Author Topic: level of education attained by program parents and...  (Read 13431 times)

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Offline Antigen

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level of education attained by program parents and...
« Reply #90 on: December 19, 2007, 08:45:35 AM »
Quote from: ""Oz girl""
So I can strongly see the cult argument

Ginger I recall you once saying your dad eventually came to see Straight and the seed differently to your mum. What do you think turned him around? afterall you were not the only kid in your family to go through this.


Well, my dad was not so fully bought in as my mom was. And that's what makes me think of the ammunition for divorce angle. My conversation with my sil reminded me of that. The program stoked and stroked my mom's martyrdom wrt my dad. This was clear to me about the whole thing, even as a little kid. For a long time, he was banned from the house whenever my older brothers were home. He always had been ambivalent. He was scared shitless that pot smoking would lead to a whole generation of Manson family murders and such. But he also was skeptical of Art Barker, to whom he referred quite correctly as a "professional alcoholic" just like grandpa--his father in law. But then he also went so far as to take time out of his protest walk from Florida to DC to try and have me falsely arrested to 'save my life'.

I think distance had a lot to do with his coming around. My mom had actually talked him into remarrying her on the pretense that the divorce (which happened when I had been no older than 5 or 6) was the reason for my misbehavior. That lasted almost a month after I was out of the house. Without me to pick on she set right to work getting him a little more straight. That ended with a coffee cup lodged in the drywall of the kitchen and him speeding across state back to Pompano with a light bag and full head of steam. LOL I think she kept it there for a couple of months just to illustrate her suffering.

I beat him to Pompano and to our old family friend, who was his lover for the last 20 years or so of his life, by a couple of weeks. I think he just couldn't make the Program doom-saying jive with what he was seeing. I had my problems, no doubt. I was probably as tweaky and strange as any other recent program vet. But I worked, paid my bills, never had any serious legal trouble or in any way acted like the fictional latent junkie he had been promised I would be if I ever left the program.

My mother, on the other hand, had taken to it like a fish to water. She kept her house open as a program "foster home" (later to be called host homes due to the existance of a legal term of art to go with the term "foster home") and kept turning up at open meetings even after they quit sending her kids. I heard  years later from a friend who had been on staff at the time that they actually had a staff meeting and delegated some poor shmoe to take her aside and tell her to just go away cause it was too weird how she kept hanging around.

After that, she took to supporting some charity to help pregnant teenagers. I thought that was a pretty good thing at the time, but I hadn't heard of the Bethel type teen 'maternity homes'. I don't know what happened to all that, but in later years she gave over the last of her cash (us kids' inheritence, in other words) to the Billy Graham Crusade. I think she was just beggin' ta crawl, as they say. She loved it.

I think that well explains characters like the Who. Sure, he's making money. But I bet he fully believes that he's investing himself body mind and soul in the most wholesome, good and worthwhile endevour ever imagined. Cults are like that.
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Offline Oz girl

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level of education attained by program parents and...
« Reply #91 on: December 19, 2007, 09:16:28 AM »
Wow. Something about the image of your mum hanging around at a rehab meeting when none of her loved ones are actually being "treated" anymore makes me feel a little sad. It is like she wanted an addiction all of her own. This mentality reminds me of that mental illness where people make their kids ill just to take care of them Meunchhousens or something.
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Offline AuntieEm2

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level of education attained by program parents and...
« Reply #92 on: December 19, 2007, 10:18:27 AM »
Guest wrote:
Quote
do you think if parents are in the "arts" they are less likely to put their kids away?

Not sure where these questions are coming from. People here have described all sorts of professions, ages, religions, and family circumstances. I gather that program parents represent a cross-section of society. But perhaps you are trying to ask what do they have in common? What is the difference between the parents who do send their "troubled teen" (god, I hate that term) to a program, and those who do not? Is that what you are trying to learn?

Auntie Em
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Offline TheWho

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level of education attained by program parents and...
« Reply #93 on: December 19, 2007, 10:47:59 AM »
Quote from: ""AuntieEm2""
Guest wrote:
Quote
do you think if parents are in the "arts" they are less likely to put their kids away?
Not sure where these questions are coming from. People here have described all sorts of professions, ages, religions, and family circumstances. I gather that program parents represent a cross-section of society. But perhaps you are trying to ask what do they have in common? What is the difference between the parents who do send their "troubled teen" (god, I hate that term) to a program, and those who do not? Is that what you are trying to learn?

Auntie Em


I think that is where we see the whole cult aspect of some of these places... wanting to be part of a group maybe.
Places like straight are definitely different than than many of the other schools/TBS's.  After reading through this thread I have to wonder if we broke the question down into another sub-set and looked at what the parents have in common that send their children to cult-like places (straight) and those that send their children away to Therapeutic Boarding Schools.  Would we see a common link or trait in economic standing, education, releigion etc. within these groupings?  Interesting thought.



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Offline Anonymous

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level of education attained by program parents and...
« Reply #94 on: December 19, 2007, 10:56:34 AM »
all programs are cult-like!
not just straight!


thats because ALL programs are BASED on straight in some way or another. Thewho, if you want people to belive you, define cult. then bring me a program that does not fit any of the definitions. you will be shit out of luck.
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Offline Froderik

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level of education attained by program parents and...
« Reply #95 on: December 19, 2007, 10:56:35 AM »
Quote from: ""Guest""
do you think if parents are in the "arts" they are less likely to put their kids away?

