Sue Scheff

[TheWho]

Cut the crappola Who.  You are a parent who outsourced the raising of your child to an industry that couldn't make a dime without enabling parents to blame their kid for their own lousy parenting skills.  I don't care how many DX you claim your child has/had to justify institutionalizing them.  Just telling your parents to fuck off is defined as a "conduct disorder" rather than normal teenage behavior that in the old days might get a kid grounded for a week, not locked up for a year or more of behavior modification.  You make me ill.  Go post on Cafety with the other program apologists and sell out survivors. 

Any parent reading this, the above post is a classic response from a kid who screwed up at home and screwed up again and never finished the program he was in and will be forever in limbo blaming his parents and every school he attended for his screwed up life.  It irks him to hear about the kids who graduated and are doing fine and reunited with their families.

[Anonymous]

Its everyones job when it comes to children.  Anyone who can make a positive affect be it a teacher, uncle parent or friend.

No, its not everyone's job.  Its the PARENT'S job.  It's be nice to have extended family and friends help, but they can't solve the problem(s).  It's not the job of teachers to teach life lessons or 'character building'.  It's the PARENT'S job. 

Most of the kids at the programs are good kids that dont need a program. they need something called LIFE EXPERIENCE. you dont get that at programs. they give a false, highly censored experience usually modeled after the program founder's/director's view of reality.

Soooooooo, so true!!!!!!

so in the end, there is no need for programs. There still is a need for inpatient rehabs and psychiatric hospitals, along with short-term RTC's for court ordered nonviolent juvenile offenders. programs like those run by NATSAP and WWASPS along with others have no legitimate place in this society. please stop trying to make it look like these programs deserve a ligitimate spot in this society, culture, and economy. they dont.

Yes, yes and YES!

They are already successful and working well.

Ummm, care to cite any sources on that opinion of yours?

100 years ago they sent kids away.  They just didn’t call them programs… homes for boys or Aunt Marthas farm (wilderness)… different name different era.



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Yep.  Ever see Sleepers?  They were just as dangerous psychologically, for the same reasons.  You can't force or coerce 'therapy' without doing damage.  First, do no harm.

[Anonymous]

http://www.encyclopediadramatica.com/Sue_Scheff

[Anonymous]

Any parent reading this, the above post is a classic response from a kid who screwed up at home and screwed up again and never finished the program he was in and will be forever in limbo blaming his parents and every school he attended for his screwed up life.  It irks him to hear about the kids who graduated and are doing fine and reunited with their families.

Out of the 30 or so kids that graduated HLA with me, only a handful are doing relatively well, (as in only four, including myself). And i'm doing well not because of HLA, but despite HLA. i still smoke tons of weed, but i get great grades, and am going to law school soon. my parents grew up to the fact that they cant control my life, only support it, and that's exactly what they do, regardless of if they think I'm doing something right or wrong. I've rid my mind of HLA's brainwashing to great benefit. I can tell you actually that HLA's program creates the exact opposite of what a good lawyer should be, it instills all the bad habits. it's been alot of work trying to overcome those negative habits (like not arguing, and submitting to anything an elder says)

Most of the other kids that i know either got pregnant, became wannabe pornstars, got sent to jail, joined the armed forces, had a sex change, got into hard drugs, or got married before they even turned 20, never went to college and are now stereotypical white trash. the ones who went to college, they are (take a wild guess) BINGE DRINKING ALCOHOLICS. why? because HLA never taught them responsible drinking, they taught them how to be alcoholics. they never were alcoholics before HLA, only after.  I am posting in their defense. they are tortured individuals who are torn between what they truly know is right in their guts, and what they were ingrained to think is right by HLA.  if they didn't have the negative influence of HLA, they would not be where they are now, i can guarantee it without a single doubt.

[Anonymous]

By the way, who, you make "throwing in the towel" seem like such a bad bad thing.

you missed my point:

TIME TAKES IT'S COURSE.

most of the kids dont need help. they need time to grow up.

parents often dont realize that what they thing is "wrong" is in fact very normal.

take for example, homosexuality. Plenty of programs claim to "cure" it. now, are you going to say that homosexuality is a "problem"?

smoking weed: a recent newsweek article stated that 40% of americans smoked weed in their lifetime, 6% of americans still smoke it regularly. of the 40% that ever smoked weed, something 99% percent picked it up in their teen years and dropped it in their early twenties. take that, "addiction".

hard drugs: there something called an inpatient rehab, along with preventive measures such as actually talking to your kids about the difference between hard and soft drugs, and not blanketing all drugs as bad (which is why many kids dont see the difference between coke and weed, and why many get into coke or other bad drugs)

alcoholism: maybe if the parents were not alcoholics, the kids wouldn't be either. and maybe if the parents had the kid drink some wine or beer at dinner every once in a while, it would eliminate the mystique behind the alcohol, and the kids would not find it as amusing once they have the opportunity to drink alot (hello college or high school binge drinkers turned alcoholics)

and to the kids who just throw tantrums and are "angry" all the time...thats kids being kids. it's also parents doing stuff that pisses the kid off. maybe the parents should start thinking about stopping pissing their kid off constantly, and leave them be.

as i said, proper parenting and time is all that is needed for 99.99% of the cases. you make it seem like every kid with problems in part of that .01 percent of kids that actually need to be sent away.

some kids do need to be sent away, but they are rare. anyone know patrick shin or chyna masteller? that's the two in a million cases that actually need to be sent away.

[Anonymous]

Cut the crappola Who.  You are a parent who outsourced the raising of your child to an industry that couldn't make a dime without enabling parents to blame their kid for their own lousy parenting skills.  I don't care how many DX you claim your child has/had to justify institutionalizing them.  Just telling your parents to fuck off is defined as a "conduct disorder" rather than normal teenage behavior that in the old days might get a kid grounded for a week, not locked up for a year or more of behavior modification.  You make me ill.  Go post on Cafety with the other program apologists and sell out survivors. 

Any parent reading this, the above post is a classic response from a kid who screwed up at home and screwed up again and never finished the program he was in and will be forever in limbo blaming his parents and every school he attended for his screwed up life.  It irks him to hear about the kids who graduated and are doing fine and reunited with their families.

Classic response from the eternally washed.  You've been trained to believe that all criticism of your precious program is from those damn druggies who just couldn't accept the help.  Couldn't be that people have regained the critical thinking skills that AARC tried so desperately to crush now, could it? 

[Anonymous]

Cut the crappola Who.  You are a parent who outsourced the raising of your child to an industry that couldn't make a dime without enabling parents to blame their kid for their own lousy parenting skills.  I don't care how many DX you claim your child has/had to justify institutionalizing them.  Just telling your parents to fuck off is defined as a "conduct disorder" rather than normal teenage behavior that in the old days might get a kid grounded for a week, not locked up for a year or more of behavior modification.  You make me ill.  Go post on Cafety with the other program apologists and sell out survivors. 

Any parent reading this, the above post is a classic response from a kid who screwed up at home and screwed up again and never finished the program he was in and will be forever in limbo blaming his parents and every school he attended for his screwed up life.  It irks him to hear about the kids who graduated and are doing fine and reunited with their families.

Classic response from the eternally washed.  You've been trained to believe that all criticism of your precious program is from those damn druggies who just couldn't accept the help.  Couldn't be that people have regained the critical thinking skills that AARC tried so desperately to crush now, could it? 

Woops.  AARC/WWASP/STRAIGHT  whatever.  Slightly different wrapper, same poison.

[psy]

the ones who went to college, they are (take a wild guess) BINGE DRINKING ALCOHOLICS. why? because HLA never taught them responsible drinking, they taught them how to be alcoholics. they never were alcoholics before HLA, only after.

This phenomenon is not an isolated instance, by any means.  Here are some stats to back what you've said up:

There is also experimental evidence that the A.A. doctrine of powerlessness leads to binge drinking. In a sophisticated controlled study of A.A.'s effectiveness (Brandsma et. al.), court-mandated offenders who had been sent to Alcoholics Anonymous for several months were engaging in FIVE TIMES as much binge drinking as another group of alcoholics who got no treatment at all, and the A.A. group was doing NINE TIMES as much binge drinking as another group of alcoholics who got rational behavior therapy.

Those results are almost unbelievable, but are easy to understand -- when you are drunk, it's easy to rationalize drinking some more by saying,

"Oh well, A.A. says that I'm powerless over alcohol. I can't control it, so there is no sense in trying. I'm doomed, because I already took a drink. I'm screwed, because I already lost all of my sober time. Might as well just relax and enjoy it. Pass that bottle over here, buddy."
It's also easy to rationalize taking the first drink with,

"I'm powerless. I can't help it. The Big Book says that I have no defense against those strange mental blank spots when I'll drink again. Bottoms up!"

[emphasis added]
source

[Dr Fucktard]

Any parent reading this, the above post is a classic response from a kid who screwed up at home and screwed up again and never finished the program he was in and will be forever in limbo blaming his parents and every school he attended for his screwed up life.  It irks him to hear about the kids who graduated and are doing fine and reunited with their families.

Hear, hear!

http://fornits.com/SIBS

[TheWho]

By the way, who, you make "throwing in the towel" seem like such a bad bad thing.

you missed my point:

TIME TAKES IT'S COURSE.

most of the kids dont need help. they need time to grow up.

parents often dont realize that what they thing is "wrong" is in fact very normal.

take for example, homosexuality. Plenty of programs claim to "cure" it. now, are you going to say that homosexuality is a "problem"?

smoking weed: a recent newsweek article stated that 40% of americans smoked weed in their lifetime, 6% of americans still smoke it regularly. of the 40% that ever smoked weed, something 99% percent picked it up in their teen years and dropped it in their early twenties. take that, "addiction".

hard drugs: there something called an inpatient rehab, along with preventive measures such as actually talking to your kids about the difference between hard and soft drugs, and not blanketing all drugs as bad (which is why many kids dont see the difference between coke and weed, and why many get into coke or other bad drugs)

alcoholism: maybe if the parents were not alcoholics, the kids wouldn't be either. and maybe if the parents had the kid drink some wine or beer at dinner every once in a while, it would eliminate the mystique behind the alcohol, and the kids would not find it as amusing once they have the opportunity to drink alot (hello college or high school binge drinkers turned alcoholics)

and to the kids who just throw tantrums and are "angry" all the time...thats kids being kids. it's also parents doing stuff that pisses the kid off. maybe the parents should start thinking about stopping pissing their kid off constantly, and leave them be.

as i said, proper parenting and time is all that is needed for 99.99% of the cases. you make it seem like every kid with problems in part of that .01 percent of kids that actually need to be sent away.

some kids do need to be sent away, but they are rare. anyone know patrick shin or chyna masteller? that's the two in a million cases that actually need to be sent away.

Great points made....
I think we agree,  not all kids need to be sent away.  It is the very small minority (less than 1%) who do not respond at home and need outside help.  The majority of the kids just need time to grow and figure stuff out on their own.  The key is to not overreact and let the kids make mistakes and work thru these tough social issues on their own…. Most will get thru it okay.



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[Botched Programming]

Oh my God...... The who slithered back in..... I guess he got kicked out of wherever it is that he had been creating mahen and madness and figured he would just come back here to cause more disharmony...

[Anonymous]

[Anonymous]

By the way, who, you make "throwing in the towel" seem like such a bad bad thing.

you missed my point:

TIME TAKES IT'S COURSE.

most of the kids dont need help. they need time to grow up.

parents often dont realize that what they thing is "wrong" is in fact very normal.

take for example, homosexuality. Plenty of programs claim to "cure" it. now, are you going to say that homosexuality is a "problem"?

smoking weed: a recent newsweek article stated that 40% of americans smoked weed in their lifetime, 6% of americans still smoke it regularly. of the 40% that ever smoked weed, something 99% percent picked it up in their teen years and dropped it in their early twenties. take that, "addiction".

hard drugs: there something called an inpatient rehab, along with preventive measures such as actually talking to your kids about the difference between hard and soft drugs, and not blanketing all drugs as bad (which is why many kids dont see the difference between coke and weed, and why many get into coke or other bad drugs)

alcoholism: maybe if the parents were not alcoholics, the kids wouldn't be either. and maybe if the parents had the kid drink some wine or beer at dinner every once in a while, it would eliminate the mystique behind the alcohol, and the kids would not find it as amusing once they have the opportunity to drink alot (hello college or high school binge drinkers turned alcoholics)

and to the kids who just throw tantrums and are "angry" all the time...thats kids being kids. it's also parents doing stuff that pisses the kid off. maybe the parents should start thinking about stopping pissing their kid off constantly, and leave them be.

as i said, proper parenting and time is all that is needed for 99.99% of the cases. you make it seem like every kid with problems in part of that .01 percent of kids that actually need to be sent away.

some kids do need to be sent away, but they are rare. anyone know patrick shin or chyna masteller? that's the two in a million cases that actually need to be sent away.

Great points made....
I think we agree,  not all kids need to be sent away.  It is the very small minority (less than 1%) who do not respond at home and need outside help.  The majority of the kids just need time to grow and figure stuff out on their own.  The key is to not overreact and let the kids make mistakes and work thru these tough social issues on their own…. Most will get thru it okay.



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The problem is these "companies" (aka faux treatment centers) are MARKETING to parents to resolve any type of behavior problem.  They are even marketing to parents who are seeking help for their children who have been diagnosed with mental disorders.  I have even seen them claiming to turn around asperger's (form of autism).  There may be children who need and seek outside help.  Abusive programs-- all those programs that use behavior modification and persuasive tactics are not the kind of "HELP" these kids need.