What Led to a Program Decision?

[Dolphin]

Can we dig deeper than blaming a program for abuse in this thread?  I haven?t read anything about what led to the decision for a parent to be desperate enough to get to the point of seeking residential behavior help.

What caused the schools to be ineffective?
What caused the parents to be ineffective?
What caused the therapists/counselors to be ineffective?
What caused the law enforcement agencies to be ineffective?
What caused the States to give the decision making to the child in most cases?
What caused the insurance companies to limit the amount of help a parent can seek?
What else?  The drugs the kids are ?legally? taking because their behavior is being diagnosed as ADD?

Was there anything else available at the time, or even now?

Are the kids without consciousness of what they are doing to their bodies and minds more now, or is it because parents hands are bound by legislative and insurance company laws?  

Are parents turning a blind eye to their child?s behavior because they feel there is nothing they can do to undo the damage they themselves may have caused?  Is it because they have tried everything they know of and because their kids know they have control, they are the ones being emotionally abused by their child who, in most ways, is calling all the shots?  Do these parents really love their child enough to get help, or are they parents that have more money than love?  What would lead parents that aren?t wealthy to take out a loan, refinance their home, spend their retirement to get help for their child when there are no alternatives for help in their State or Community?  

Many of these Programs are in Utah.  Utah allows the parents to make decisions for their child, many other States say the child has to agree to get help.  What makes Utah give parents that right?  

To parents ? what was your purpose in choosing residential or behavior modification?
To former students ? do you truly know what your parents purpose was?

Request: Can we keep allegations and accusations of program abuse out of this thread and have a serious discussion about this subject?

[Anonymous]

Anon Writes:

Request: Can we keep allegations and accusations of program abuse out of this thread and have a serious discussion about this subject?

---------------------------

Well, we could but that would be assinine since any program that changes the hearts and minds of children through coercive behavior modification tactics and techniques is abusive.

The real question is why would any parent commit their child into a school or program that systematically abuses them?  Could it be they equate submission to abusive practices with obedience to God, Country and Family Values?

 :silly:

[Anonymous]

My parents put me in a program 17 years ago because I was doing drugs and running away from home. They were worried sick about me and looking for me most of the time. They tried counseling and other things but it didn't work. There were bad things that happened in the program I was in but nothing close to what I was doing to myself when I was run away. I was able to seperate the good from the bad that went on in the program I was in. I used the good things I learned about how to cope with life and be responsible and express myself. I dealt with the abuse by talking about it and eventually letting it go. I do not see my parents as having any other choice. They could hardley find me half the time. The police couldn't even find me. I would not change what has happened. It has made me who I am today. I can try to imagine though the kids that did not have a real drug problem and were maybe just experimenting that ended up in treatment. That must be completely devistating.

[Anonymous]

Well, a lot of these kids are from broken homes where there's a new step-parent that doesn't want the kid around.

So what leads to the decision is that the custodial parent cares more about getting laid regularly than they care about their kid.

Selfish, shallow, me-first parents.

Not always, but a lot of the time.

Sure, you have the occasional saint of a parent who just had the Bad Seed or Rosemary's Baby.

Just like you have the occasional saint of a thief who's just had bad luck and his situation is none of his own making---just a hungry man stealing a loaf of bread for his family.

Most program parents, like most thieves, are hardly saints---although some of them may be "Saints."

[Anonymous]

I have the opportunity to share from two sides.

My mom had me admitted, through juvenile court, to a residential program.  I was smoking pot, drinking beer, having lots of sex, skipping school, hitting my sister and brother and leaving at will and staying out as late as I wanted.  My mom and step dad felt they had no other choice. I'm glad they did this, even though the place wasn't all that therapeutic.  I left and got back into what I was doing and ended up running away for 2 years.  I didn't grow out of this behavior until my thirties and my decisions are still felt today.  Education being the biggest.  

I saw my own son going down this road as fast as I did, so I knew what didn't work for me and I wanted to find a place that worked on choices and self-respect, and personal development.  I found it, even though in the beginning I wondered if it was the right choice.  In the beginning I knew where he was, that he was safe and that the only abuse that was going on was to himself and in his letters home. I had to keep reminding myself what led to this choice:  It was that I didn't want for him what I had done to myself.

No program is for everyone, none are one size fits all.  I wanted, and found, a place that treated the whole person, the whole family as individuals responsible for their own decisions.

The schools failed because they didn't have the teachers to help those "gifted" ADDers.

The insurance companies failed because they only wanted to pay for short term fixes.  Believe me, I know that wouldn't have worked.  

The therapists never challenged my child. THe one that did created him not showing up to go to the appointment.

I failed because I was a single mom working long hours and was never home during the early evening hours after school.  I know I didn't fail in my love for him and talking with him.  Once the drugs started, I knew I'd lost him.

The State is so focused on a child not being abused by the parents that the laws now give children rights that they shouldn't in cases like this.  However, the "fix" they offer is so lame that I'm glad I had a choice in his care.

