you know nothing Sara...you don't buy into DC's vodoo treatment modality.According to doctrine, You cannot have any credibility...it is against the very nature of the program.

 Don't forget he is a current devotee to the seed/straight/life/DC chain of abusive rehabs. If you don't agree you are a druggie,insane or worse.

Check out this quote from the predecessor to Life/DC...

 "they are either druggies or they are fools"

Art Barker, speaking of his critics.

[Cayo Hueso]

I'd like an answer to Sara's question.  Have you even bothered to look at any of the links that have been provided for you?

The bible teaches that woman brought sin and death into the world, that she precipitated the fall of the race, that she was arraigned before the judgment seat of Heaven, tried, condemned and sentenced. Marriage for her was to be a condition of bondage, maternity a period of suffering and anguish, and in silence and subjection, she was to play the role of a dependent on man's bounty for all her material wants, and for all the information she might desire...Here is the Bible position of woman briefly summed up.
--Elizabeth Cady-Stanton

[DC]

Sara,
I suppose you know more about addiction than the Mayo Clinic and thousands of other respected medical institutions.  Your knowledge on this subject is so astounding.  Why don't you write a book, or come up with a cure. I suppose what it boils down to is this, you will only believe in what you think.  That you are smarter than everyone else.  That other experiences (such as mine with my daughter in GT) mean nothing because one time, a long time ago, You were put in a treatment center and had a bad experience.  Your experiences are not everyone's experiences.  I have read enough posts on this board to know that there are many, many people who have posted here that have shared positive experiences at these institutions.  You choose not to believe them.  I can only say that I am so sorry that you and people like Greg choose to be stuck in the past.  If these institutions were so corrupt and doing illegal things, then they would be shut down.  GOD knows that they have been ivestigated to the maximum.  So who is right?  You or me?  As long as the doors are open for business, and as long as I continue to see the many miracles that I have witnessed in my experience, you will not sway me from my opinions.
I only wish that you could have all been a little more civil.  It does go to show that your emotional maturity has been stunted, but I do not believe it was by any of these institutions.

[Helena Handbasket]

:scared:

AA gives away FREE COFFEE!!!!!?

I'm THERE!

[Cayo Hueso]

I guess this guy's full of shit too. :roll:




JEFFREY A. SCHALER
Silver Spring
The writer was chairman of the Montgomery County Drug Abuse Advisory Council.

Schaler, J.A. (1988, October 25). Alcoholism is not a disease.
The Washington Post, Letters to the Editor, p. A26.

It is unfortunate that the House of Representatives recently voted to overrule a Veterans Administration policy calling alcoholism ''willful misconduct'' [''House Votes to Restore Benefits to Alcoholic Veterans,'' Oct. 18]. Contrary to the claim that this is an important victory for all recovering alcoholics, it is first and foremost a victory for the alcoholism treatment industry and a defeat for scientific medicine.

Ironically, on April 20, 1988, the U.S. Supreme Court agreed with the bible of Alcoholics Anonymous (AA). AA is one of the strongest proponents of the disease model of alcoholism. The court upheld the authority of the VA to define alcoholism as the result of ''willful misconduct.'' And as The Big Book says: ... the main problem of the alcoholic centers in his mind rather than in his body."

Although Justice Byron R. White, writing for the majority, said that the court was not deciding ''whether alcoholism is a disease whose course its victims cannot control,'' he also noted that there was ''a substantial body of medical literature that even contests the proposition that alcoholism is a disease, much less that it is a disease for which the victim bears no responsibility.''

A person does not will the onset of diabetes, hypertension, the presence of a malignant tumor. Here it would be wrong to assign responsibility for the disease. This is not the case with an alcoholic or drug addict. A person both enters and exits usage through an act of will.

Since the word addiction is defined as a volitional act and the relationship between the mind and the body is unknown, it is inaccurate to state with certainty that alcoholism is a disease. The mind can't be sick.

Many disease model spokespersons are recovered alcoholics and have an emotional investment in viewing themselves as helpless to their own behaviors. A majority of these people are seriously lacking in scientific backgrounds. They say scientific validity ''interferes with the process'' of helping people who need help and claim special qualification to help others.They perceive any challenge to the disease concept as ''a challenge to the validity of their own emotional ordeal and conversion to sobriety.''

The treatment industry also has a substantial economic investment in maintaining the disease concept. As long as alcoholism is considered a disease, medical insurance pays for treating it.

Is the disease model of alcoholism scientific? No. Simply calling behavior a disease process does not make it one, even if doing so assists in creating sobriety. Is the treatment policy based on bad science? Yes. Is there any chance that this attitude will change in the near future? Bloody unlikely.

