Educational Consultants

[TheWho]

Guest wrote:

This statement makes no sense at all. It sounds like you're suggesting a majority of parents are trying to take kids out of public schools and put them in Private Therapeutic Schools.

I guess it may be misconstrued as that.  I was trying to show that oversight and regulation don’t necessarily equate to safety.  The public sector is heavily regulated but the public schools are far from safe, in my opinion.
 

Do you have any independent statistics that can back up claims that Private Therapeutic Schools are safer than public schools? My child's own personal experience at HLA was filled with violence - something my child never experienced in public schools.

We have started pulling together data to compare a child living in the public sector vs the private sector, Based on the “National Center for Education Statistics” NCES and the “Centers for Disease Control and Prevention” CDC.  We have analyzed suicides, homicides in the public sector vs TBS, wilderness etc.  Here is what we have pulled together so far:
http://wwf.fornits.com/viewtopic.php?p=260816#260816

Sorry, but for an Ed Con not to meet with a child is absolute bullshit. That's like me going to a doctor on your behalf and telling the doctor you have headaches. He comes to the conclusion, solely based on what I tell him, that you have a brain tumor and we schedule you for surgery. Come to find out your headaches are actually caused by a food allergy, but because he had never met you and just took my word for it, you were misdiagnosed and not given the proper treatment or care. Pretty pathetic.

See this is where I am confused.  So what you are saying is the EdCons have formal training in diagnosing children’s ailments?  See I was under the impression they provided a service of finding a school for the child based on the child’s needs.  If I called an EdCon I wouldn’t expect them diagnose my child, I would expect them to find a school for me based on information provided to them by myself and the child’s advocate or therapist.  I wouldn’t rely on them to tell me my child had ODD, I would assess that locally thru a therapist or Doctor.  Having them meet the child  would be nice and necessary in some cases, maybe, but I don’t see it in all cases.

[Deborah]

EDUCATIONAL Consultants should not be making placements to THERAPEUTIC facilities. Even with a dx, can they really assess whether the facility will meet their needs or not? Anyone can look on program websites and pick one that claims to treat the dx someone has give their kid.
But, at the very least should meet and know something about the kid they are referring for.
Elizabeth Hall told me that she hoped all would be well and it would be a good placement, so my son could "get on with his education".
Stupid bitch. He was an A/B student with no academic issues and the only "problem" he had was trying to defend himself against two ignorant people, which was consequently dx'd as ODD.

[RobertBruce]

Personally I have not used an EdCon so I am not familiar with protocol, but I would expect that they would not need to meet every child they recommend schools to. If he or she conducted the interview over the phone with the parent and then with another professional who knows the child (childs therapist, school advocate etc.), if needed, this may be sufficient to make an accurate assessment.

The guest is correct. You wouldnt allow a doctor to make a decsion regarding your health without properly evaluating you. You wouldnt allow a mechanic to overhaul your entire car without really looking at it first. Why would you allow an EdCon to place your child in a program without them ever talking to your child?

Oversight and regulation doesn’t seem to be effective enough to keep the kids safe in the public school sector

Yes, but they are still safer in a public school then in the PTS.

which is why many parents are trying to avoid state controlled programs and place them in Private Therapeutic Schools

Wrong. Most parents don't know the programs they are shipping their kids off to are unlicensed and unregulated. The reason being many of these programs lie to the parents about the situation.

I was trying to show that oversight and regulation don’t necessarily equate to safety. The public sector is heavily regulated but the public schools are far from safe, in my opinion.

But does a lack of regulation and a lack of oversight equate to safety? No of course not, which is why the PTS have been shown to be so unsafe.

So what you are saying is the EdCons have formal training in diagnosing children’s ailments? See I was under the impression they provided a service of finding a school for the child based on the child’s needs

Many are psychologist by training, but the question remains how can they determine what the childs needs are without having ever met the child?

If I called an EdCon I wouldn’t expect them diagnose my child, I would expect them to find a school for me based on information provided to them by myself and the child’s advocate or therapist. I wouldn’t rely on them to tell me my child had ODD, I would assess that locally thru a therapist or Doctor.

Then why do many of these programs (HLA included) accept a recomendation from a EdCon as criteria for being enrolled whether the EdCon has met the child or not?

Having them meet the child would be nice and necessary in some cases, maybe, but I don’t see it in all cases.

So then the question remains. How can an EdCon properly evaluate or determine what a child needs if theyve never even met them?

[Deborah]

42 deaths between 2000-2004. I don't see them listed.

