Author Topic: Medical Neglect Knows No Boundaries  (Read 12816 times)

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Offline Froderik

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Medical Neglect Knows No Boundaries
« Reply #30 on: October 31, 2007, 09:10:49 AM »
Gobshite... :rofl: ... :rofl: .. I laugh every time I read that..

It's British sounding, of course; where did you come across it?
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #31 on: October 31, 2007, 01:16:58 PM »
Quote from: ""Che Gookin""
Quote from: ""Guest""
Like it or not, the fact is children are being forced to take drugs that can cause serious side effects - in this case - constipation.  There are plenty of people who can and should be held accountable for failing to protect this child, not the least of which are the child's own family who may or may not have even been aware of the true risk these meds posed to this young girl's life.  My impression is the family was at the end of their rope and understandably, believed the doctors and hospital staff were trained to deal with any situation or emergency. Who can blame them for feeling that way?  I sure can't.  This was a preventable death beginning with the prescription and forced administration of the very drugs that caused the constipation in the first place.

I wouldn't consider dragging the family through the judical mud over this mind you but it ought to definitely serve as an object lesson for all parents.

DON'T trust the damn meds or take a doctor's word for it. You see this sort of crap time and time again. By now one would hope parents would be a bit more wary of this sort of thing.

Given time one hopes the word gets out a bit farther on these incidents. Sad that it takes a life to make a point.


And you know for a fact that this girl was forcibly on these meds?
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Offline Che Gookin

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« Reply #32 on: October 31, 2007, 10:59:02 PM »
Even kids at Three Springs had their med changes approved by their parents. So it is my belief that the meds were not administered in a forcible manner and that the parents had full knowledge of their daughter's med intake.

The object lesson here is did the parents think to ever question the doctor's suggestions?

They bloody well should of...


Froddy: Went scuba diving with a couple of limeys last week. They regaled me with tales of boozing, mongering, and other degeneracy in a delightful argot that for the most part left me unsure exactly what they were saying. Gobshite is one of the quaint litle britishisms I picked up.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #33 on: October 31, 2007, 11:30:26 PM »
Hmmm, good point TSW - but therein lies the rub.

The child is the one who has to take the meds yet they lack the maturity to give an informed consent in the true meaning of the term.  They must rely on the judgment of their parents who must rely on the opinion of the docs and their own due-diligence.

What concerns me is whether by law, parents are required to be educated about the side effects of the drugs they may authorize to be used on their child and receive further education on how to properly monitor their child when they are taking these drugs?

What happens when the child is in an out-of-home placement?  

At what age can children be allowed to give their consent?  What about Baker-Acted kids? This is really a gray area, IMO.  

Certainly this family was desperate for help and had a right to believe this child was being properly cared for.  For Christ's sake, she died in a hospital!!!
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #34 on: October 31, 2007, 11:39:42 PM »
I just re-read the article which was damn well written IMO, though we can't be sure of it's accuracy.

My question is this - is it just me or does anyone else think the DX of schzitophrenia (sp) might have been erroneous?  Could the drugs she was taking have caused the behavior that led to this DX?

Dang, this case really really bothers me.  I can NOT BELIEVE how this girl suffered.  The part where the staff can't enter the room, just peer through the door to check on her, blows my mind.  Is that SOP?  Do programs do that too?
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Offline Nihilanthic

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« Reply #35 on: October 31, 2007, 11:42:51 PM »
Quote
The child is the one who has to take the meds yet they lack the maturity to give an informed consent in the true meaning of the term. They must rely on the judgment of their parents who must rely on the opinion of the docs and their own due-diligence.


Time out.

Most kids in programs are in their mid to later teens. Most mid to alter teens CAN do that, and are charged as adults if they take RECREATIONAL Drugs.

Society clearly thinks they CAN make such decisions. We don't charge 8 year olds for MJ or coke, do we?

We DO charge 15 year olds.

Why the double standard?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
DannyB on the internet:I CALLED A LAWYER TODAY TO SEE IF I COULD SUE YOUR ASSES FOR DOING THIS BUT THAT WAS NOT POSSIBLE.

CCMGirl on program restraints: "DON\'T TAZ ME BRO!!!!!"

TheWho on program survivors: "From where I sit I see all the anit-program[sic] people doing all the complaining and crying."

Offline Che Gookin

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« Reply #36 on: October 31, 2007, 11:51:57 PM »
At three springs a kid in isolation is checked on every 15 minutes, but that is just one programme. No doubt it varies from programme to programme. The hospital really needs to be held to task for gross medical neglect on this one. The patients should be monitored on a frequent basis no matter what their condition.

What level of involvement the parents had in this case on a day to day basis remains to be seen. I'm thinking that probably they were pretty involved and this was all one hell of a surprise.


Now as much as I believe parents need to be far more responsible for their kid's medical needs there is a fly in the glue of my premise.

What sources do most parents have avaliable to them? i sincerely believe that in order for parents to be more responsible they need the information right at their fingertips. When you google most meds you get a conflicting set of returns. So how is the average parent supposed to wade through this crap?

Any ideas on how to get some medical advice to double check your regular doctors reccomendations without getting bent over a barrel to pay for it?

Also.. most kids baker acted, at least in florida, are for a 72 hour observation period. Is that long enough to really start handing out meds?

Kind of scary if they are doing that if you ask me.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #37 on: November 01, 2007, 12:00:53 AM »
Excellent point, Niles.

^^^^^
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #38 on: November 01, 2007, 12:21:33 AM »
Damn, I can't even pronounce the names of some of these drugs much less spell them.  Anybody ever seen an informed consent form?  I'd like to know just what the parent "consents" to and whether these forms are attached to a poop sheet detailing in layman terms the known side effects.  Searching the Internet for info would certainly return a mixed bag of info and opinions.  I agree there has to be a more efficient way to educate parents.  These are life and death issues.

As for the hospital chain of command from top to bottom, I don't know how they can sleep at night.  I'm sick of everybody passing the buck.
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Offline Che Gookin

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« Reply #39 on: November 01, 2007, 05:57:06 AM »
Quote
I'm sick of everybody passing the buck.


Me as well.. Parents do your jobs please? mm k? thanks.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #40 on: November 02, 2007, 12:13:01 PM »
Quote from: ""Nihilanthic""
My point, were you not so damned defensive....

...is that we're lacking common sense in this day and age. We don't need a huge study with PhD's and millions of dollars to realize if someone is in pain they're not going to be very pleasant to deal with, and that in neglecting our children and then punishing them for acting out we're only treating the symptoms of the problem, being ourselves.

I am not having fun at their expense... if its at anyone's expense its that of the quack fucks who let both of them die.

You're new here. I'm not. Look at my post count. I've been here since 03. I'm only 22 and Ive done more than I could tell you without spending a lot of time to put an end to this... you only came here after your child died when the system took you for a ride and he paid with his life.

Keep that in mind.

I'm here for those dead kids, the living but abused kids, and  I'm here to keep anyone else from dying, and anyone else from being abused, not to make fun of dead children. I suggest you learn to read sarcasm and read into what I'm getting at before snapping, and for that matter registering an account so you can edit your mistakes!

At any rate, you should cool off. I'm the last person who would make fun of a dead child, especially one who died in such a horrible way.


Well, you had quite a lot of fun at my expense when my son died. Let's see..you're 22, never been a parent, don't know anything about mental illness, and you've reportedly never been in a program, and you've been posting on fornits since 2003. Oh yeah, THAT makes you well qualified.  I've been a mom for over 15 years, dealt with the mental illness of one of my kids since 1997, raised another very well adjusted child, read countless books on mental illness, pharmacology, and parenting, spent thousands of $$ on family counseling, paid taxes and voted for over 30 years, but I'm just a stupid moron who murdered my kid, didn't love him enough,  and should be shot for my sins.  I don't see you doing much of anything but making fun of people. How, exactly, are you "here" for my dead son?

PB Mom
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #41 on: November 02, 2007, 12:29:18 PM »
If you're PB Mom, please sign in. We have plenty of troll imposters. Thanks.
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Offline Pitbull Mom

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« Reply #42 on: November 02, 2007, 01:16:13 PM »
Quote from: ""Che Gookin""
Even kids at Three Springs had their med changes approved by their parents. So it is my belief that the meds were not administered in a forcible manner and that the parents had full knowledge of their daughter's med intake.

The object lesson here is did the parents think to ever question the doctor's suggestions?

They bloody well should of...


Froddy: Went scuba diving with a couple of limeys last week. They regaled me with tales of boozing, mongering, and other degeneracy in a delightful argot that for the most part left me unsure exactly what they were saying. Gobshite is one of the quaint litle britishisms I picked up.


I can't speak for other parents, but I questioned every drug I ever authorized my son to take. All medication changes were discussed between all of us, my son, his doc, and me. I didn't use quack docs, and they always explained fully the side effects and anything serious to watch for, monitored weight changes and labs for proper dosages, etc.  Any parent who makes the difficult decision to put their child on mind altereing drugs had better be doing a lot of research on their own, and not just relying on what the doc says, or the prescription information that accompanies every RX by law. Many many medications being prescribed to kids have not been tested thoroughly on kids, so parents had better be paying attention, especially if they are not using a board certified child psychiatrist.

My son also googled meds he was on, and asked good questions. You can't force a 14 year old to take meds.

There are numerous good websites, other than the vendor's website where parents can get drug information, and also good drug interaction sites to check for interactions specific to all of the meds, vitamins and herbs being taken together, as well as any alcohol or self administered drugs kids might be taking.

But wait... I was a shitty mom, let me eat my gun now.
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Pitbull Mom

Offline Pitbull Mom

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« Reply #43 on: November 02, 2007, 01:17:51 PM »
Quote from: ""Guest""
If you're PB Mom, please sign in. We have plenty of troll imposters. Thanks.


that was me before, I was too busy trying not to eat my gun to log in. Seems everyone is posting as guest now, due to all the modifications to posts.
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Pitbull Mom

Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #44 on: November 02, 2007, 01:25:45 PM »
PB Mom,

Every situation is different - there isn't one size fits all. While I certainly cannot speak for them, I think some posters get impassioned about the cause and make generalizations. People get hurt and caught in those generalizations. Or maybe it's as simple as not being able to see eye to eye.

To everyone -
The point being, let's not lose sight of the common ground about why we are here. To prevent more deaths and abuse of kids at these places.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »