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[Anonymous]

Cherish, I ac respect what you have to say. But I can tell you these boys definantly were not abused. I worked with these boys and saw these boys at the gym everyday. I was not employed by Maximum Life Skills but I saw alot of love and attention given to bot these to boys. What happened was a tragedy and I wish it never had happened, but they did what they chose to do. "You have the freedom to choose your action, But you don't have the freedom to choose your cosequence"... This program ran there program more like a big brother program I knew alot of there staff members including Anson. These boys use to do cruel things to the other boys in the program I know it cause I saw it just at the gym. At the gym they always had 2 people minimum if not 3 with there staff I use to see the director at Wal-Mart with all 11 boys with his staff shopping the boys picking out what they want to make and eat. I think everyone has had a bad thought of what this program was trying to do. I guess im bias becuase I saw from first hand how these boys were treated. I support this program and feel terribly awful for the Arnett family. I feel soorry for these 2 boys and there families. This whole thing maybe could have been avoided if they did have 2 staff on at night. But whose to say we wouldnt of have 2 dead staff? All I want is justice to be served to the people who caused this great tragedy. I truly believe that you cannot judge people for somonelses actions. Its not fair to the parents of these 2 boys to call the parents abusive, and maybe eemotionally and physically abusive who knows. And why did the program only have one staff on at graveyard shift for the pass 2 years? and the State did nothing about it. Why did the State revoke their license when they had all the previous violations? This whole situation is sad and very disgusting. I wish the best for the Arnett family and admire your patience and love of life for your son and brother. I heard Anson loved his job and those boys who took his life. Were those boys that bad? Why did the parents choose that program if they knew there sons were that violent. Did the parents come and check out the facility first? Its in a regular neighborhood. I believe the program was in compliance and had 1 worker for 6 boys at a graveyard shift. (The boys staying longer) The program has a warranty if your son completes the program and is sent home by the program if he falls back into lieing, stealing, CHEATING, curfew problems Maximum Life Skills Academy will bring him back for FREE! no money out of pocket from the parents. I'm pretty sure M.L.S.A. is the only program with that warranty, and the parents of those 2 boys knew that the warranty was not going to be up held so the parents along with M.L.S.A. wanted them to stay to complete the program successfully. The school teacher caught those 2 boys cheating they have the paper work to prove it. So if your in a program and ready to go home because I faked it this whole time and was caught cheating 1 week befor I go home I should get a Certificate of Completion? Is that honorable? So what would you do? As far as I know these 2 boys did the CRIME!!! the program might have been in violation for not having another staff member on, but was it the programs action that took the life of Anson Arnett? NO! it was the idea and actions of these 2 boys. GUILTY!!! As CHARGED! I feel for them but did they feel for Anson when they struck him in the head? not once...but twice if not a 3rd or 4th. And then they looted the whole place. Truthfully these boys had a problem bigger then there parents even realized. The Ahquins should sue the parents for not indulging there sons true criminal backgrounds if not psyscological and mental past history. And how can you blame the Ahquins they sent home numerous amounts of boys and all are a success not one has came back. I hope there academy can survive through this awful event caused by 2 young men. I can attest to the program sincerity. They tried there hardest dont punish the people who tried to help. God bless everyone!

[Antigen]

On 2004-05-10 12:35:00, Anonymous wrote:

I'm pretty sure M.L.S.A. is the only program with that warranty,

No, you're mistaken. I know the WWASP programs have the same or similar "warranty" and so did The Seed and Straight. Only it's not a warranty, of course. It's a threat that parents and/or POs can hang over a kid's head, sometimes for years, after they've completed a program.

It is one of the most beautiful compensations of life, that no man can sincerely try to help another without helping himself.
--Ralph Waldo Emerson

[spots]

On 2004-05-10 13:08:00, Antigen wrote:

"

On 2004-05-10 12:35:00, Anonymous wrote:


I'm pretty sure M.L.S.A. is the only program with that warranty,

No, you're mistaken. I know the WWASP programs have the same or similar "warranty" and so did The Seed and Straight. Only it's not a warranty, of course. It's a threat that parents and/or POs can hang over a kid's head, sometimes for years, after they've completed a program.

It is one of the most beautiful compensations of life, that no man can sincerely try to help another without helping himself.
--Ralph Waldo Emerson

"

Fine-print wise, the WWASPS warranty is not nearly as "good" as it sounds.  First, your child MUST graduate from the program...a nice cushion of protection for WWASPS because I have heard that only about 10% of their charges do go on to graduate.  [Either parents run out of money, or they give up on the Program, etc.]  So, after investing, say, $75K, you get home a kid who still stays out past curfew and now is refusing to clean his room every Saturday.  Send him back?  

WWASPS uses this situation fully, understanding that only a tiny fraction of their "graduates" [kids who have suffered for such a prolonged time and finally cave to the ideology of WWASPS] would become defiant enough within the 6-month post-graduate period to risk getting sent back. For the ones who do, WWASPS takes them back for a "refresher" period of 90 days without cost (at least without tuition, since other additional charges represent as much as half the monthly costs, and those presumably continue when you kid is being thumped with a "refresher" course).  Just on a whim, consider how many of those "retreads" are fully indoctrinated within an additional 90 days, and how many do you suppose still aren't "fully baked" [term WWASPS uses] to exist in their parents' home as an robot for the rest of their "childhood".  Of course, when the 90-day warranty period expires, the parents once again step up to the till and pay the man.

Parents may hold the warranty over a kid's head, but the kid may not know that the Program warranty really doesn't mean a thing.  Of course, there's the mom (sic) who sent her daughter and then son to Tranquility Bay, threatened him continually with sending him back, until he stood before her and shot himself in the head.  This warranty is a strong advertising point, but it has so many disclaimers and provisions that it sounds like the infamous rebates on computer purchases.  The Program searches long and hard to find "irregularities" that might cause it to give away some prison time it might be able to charge $15,000 for (3 months).  

My child's "buddy", the girl who shadowed her for her first couple of weeks at Casa by the Sea, was a Level V.  This girl had been there more than 2 years, and my kid saw her as a real friend, especially since there was no once else to cling to in this hateful place and no talking or communication was allowed with other "students".  This girl finally did graduate, and showed up 3 months later back at Casa, as a warranty case working up from Level I all over again.  My kid wonders aloud, "I wonder where she is now".

[spots]

One thing I forgot...

A family/friend had their son at Casa by the Sea, and were disturbed by the tone of his censored communications...so much so that, after 3 months, they drove down to Ensenada to visit and check with him personally.  When they arrived, they were forbidden to see him, with the explicit statement that doing so would VOID THEIR WWASPS WARRANTY.  This is not written anywhere in the contract, addendums, or rules.  (It's called "make it up as you go along".)  They sadly settled on watching him for a short time through a one-way mirror.  

Within a number of days after returning home, they decided to take him home.  When they arrived to retrieve him, he was brought into the lobby area to await his meager belongs being packed by staff.  He used the lobby/public restroom and came out amazed that there was toilet paper available. Like my child, he probably only was given what the staff wanted to box up, the remainder disappearing into oblivion, staff-land, or whoever wanted it most.  

If warranties apply to 10% of WWASPS students (those who graduate at Level VI), that makes it about 200 available (10% of 2000 kids in WWASPS facilities at any one time).  If you factor in the short time period the warranty is offered, that makes it, maybe, 20 kids bold/bad enough to even qualify to be returned (10% of graduates coming home).  If you factor in the rotten parents who would actually send their kids off again, that makes it, say, 4 kids (25% of "eligible" graduates).  Seems like an awful lot of advertising space given over to the remote possibility of providing 90 days of torture for less than half-a-dozen kids a year.

[Anonymous]

They use that "warranty" as a strong selling point. Also, the "parent support" available in the groups and on the BBS; also, the seminars; All are presented as major advantages over all other programs; and ALL are to the Program's advantage only, In My Opinion.