 

Innocence implies the ability to restrain from the initiation of aggression, and to question those who don't.
http://www.MisesRomania.org' target='_new'>Sorin Cucerai

[DC]

Cayo,
As a matter of fact, I do think he is full of shit.  He just confirms your opinion.  He validates what you are saying.  He has no real experience, no life experience.  he is a talking head.

[Cayo Hueso]

The writer was chairman of the Montgomery County Drug Abuse Advisory Council.

One has to multiply thoughts to the point where there aren't enough
policemen to control them



--Stanislaw Lec

[Cayo Hueso]

What about the question??  Have you bothered to read any of the links we sent you to?

"Now, I'm a walking dead man," ... "And what bothers me is that I'm dead because I tried to help the kids. And it's all the fault of all those people over there at the DEA." [Dead Man Talking]


--Ben Guillory

[DC]

For example???

[DC]

Where is Montgomery County??  Is this suppose to lend to his credibility?

[Cayo Hueso]

So the answer to my question then would be a NO, correct?  I mean if you're having to ask me which ones then you obviously didn't bother to look at them.

Scroll back through the threads and find them.

Any priest or shaman must be presumed guilty until proven innocent.
--Robert A. Heinlen, American science-ficiton author

[Cayo Hueso]

On 2005-02-01 09:02:00, DC wrote:

"Cayo,

As a matter of fact, I do think he is full of shit.  He just confirms your opinion.  He validates what you are saying.  He has no real experience, no life experience.  he is a talking head."

How do you know that??  He's obviously got experience in dealing with alcoholism.  He was chairman of the Montgomery County Drug Abuse Advisory Council. And you have no idea whether or not he has "personal experience".

Fucking ostrich

Prohibition will work great injury to the cause of temperance. It is a species of intemperance within itself, for it goes beyond the bounds of reason in that it attempts to control a man's appetite by legislation, and makes a crime out of things that are not crimes. A Prohibition law strikes a blow at the very principles upon which our government was founded.
--Rep. Robert L. Henry, TX December 22, 1914 (quoting Lincoln)

[Helena Handbasket]

On 2005-02-01 08:55:00, DC wrote:

"Sara,

I suppose you know more about addiction than the Mayo Clinic and thousands of other respected medical institutions.  Your knowledge on this subject is so astounding.  

I never claimed to know more.  Researchers are at war with each other to this day.  I didn't think this stuff up.  I studied and participated in research in an academic institution.   Compulsions are not diseases.
 

Why don't you write a book, or come up with a cure. I suppose what it boils down to is this, you will only believe in what you think.  That you are smarter than everyone else.  

I make more money doing what I'm doing now - outside of academia.  Where have I ever said I'm smarter than anyone else?  Those were your words, not mine, so don't think for me, and don't attribute your assumptions to me.

That other experiences (such as mine with my daughter in GT) mean nothing because one time, a long time ago, You were put in a treatment center and had a bad experience.  Your experiences are not everyone's experiences.  I have read enough posts on this board to know that there are many, many people who have posted here that have shared positive experiences at these institutions.  You choose not to believe them.  

I was put in a treatment center with no need for treatment.  I never touched drugs, alcohol or tobacco.  I was an honors student, on my way to college, too busy reading and being a geek to even be accepted into a group that could walk me down the road to trouble.  

My question to you is - what kind of place accepts someone as an addict without factual evidence of them being an addict?

I can only say that I am so sorry that you and people like Greg choose to be stuck in the past.  If these institutions were so corrupt and doing illegal things, then they would be shut down.  GOD knows that they have been ivestigated to the maximum.  So who is right?  You or me?  As long as the doors are open for business, and as long as I continue to see the many miracles that I have witnessed in my experience, you will not sway me from my opinions.

Some more reading for you:

http://www.isaccorp.org/watchlist.html

and also:
http://www.isaccorp.org/warningsigns.html

I only wish that you could have all been a little more civil.  It does go to show that your emotional maturity has been stunted, but I do not believe it was by any of these institutions. "

I fight fire with fire, guy.  If you're going to throw something, expect someone to catch it, and throw it back.  I first asked you a series of neutral questions, and you called me "fraud".  When you act like a moron, expect to be treated as one.

[Helena Handbasket]

On 2005-02-01 09:02:00, DC wrote:

"Cayo,

As a matter of fact, I do think he is full of shit.  He just confirms your opinion.  He validates what you are saying.  He has no real experience, no life experience.  he is a talking head."

Much like the cites you give that conform to your opinion, right?

[DC]

For all of you unwilling to believe in the DISEASE of addiction, I offer you this link, and can provide many, many more that state that it is in fact a disease.  But then again, maybe it is just a conspiracy.

http://www.niaaa.nih.gov/publications/aa60.htm