[Anonymous]

We have started pulling together data to compare a child living in the public sector vs the private sector, Based on the “National Center for Education Statistics” NCES and the “Centers for Disease Control and Prevention” CDC.  We have analyzed suicides, homicides in the public sector vs TBS, wilderness etc.  Here is what we have pulled together so far:
http://wwf.fornits.com/viewtopic.php?p=260816#260816

I, for one, am not buying into any of those statistics. The overwhelming majority of TBS's and Wilderness programs are not regulated and, therefore, are not legally required to report this type of information. TBS's and Wilderness Programs can make up their own data or exclude certain information to make their statistics look better. This data would never past muster with a statistician.

See this is where I am confused.  So what you are saying is the EdCons have formal training in diagnosing children’s ailments?  See I was under the impression they provided a service of finding a school for the child based on the child’s needs.  If I called an EdCon I wouldn’t expect them diagnose my child, I would expect them to find a school for me based on information provided to them by myself and the child’s advocate or therapist.  I wouldn’t rely on them to tell me my child had ODD, I would assess that locally thru a therapist or Doctor.  Having them meet the child  would be nice and necessary in some cases, maybe, but I don’t see it in all cases.

No, I'm not saying Ed Cons should have formal training in diagnosing childrens ailments - this would make them doctors or therapists. They should, however, have training as to how a diagnosis is made, what criteria makes up a diagnosis, and the appropriate placement/treatment for the child based on that diagnosis. Many of the children who were referred to HLA were done so by the parent(s) calling an Ed Con and recommending the child go to HLA without asking or requiring the child to have had an assessment or diagnosis from a licensed therapist or other mental health professional. That is just flat out wrong and there is no defending this practice.

What other industry allows recommendations to be made for children without the child being seen by person making the recommendation? There's are huge moral and ethical dilemmas here, not to mention the legal aspects of this industry.

[TheWho]

EDUCATIONAL Consultants should not be making placements to THERAPEUTIC facilities. Even with a dx, can they really assess whether the facility will meet their needs or not? Anyone can look on program websites and pick one that claims to treat the dx someone has give their kid.
But, at the very least should meet and know something about the kid they are referring for.
Elizabeth Hall told me that she hoped all would be well and it would be a good placement, so my son could "get on with his education".
Stupid bitch. He was an A/B student with no academic issues and the only "problem" he had was trying to defend himself against two ignorant people, which was consequently dx'd as ODD.

So it sounds like we need to define the boundary conditions of EdCons.  I didnt know they were not allowed to do this.  Does anyone have a definition of what they can and cant do or their qualifications?  Should they be required to meet each child and diagnose them?  Should they only refer children to non- Theraeutic schools? etc.

[RobertBruce]

They are yet another unregulated industry. There's no question to what they can get away with right now. The question is should they be allowed?

[Anonymous]

I'm partially joking and partly serious when I say:

Why should the educational consultants have real qualifications???

Serioulsy, so they can be educated to send people to a school w/ people w/ mail-away degrees???

Even if they were regulated that is only a piece of the puzzle...

Or if regulated, could the ed cons simply obtain the Farrington University diploma?

So the real solution would be real regulation...better than private school regulation...

[happyday7]

You should not call them Educational Consultants. They should be called ED CONS because they are in the business of conning parents into believing the empty promises they make to you in order to get your child enrolled in a school. ED CONS have been accused of taking kick backs from schools for how many kids they enroll. It is a big $$$ racket.  That is my opinion based on my own experience with an ED CON.

[Anonymous]

Hopefully one of these days a T.V. news show will start investigating this industry and realize how corrupt it is. Unfortunately there's Dr. Phil and Oprah on T.V. talking about how great they are, but have they ever really been to an unregulated TBS or Wilderness Program and seen what goes on there? I highly doubt it. There have been people who have written to both of them about the Troubled Teen Industry and they've failed to respond or acknowledge their letters. I look forward to the day when a responsible journalist takes on this industry and finally exposes all the fraud and abuse.

[Froderik]

I look forward to the day when a responsible journalist takes on this industry and finally exposes all the fraud and abuse.

And I look forward to sleeping with some of those responsible journalists... :em:  :rofl: ::seg::

[Anonymous]

42 deaths between 2000-2004. I don't see them listed.

Exactly the point - why aren't those listed?

[TheWho]

42 deaths between 2000-2004. I don't see them listed.

Exactly the point - why aren't those listed?

send them over, if they fit the parameters I will add them in.

[TheWho]

From the research I did today I couldn’t find any requirements saying EdCons cannot recommend schools which provide therapy.  It seems to be within their theater of work.  I suspect fornits people feel it isn’t right because they don’t want anyone to be recommended to a TBS or wilderness program.  But it seems the EdCons are doing their job from what I can see unless someone has more information that I overlooked.

[RobertBruce]

You mean your parameters.