[cherish wisdom]

The Annonymous Cedar City resident who knows so much wrote:

So if your in a program and ready to go home because I faked it this whole time and was caught cheating 1 week befor I go home I should get a Certificate of Completion? Is that honorable? So what would you do? As far as I know these 2 boys did the CRIME!!! the program might have been in violation for not having another staff member on, but was it the programs action that took the life of Anson Arnett? NO! it was the idea and actions of these 2 boys. GUILTY!!! As CHARGED

As I've said in previous posts - it will be difficult for these boys to get a fair trial in this community.  Here, a townsperson claims, "guilty as charged!" This is not the American way - sorry - it is INNOCENT until PROVEN GUILTY. It seems this was not MURDER - assault - yes. If it had been murder - why would they have put him in the closet? It seems he was put in a closet to prevent him from spilling the beans after he came to.  Also - why haven't we heard from the actual witnesses - the other boys? to.
There have been numerous reports of serious abuse at these types of youth programs in  UTAH. As I said earlier - Utahans must not forget the children who died at the hands of abusive staff members who beat them, starved them, denied them life saving medical care, denied them water.  These abuses are real, documented in court and police reports. To the annoymous cedar city folks - open up your eyes and read about the deaths and abuse of all of the children who came to your state for therapy. ALL OF THESE UTAH FACILITIES SHOULD BE SHUT DOWN. SHOW ME ONE THAT IS not abusive. This program sounds like an abusive behavior modification program.  Read about the death of NIC CONTRERAZ. Every one of the boys testified that staff had ignored his week long plea for medical care and treatment. Instead they beat him, forced him to excercise while he had breathing problems, forced him to put his head into a bucket filled with feces and vomit. These staff also beat boys - pushed them into the walls and beat their heads against walls. They even broke a wall as a result of pusing one of the boys. These staff members are examples of the types of people the teen industry looks for. They don't want nice.
I still remember applying for a job at a now closed facility in California. Right away the interviewer told me - "you are too nice, you wont be able to set limits." He was able to see that I was the type of person who would not abuse the kids - he could sence that I had ethics and would be the type of person who would not hessitate to report the abuse I observed.  This industry looks for people who can either inflict abuse or look the other way when kids are being abused.  I suspect this was an abusive program. It will take more than the testimony of a naive resident of Cedar City Utah to change my opinion.  There are just too many reports of abuse and the children have no way to report their abuse.  Obviously the other boys in this program were inhibited for some reason from getting help for over 2 hours. When they did alert another employee - this employee had to go and check out the story first - instead of immediately calling the police. All of these things worked against the survival of this individual, Mr. Arnett - because time was of the essence.    
These programs are big money makers - each child has a price tag.  It's all about money. Many who work in the problem teen industry are sadistic perverts. Look at what was done to the prisoners in Iraq. Some of those who were responsible had been previously employed in corrections. This industry attracts sadists, masochists, perverts and pediophiles. I'm not saying this gentleman who died was one of these types - he may be have been a great person.  Was he gay? Was he a pedeophile? Maybe not - but this is an important question that must be asked.  Where these boys abused - maybe not - but this question must also be answered.  I don't want to hear these answers from someone who was employed at the facility. I, for one, want to hear these answers from the students who attended this program and the actual boys involved. The people of Utah are biased since thousands are employed in the teen-help industry in some capacity.  
The venue for this trial must be changed - this can not take place in Cedar City - for obvious reasons.  

The internet interprets censorship as damage and routes around it.
--John Gilmour

[ This Message was edited by: cherish wisdom on 2004-05-12 03:39 ]

[cherish wisdom]

To the anonymous CEDAR CITY GYM boy:

YOU SAY YOU WANT JUSTICE! There has been no justice for all of the children who have been tortured in these youth programs in the state of Utah. This should be an embarassment to a state where 50% of the population are members of a church that professes to abhor child abuse and torture and unrigheous dominion. OPEN your eyes and read about the torturous deaths of Aaron Bacon and Michelle Sutton.  There are many others. These children not only died horrid and painful deaths - they suffered for days, if not weeks.  The last words that they heard while on this earth were words of ridicule and cruelty. If there is any justice in the State of Utah - those responsible would have been imprissoned. WELL - they were not.  The most any staff member has been punished for participating in the torture death of a youth in one of the many programs in Utah was ONE YEAR - and that was for one of the staff members responsible for the painful and inhumane treatment and resultant death of Aaron Bacon.  READ THE ACTUAL COURT RECORDS - it's all there in black and white.  In many of the deaths charges were dropped or not even filed.
You also said that you saw the director in WAL MART with all 11 boys.  Do you even read the local paper? There were only 6 boys in the program. This is why the director wanted to keep these boys in the program an additional $10,000 per month.  It's all about money.  THIS IS AN EVIL INDUSTRY that preys on families in crisis. There have been hundreds of  former students who have reported their abusive treatment in Utah based youth programs.  
Majestic has many of the characteristics of all of the other abusive programs. It is apparent that a lid has been placed on this case by those in UTAH who desire to keep the status quo.  
These boys deserve a fair trial with an unbiased and impartial jury pool. They will not get this in Cedar City Utah.
It is not fair to place blame on parent for the waywardness of youth. It happens in the best of homes because it is NORMAL.  These boys did something stupid in a desparate effort to escape. We don't know if they were being sexually, psychologically or physically abused.  Perhaps this will come out in trial.  
There is such an obvious bias now that the tables are turned.  Remember all of the children who have died and the hundreds who've had their bodies bashed, drugged and beaten.  
These children have no way out of these abusive programs. They can't pick up a phone and dial
1-800 sav a kid.  They can't use the internet and e-mail child protective services or an attorney when they are being beaten, starved and neglected in unimaginably inhumane ways.  
People of Cedar City - is there JUSTICE - was there JUSTICE for Aaron, Michele and Ian.  Was there JUSTICE for Nic Contreraz in Arizona?   These children suffered agonizing deaths and were denied life saving medical care.  
There programs frequently deprive children of appropriate medical care for a REASON. THEY do not want the medical professionals to report them to child protective services when they see all of the brusing, abrasions and hear the testimonies of these scared children.  If this were to happen they would loose money and that wouldn't be good for business.  
This industry is NOT ABOUT HELPING KIDS get on the right track - ITS ALL ABOUT MAKING MONEY - lots of it.  Most of the directors of these fraudulent programs don't have any type of professional degree and the techniques used to change behavior boarder on human torture and are probably a violation of international law.  

These children and their families deserve better. Majestic Ranch was a fraud. It wasn't a ranch - it was a house in a residential neighborhood with a security lock-down system.  AHQUIN was stuffing his wallet with hundred dollar bills.  Each boy represented an income of $5,000 per month.  How many people make $5,000 per month in Utah, let alone $55,000?  This is what he would have made if all 11 boys were enrolled.  He was only making $30,000 and was below capacity.  Did he want to loose that $10,000 per month?  Of course not.  This was about money, torture, dominion, fraud.
I know for a fact that staff lie to parents to keep kids in programs longer.  ESPECIALLY when they are not at capacity.
 

If the personal freedoms guaranteed by the Constitution inhibit the
government's ability to govern the people, we should look to limit those guarantees.

--President Bill Clinton

[Anonymous]

Cherish Wisdom - you would have a better chance keeping kids out of programs if you focused on exposing the network of ed cons and independent referral services for their role in helping these programs meet their enrollment capacity.  Where do you think the majority of these programs get their meal tickets??  Come now, wake up and smell the greased palms.

[spots]

On 2004-05-12 08:26:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Cherish Wisdom - you would have a better chance keeping kids out of programs if you focused on exposing the network of ed cons and independent referral services for their role in helping these programs meet their enrollment capacity.  Where do you think the majority of these programs get their meal tickets??  Come now, wake up and smell the greased palms."

Does anybody have a handle on how most of these kids get sent to behavior modification facilities?  Even an anecdotal guess would be informative.  How many parents respond to ads in Sunset and Southern Living?  How many kids are adjudicated, sent by some court authority as an alternative to jail?  How many referrals from "satisfied parents" wanting a hefty kickback to lessen their own monetary obligation?  How many go because their parents fill out a form from the programs, and...guess what?...their kids suits the problem profile to a "T"?  How many have to leave their home environment because their parents spent hours upon hours on the Internet, whining to other clueless people like the strugglingteens.com cronies?

I didn't even know such a thing as an Educational Consultant existed until I was months into the WWASPS experience.  I suspect aiming at this tiny segment is #1)worthless because their impact is statistically so small, and #2) a dandy diversionary tactic of deflecting heat off the true perpetrators in this industry.

[cherish wisdom]

I agree that educational consultants who recommend these facilities are part of the problem - again cashing in on families in crisis. Many of these consulting firms are part of the teen help umbrella (all bad in my opinion). Most families and children go in like lambs to the slauter - without a clue of the horrors associated with this terrible industry. I don't think I'm warning anyone here on this site - most of you know what's going on.  There is a huge problem - the majority of Americans are not aware that this is happening. Look at the websites for these facilities and the reports from "educational consultants." They are fraudlent and deceptive. People just buy into this.

I think that all right-thinking people in this country are sick and tired of being told that ordinary, decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired.  I'm certainly not!  But I'm sick and tired of being told that I am!  
-- Monty Python

[Anonymous]

I didn't even know such a thing as an Educational Consultant existed until I was months into the WWASPS experience. I suspect aiming at this tiny segment is #1)worthless because their impact is statistically so small, and #2) a dandy diversionary tactic of deflecting heat off the true perpetrators in this industry.

You "suspect"  :lol:

I did not know the industry existed until I met an ed con.  The diversinary tactic you speak of is it that of diverting teens from one set of programs into another?

[Anonymous]

Ian August,(deceased) referred by Educational Consultant to Skyline Journey (license revoked)

Ryan Lewis,(deceased) referred by Educational Consultant to Alldredge Academy (aka Ayne Institute)

Joseph Giannone, referred by Educational Consultant to Ayne Institute. Parents filed lawsuit alleging negligence and fraud.

2 kids dead, 1 seriously injured.  

And that's the SHORT LIST.

 :flame:

[cherish wisdom]

Not to change the subject from CEDAR CITY - but many therapists and psychiatrists are also recommending residential therapy to families. It's a new TREND in the psych industry as more of these facilities become available. Unfortunately families are not warned of the dangers. Just look at the web site for this Majesitc Ranch facility.

When cryptography is outlawed, bayl bhgynjf jvyy unir cevinpl.
--
Anonymous . . . for obvious reasons

[Anonymous]

On 2004-05-12 20:23:00, Anonymous wrote:

"

I didn't even know such a thing as an Educational Consultant existed until I was months into the WWASPS experience. I suspect aiming at this tiny segment is #1)worthless because their impact is statistically so small, and #2) a dandy diversionary tactic of deflecting heat off the true perpetrators in this industry.

You "suspect"  :roll:

[spots]

I did not know the industry existed until I met an ed con.

I need some help understanding your situation.  Do people really consult/buy the services of an educational consultant without knowing that behavior modification facilities exist and have a bad reputation?  Wouldn't a parent do a little research on their own on what to do with their kid (the Internet and Google, for example) before finding an ed con?  How DO you find an ed con, anyway?  Do they advertise?  Where?  Are there educational consultants who "help" parents find just regular boarding schools, those stone-wall edifices that can really give your kid a good education, one that can guarantee acceptance to an Ivy League university?  The only ed cons I know about are those referred to on this forum...e.g., Lon Woodbury and Sue Scheff, etc.  They seem to specialize in "therapeutic" solutions.  Do they do other "more regular" referrals?  I'm not understanding what you say about not knowing "the industry" existed until you met an ed con.  What were you meeting an ed con for, anyway?

The diversinary tactic you speak of is it that of diverting teens from one set of programs into another? "

By diversionary tactic... I mean that getting all worked up about ed cons is energy better spent getting all worked up about "the industry".  If we have a finite amount of energy to devote to stopping this abusive "industry", I feel it is counter-productive to spend much on beating up educational consultants.  Yes, they're bad, but it seems to me ("I suspect") it's a lot like killing the messenger.  As I said (and you quoted me), attacking the ed cons with gusto while overlooking the Utah brigade is "a dandy diversionary tactic of deflecting heat off the true perpetrators in this industry".  That's shooting a flame-thrower at the marionette (ed con) while the puppeteer happily pulls strings hiding behind the fireproof curtain.  

If you are a regular reader of this forum, you should know that's how I feel (unless this is the first post from Spots you have ever read).  "Diverting teens from one set of programs into another?"  Well, I really can't deal with that statement, since it comes out of left field and is obviously not my often-stated sentiment.  I said I thought attacking ed cons was a waste of time.  Pretty straight-forward. Nothing was said about the strategy of diverting teens from one program to another, except for the quote above, and again, I really don't understand what you're talking about.