No, as some programs pander more toward them...
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Offline Anne Bonney

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« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
traight, St. Pete, early 80s
AA is a cult http://www.orange-papers.org/orange-cult.html

The more boring a child is, the more the parents, when showing off the child, receive adulation for being good parents-- because they have a tame child-creature in their house.  ~~  Frank Zappa

Offline TheWho

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« Reply #97 on: December 19, 2007, 12:00:50 PM »
What I was trying to point out or suggest is we could look at the differences between a straight like programs, Seed, CEDU and the traditional programs of today (TBS)…. (some are more cult like than others) and take a look at the parents that send their kids to Straight, seed, CEDU vs the parents that send their kids to TBS of today and see if there are any differences.
If you see them all as a cult, then that is okay, but maybe there are differences (distinct subsets) within this set.



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Offline Troll Control

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« Reply #98 on: December 19, 2007, 12:15:43 PM »
Quote from: ""TheWho""
What I was trying to point out or suggest is we could look at the differences between a straight like programs, Seed, CEDU and the traditional programs of today (TBS)…. (some are more cult like than others) and take a look at the parents that send their kids to Straight, seed, CEDU vs the parents that send their kids to TBS of today and see if there are any differences.
If you see them all as a cult, then that is okay, but maybe there are differences (distinct subsets) within this set.



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Look no further than the mirror, jackass.  ASR is a CEDU spinoff.  Geez.
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Offline TheWho

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level of education attained by program parents and...
« Reply #99 on: December 19, 2007, 12:36:28 PM »
Quote from: ""Guest""
Quote from: ""TheWho""
What I was trying to point out or suggest is we could look at the differences between a straight like programs, Seed, CEDU and the traditional programs of today (TBS)…. (some are more cult like than others) and take a look at the parents that send their kids to Straight, seed, CEDU vs the parents that send their kids to TBS of today and see if there are any differences.
If you see them all as a cult, then that is okay, but maybe there are differences (distinct subsets) within this set.



...

Look no further than the mirror, jackass.  ASR is a CEDU spinoff.  Geez.


Wow, and some people complain if I disrespect survivor, go figure.
Let me try to break it down for you then.  There is an industry called the transportation industry and they all transport people and things i.e. cars, trains, boats, planes etc. a subset of the transportation industry is the Automotive industry.  Within this industry there are minivans, pickup trucks, sedans, sports cars etc…. each one of these is designed to attract a different type of person.  For example a mini van may attract more people with kids where as a sports car would attract a single person.

The original post was asking program parents questions like what they did for a living etc. and we saw that they pretty much ran the full spectrum and had very little in common with the exception of having a child getting help outside the home .
If we took the same questions and asked what type of program they went to we may start seeing dispersity or something in common with the parents within subsets.

Seed, CEDU, Straight
Boot camp
Juvenile detention center
Wilderness
Therapeutic Boarding schools


And maybe there are distinctions even within those categories.  I am not arguing the whole cult thing.. I had a friend growing up who could convince you almost every group was a cult…if a family had more than 1 reunion a year he would consider it a cult!!!



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Offline Botched Programming

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level of education attained by program parents and...
« Reply #100 on: December 19, 2007, 12:59:57 PM »
Good God Who ......... Why are you trying to compare the "Transportation Industry" to the "Troubled Teen Industry"

That's comparing apples to oranges..... It's not the same thing.

There is no amount of your justification on your part will ever change the fact that all "Programs" are screwed up.

You have not got to see the later in life side effects on even your own daughter of being tucked away for storage in one of these shit pits. Sometimes the brainwashing don't come to light until years down the road, however on fact remains true amongst all survivors .... It does happen and when it does it comes out ugly and sideways. Then you have to actually deal with it the rest of your life.

Even God don't give penance or forgiveness for that sin.
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Offline Froderik

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« Reply #101 on: December 19, 2007, 01:06:26 PM »
I wonder if this back-and-forth with TheWho will ever end.
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Offline TheWho

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« Reply #102 on: December 19, 2007, 01:10:21 PM »
Quote from: ""Botched Programming""
Good God Who ......... Why are you trying to compare the "Transportation Industry" to the "Troubled Teen Industry"

That's comparing apples to oranges..... It's not the same thing.

There is no amount of your justification on your part will ever change the fact that all "Programs" are screwed up.

You have not got to see the later in life side effects on even your own daughter of being tucked away for storage in one of these shit pits. Sometimes the brainwashing don't come to light until years down the road, however on fact remains true amongst all survivors .... It does happen and when it does it comes out ugly and sideways. Then you have to actually deal with it the rest of your life.

Even God don't give penance or forgiveness for that sin.


Ha,Ha,Ha,  It becomes very clear why nothing is organized here.  You missed the entire point, Botched (or you were thinking of a different thread, I have done that dont feel bad).  Read the original post and then read my last post.  We are not talking about brainwashing, shortterm, longterm effects.  We were taking a look at the program parents and what they had in common (if anything).  The car analogy is intended as an example of how an industry can be categorized to better view the industry as a whole, we are not trying to compare the kids to cars, but trying to apply a categorization to the Troubled teen industry which may help break down some common traits among program parents.  This may give us better insight as to what types of parents send their kids to the various programs.



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Offline jjpinks

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« Reply #103 on: December 19, 2007, 01:18:54 PM »
Quote from: ""Froderik""
I wonder if this back-and-forth with TheWho will ever end.



I am really beginning to doubt it.  :roll:
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Offline Botched Programming

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« Reply #104 on: December 19, 2007, 01:22:00 PM »
No.... You just want to side track everyone and try to push your own beliefs on people, and or sway a parents decision so it will put another dollar in your pocket.

The only thing that most of the parents have in common is having the financial ability to pay the tuition and/or because the salesmans song and dance he puts on for the parents.

Hell program salesmen are worse than a used car salesman that sells you a car knowing that your are getting a lemon.
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