The police are so overwhelmed with calls that they just don't have the time to do the paperwork or deal with "family" problems.  Their answer is juvenile jail.  

I never want to feel the way I did for the two years prior to getting help that worked for both of us.

I do know that if either one of us hadn't bought into it, the story would not be as good.

[Anonymous]

Gee, I don't know but could this be part of the reason parents made a decision to send their child to a program?  I mean, marketing specialty programs and promoting sales is a business, is it not?

http://www.teenlifelines.com/faq.html

 :silly:

[Anonymous]

On 2004-05-22 19:16:00, Anonymous wrote:

"I have the opportunity to share from two sides.



My mom had me admitted, through juvenile court, to a residential program.  I was smoking pot, drinking beer, having lots of sex, skipping school, hitting my sister and brother and leaving at will and staying out as late as I wanted.  My mom and step dad felt they had no other choice. I'm glad they did this, even though the place wasn't all that therapeutic.  I left and got back into what I was doing and ended up running away for 2 years.  I didn't grow out of this behavior until my thirties and my decisions are still felt today.  Education being the biggest.  



I saw my own son going down this road as fast as I did, so I knew what didn't work for me and I wanted to find a place that worked on choices and self-respect, and personal development.  I found it, even though in the beginning I wondered if it was the right choice.  In the beginning I knew where he was, that he was safe and that the only abuse that was going on was to himself and in his letters home. I had to keep reminding myself what led to this choice:  It was that I didn't want for him what I had done to myself.



No program is for everyone, none are one size fits all.  I wanted, and found, a place that treated the whole person, the whole family as individuals responsible for their own decisions.



The schools failed because they didn't have the teachers to help those "gifted" ADDers.



The insurance companies failed because they only wanted to pay for short term fixes.  Believe me, I know that wouldn't have worked.  



The therapists never challenged my child. THe one that did created him not showing up to go to the appointment.



I failed because I was a single mom working long hours and was never home during the early evening hours after school.  I know I didn't fail in my love for him and talking with him.  Once the drugs started, I knew I'd lost him.



The State is so focused on a child not being abused by the parents that the laws now give children rights that they shouldn't in cases like this.  However, the "fix" they offer is so lame that I'm glad I had a choice in his care.



The police are so overwhelmed with calls that they just don't have the time to do the paperwork or deal with "family" problems.  Their answer is juvenile jail.  



I never want to feel the way I did for the two years prior to getting help that worked for both of us.



I do know that if either one of us hadn't bought into it, the story would not be as good.  



 "

Yeah, sure.

Whatever you have to tell yourself.

You're not "deadorinjail"---and you don't know what your kid's opinion of being stuck in a private jail would be---and we don't either.

We know *you* think it's wonderful.  The parents usually do.  The kids usually think it's significantly less wonderful than the parents do, even if they have anything positive to say about it.

As far as I can see, you never quite grew out of making really bad choices, and that *is* too bad.

[Anonymous]

On 2004-05-22 19:53:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Gee, I don't know but could this be part of the reason parents made a decision to send their child to a program?  I mean, marketing specialty programs and promoting sales is a business, is it not?



http://www.teenlifelines.com/faq.html



 :silly: "

Bingo!

[Anonymous]

On 2004-05-22 19:16:00, Anonymous wrote:

"I have the opportunity to share from two sides.



My mom had me admitted, through juvenile court, to a residential program.  I was smoking pot, drinking beer, having lots of sex, skipping school, hitting my sister and brother and leaving at will and staying out as late as I wanted.  My mom and step dad felt they had no other choice. I'm glad they did this, even though the place wasn't all that therapeutic.  I left and got back into what I was doing and ended up running away for 2 years.  I didn't grow out of this behavior until my thirties and my decisions are still felt today.  Education being the biggest.  



I saw my own son going down this road as fast as I did, so I knew what didn't work for me and I wanted to find a place that worked on choices and self-respect, and personal development.  I found it, even though in the beginning I wondered if it was the right choice.  In the beginning I knew where he was, that he was safe and that the only abuse that was going on was to himself and in his letters home. I had to keep reminding myself what led to this choice:  It was that I didn't want for him what I had done to myself.



No program is for everyone, none are one size fits all.  I wanted, and found, a place that treated the whole person, the whole family as individuals responsible for their own decisions.



The schools failed because they didn't have the teachers to help those "gifted" ADDers.



The insurance companies failed because they only wanted to pay for short term fixes.  Believe me, I know that wouldn't have worked.  



The therapists never challenged my child. THe one that did created him not showing up to go to the appointment.



I failed because I was a single mom working long hours and was never home during the early evening hours after school.  I know I didn't fail in my love for him and talking with him.  Once the drugs started, I knew I'd lost him.



The State is so focused on a child not being abused by the parents that the laws now give children rights that they shouldn't in cases like this.  However, the "fix" they offer is so lame that I'm glad I had a choice in his care.



The police are so overwhelmed with calls that they just don't have the time to do the paperwork or deal with "family" problems.  Their answer is juvenile jail.  



I never want to feel the way I did for the two years prior to getting help that worked for both of us.



I do know that if either one of us hadn't bought into it, the story would not be as good.  



 "

    I agree with you, no one program is for everyone. I got help in a program that was really bad for some people. It is nice to see that for some parents giving up is not an option.

[Anonymous]

On 2004-05-22 19:53:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Gee, I don't know but could this be part of the reason parents made a decision to send their child to a program?  I mean, marketing specialty programs and promoting sales is a business, is it not?



http://www.teenlifelines.com/faq.html



 :silly: "

Promoting specialty programs on the internet and magazine is informational.  If they really wanted to make an impact, why are there no infomercials??  Why are there no t.v.commercials, like PSA's or on the radio.  

Beyond that, Dolphin, did you have a kid in a Program?

[Anonymous]

All things considered, I think once a parent has made the decision to send their child away, they need to "believe" they made the right decison and these programs do a good job enforcing that *belief* by subjecting them (the parent) to many of the same CONDITIONING tactics and techniques used to force their children into compliance.

Among this group of program parents, are those who may have stumbled across information on the Internet to cause them to "second guess" their decision and more importantly, the quality of the care and treatment their child is receiving. Some have friends and family members who manage to break through the "wall of silence" and convince the parent to re-think their decision resulting in a child being released early. Still other parents, when faced with letters or phone calls from their child alleging abuse, become uneasy enough to believe their child in spite of the program's heavy-handed explanations, guilt-tripping, etc. and choose to bring their child home.  

What's important here is it is not hard to see why parents would think their child needs a program and once he/she is placed, believe they did the "right thing".  

The real question, is WHY do some parents change their mind, after-the-fact while other parents seemingly buy into the program propaganda for many months, even years?

Could it be these parents have lost their sense of "self" and as such, their critical thinking skills?  In other words, they can't think outside the box (group)?  What is, isn't and what isn't is?

[Anonymous]

On 2004-05-23 10:07:00, Anonymous wrote:

"

On 2004-05-22 19:53:00, Anonymous wrote:


"Gee, I don't know but could this be part of the reason parents made a decision to send their child to a program?  I mean, marketing specialty programs and promoting sales is a business, is it not?





http://www.teenlifelines.com/faq.html





 :silly: "

Promoting specialty programs on the internet and magazine is informational.  If they really wanted to make an impact, why are there no infomercials??  Why are there no t.v.commercials, like PSA's or on the radio.  



Beyond that, Dolphin, did you have a kid in a Program?"

Informational?  Sheesh, have you not taken a good look at the phony and/or outdated statistics most of these websites promote to SCARE parents into locking their children up before they are deadorinjail?  What about the lack of full-disclosure (e.g. no bios or even a name of who owns and operates these "informational" websites pitching their programs-of-choice 24-7-365)? What about the obnoxious parents-helping-other-parents commercialized websites promoting themselves as experts in program referrals because they raised a troubled or troublesome teen, themselves? WOW, I'd sure want them to assess my teen's emotional and/or behavioral difficulties. NOT!!!!

 :roll:

[Anonymous]

In answer to someone's question.  Yes.  I had a child in a behavior mod program several years ago.  At the time, those that I came in contact with were neither selfish or dealing with a "me first" attitude. All were scared, way before they found the school they placed their child in.  They didn't need someone at an admission office somewhere tell them their kid would be dead or in jail.  As no one can see the future, at least I can't, I could "feel" that her future was going to be there, after two arrests for joy riding and shoplifting at 15.  The arrests were the least of what was happening.

I'm just being curious as to what those that are this board are saying about what led to the decision.  It's hard for me to comprehend that parents would now be admitting their children for the little stuff, normal teenage rebellion.  I know normal does not mean using drugs, failing school, running away...

I agree with the "gifted ADD" kids using prescribed medication when behavior modification can help them become self disciplined and to think before acting.  Other diagnosis can be helped as long as the right kind of program is chosen.  No, one size doesn't fill the need.  

My main purpose in posing the question is that from what;s posted, the reasons have changed in the past few years, if I'm to believe what I read here.

To those that responded to the question so far, I'm happy to hear that there have been some positive experiences and the reasons are pretty much in line with what I was feeling back then.

[Dolphin]

That was me.  I guess I need to sign in everytime.

[Anonymous]

How can any parent be certain that their child will not come out of a for-profit privately owned and operated "program" in worse shape than when they went in?  

They can't.

Why?

Because the teen help industry at large, is out-of-control.  Programs less than 6 months old are running full speed ahead in spite of having no measurable and verifiable "safety and efficacy" track record.  

Other programs such as the now-defunct Utah-based Skyline Journey whose license was suspended after the death of a 14 year boy are allowed to continue operating (and accepting new clients) pending administrative hearings which can take up to a year to complete.  

Where is the accountability in this multi-million dollar cash-cow industry?

There isn't any.  

 :idea: