Author Topic: Virginia Straightlings  (Read 4898 times)

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Offline Anonymous

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Virginia Straightlings
« Reply #15 on: January 24, 2006, 10:17:00 AM »
Quote
On 2006-01-23 18:08:00, Eudora (fka ~ Antigen) wrote:

"See now, I see it from entirely the opposite angle. What difference does it make who was more or less guilty than anybody else? And how do we ever settle that argument? What would constitute emperical proof? And then, getting back to the point, what would be the point?




Staff were compensated financially for abusing children.  They were also the be-all, end-all authority in Straight.  They should be held to a higher standard of accountability, just as a concentration camp guard should be held to a higher standard than a Nazi party member who worked at a restaurant.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #16 on: January 24, 2006, 11:41:00 AM »
Quote
On 2006-01-23 07:40:00, Anonymous wrote:

"The kids from NOVA were a bunch of spoiled rich kids "gone bad" and most of them had no qualms about stabbing each other in the back to advance themselves in the program. Fuck them all. "

They were quick to turn on their own.
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Offline starry-eyed pirate

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« Reply #17 on: January 27, 2006, 03:16:00 AM »
Quote
On 2006-01-23 07:40:00, Anonymous wrote:

"The kids from NOVA were a bunch of spoiled rich kids "gone bad" and most of them had no qualms about stabbing each other in the back to advance themselves in the program. Fuck them all. "


Before $tr8 I (a court-ordered, former 7-stepper, never on staff)was a stubborn social anarchist punk who stuck to my guns.  I was a "bad" kid.  I respected people, not authority.  I never narced on anyone.  I was in the Springfield, VA program(85-87). I have a substantial record of resistance.  I was institutionalized in $tr8 because they couldn't break me any other way. Your description of the NOVA kids seems to describe the values of American culture in general and American style capitalism in particular.

You are right to some extent though.  I am not innocent... though I was being blackmailed by the adults in the cult, and the state gov., as my very right to walk free under the sun was held hostage by them; as my very thoughts were held hostage.  As I was isolated, from group even and made to suffer sleep deprivation until all my "qualms" were gone.

How 'bout some fuckin' creds for bein' a target of the Beast even ??
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If you would have justice in this world, then begin to see that a human being is not a means to some end.  People are not commodities.  When human beings are just to one another government becomes obsolete and real freedom is born; SPIRITUAL ANARCHY.

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Virginia Straightlings
« Reply #18 on: January 27, 2006, 08:31:00 AM »
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Offline Antigen

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« Reply #19 on: January 27, 2006, 12:36:00 PM »
Well, staff (peer staff, I mean) were not compensated very well. As I remember it, going all the way back to the Seed, group staff lived in communal apartments, drove shitty little broke down economy cars, wore torn, worn out clothing, etc. They were there, scurrying around trying to cover their asses in a state of perpetual hypervigilance just like phasers for 10, 12, 20 hours a day sometimes. The ticket to keeping a cult cohesive is to keep the inductees, especially the enforcement cadre, too busy, too paranoid and too stressed out to think clearly.

Some of the parents, for a time, were in pretty nearly the same state. Yes, there's money involved, huge piles of it. And there are those cretans into the mix who really are rollin' in it, gloating. But most of the staff got as pooched as any of us, probably more.

When I talked to Charles Pendergrass (Pendergrast?) I thought I was going to maybe get some clues, some details about my own history and Program history. Instead, well you can check that thread if you want to. But I would talk to him again if I thought he'd be willing to speak his mind. I don't care anymore whether these people are sorry, whether they're fer us or again us. I want them to speak their minds publicly on the topic of the Program. I know that most of them won't be willing to do that. But some will.

There's a former staffer reading and, very occasionally, posting here lately. Nice guy. I remember him that way at the time and he seems so now. But totally clueless about what he was involved in. If he and folks like him would speak their minds, I think it would help make a little more clear to most people just what we were all involved in.

Here's the thing. I don't think there exists any small, or even mid-sized, cadre of complicit evil doers who we can just identify, indict and punish. Even if we did, it would only make them martyrs in the eyes of the truely devout. So, for all the casualties, it would probably backfire.

And check this, cuz you know it's true. Even the ones who did and do get off on the sadism and the money, well karma is a very real force of nature. Those poor bastards sold their souls and they are damned in this life and undto the 5th generation, I'm convinced of it.

Pirate (and all the good ppl who came up fed and nurtured in the very holy mecca of the prison-industrial complex) ya'll are a bit spooky sometimes. Sorry, I know I'm one to talk on that point. I had the spooky kid quality long before the Program, it's just hereditary in my case, I think. But I think you're perspective on what is and is not American culture is somewhat sullied by virtue of that influence. A whole lot of Americans are skeered these days, very like the way some of us complied, played along and humored the lunatics till we could see a clear path to gone for good. But their hearts are not w/ the fascists. And I do believe there's a sea change afoot, whereby good Americans up and down and all the way accross the political, social and economic spectrum are starting to see the danger.

Quote
How 'bout some fuckin' creds for bein' a target of the Beast even ??


Much cred, much love for you my brother! You are the American ideal. Not tryin to suggest that you or I or we should suffer the damnation we've felt the urge to heap on the mindfuckers. Just sayin' leave vengence to the gods or nature or whatever you believe in and let's us kind and decent souls set about enlightening our good fellow travelers to the slight of mind, the dirty tricks and the impending perril.

They need to be schooled so as to see the mindfuckers for what they are before they fall for the same scam our rents did.

The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that's good.  
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/188301123X/circlofmiamithem' target='_new'>George Washington

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"Don\'t let the past remind us of what we are not now."
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Offline Anonymous

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Virginia Straightlings
« Reply #20 on: January 27, 2006, 10:09:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-01-27 09:36:00, Eudora wrote:

"Well, staff (peer staff, I mean) were not compensated very well. As I remember it, going all the way back to the Seed, group staff lived in communal apartments, drove shitty little broke down economy cars, wore torn, worn out clothing, etc. They were there, scurrying around trying to cover their asses in a state of perpetual hypervigilance just like phasers for 10, 12, 20 hours a day sometimes. The ticket to keeping a cult cohesive is to keep the inductees, especially the enforcement cadre, too busy, too paranoid and too stressed out to think clearly.


You give "staff" way too much credit.  I was an "abuser/staff".  I was not on a power trip, and i quit after I was strong armed into doing something I disagreed with (had nothing to do with doing anyting to the "clients").  I think I made less than $6 an hour, it was a job that helped me feel liike I was giving something back.  We spent more time on "homes" than anything else.  I sometimes thought up the rap topic on the way to the stool...  I had no plots to keep anyone down or promote a cult lifestyle.
   If you remember most of the staff were early twenty-somethings.  We were more worried about getting layed, making car payments on our shitty cars, getting to work on time, and trying to figure out what the fuck we were going to do w/ the rest of our lives.  Hell it was the 80's and there were more people and actors in drug rehab than out.
  The people that were sadists were that way because that is the way they were and probably still are.  Now they just berate other people below themselves (e.g. cashiers at McD's or something).
   I have been reading this site for awhile now and I am always asounded by the supernatual air you give staff.  They were people like anyone else, some good some bad.  believe me I was also on the other end of the bad people and they were assholes just like the thousands I have met since then.
  Go ahead and start the crucifixion as seems to be normal.
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Offline Antigen

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« Reply #21 on: January 27, 2006, 10:27:00 PM »
Well, let me be the first to Why I Live at the PO
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"Don\'t let the past remind us of what we are not now."
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #22 on: January 27, 2006, 11:00:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-01-27 19:27:00, Eudora wrote:


What did you think I meant by "They were there, scurrying around trying to cover their asses in a state of perpetual hypervigilance just like phasers for 10, 12, 20 hours a day sometimes."


I don't know if you know me but I have been doing fine.  Thanks.

I guess I thought that we were surrying around trying to cover for the bad thing we were doing.  To this day I don't feel guilty about what I did there.  I learned what a true asshole was, which has been important to me later in life.  I learned that people who abuse power are of low character and should be avoided at all costs.  I saw how important it was to treat people w/ respect.  I see people treat each other worse almost every day than most were treated in the program.
Believe me my program was full of all kinds of mindfucks as well.  I use it -> "well at least it is not as bad as when I was in st8 and..."
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Offline Antigen

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« Reply #23 on: January 27, 2006, 11:10:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-01-27 20:00:00, Anonymous wrote:

I saw how important it was to treat people w/ respect. I see people treat each other worse almost every day than most were treated in the program.


Oh, you must have found the website from the flyer in the Why I Live at the PO
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"Don\'t let the past remind us of what we are not now."
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #24 on: January 28, 2006, 12:07:00 AM »
Don't know the Therapeutic Coffee Shop
 
Come out with what? I was sitting right next to you (figuatively speaking), i went through the same shit.  But what was different was that before the program I was the typical kid going to parties experimenting w/ drugs etc. I had no clue where I was going but figuered I would be successful, just because.  
Fade into Str8 and all my "rights" were taken.  I was stripped searched (by the same sex), I could feel we were all embarassed by this.  I was accused of(but never admitted to) acts that were not my doing and others that were not my intention.  I was set back for both, and started over for another, it was miserable.  I look back at it and it was probably the worst part of my life.  
  Then one day a staff member got a wild hair up his ass and made us all go to NOVA and take placement tests to get into school.  i got my HS diploma, went to college and got a bunch of degrees.  I am happy with my life.  I am who I wanted to be.  No, I am not sober and I like it like that.
   The perspective of the staff member that I can remember:  Get to work on time-  God I remember busting my ass around 495 to get to the building on time (I think we had to punch in).  Then you may have a rap that you were scheduled for.  OK quick think of a topic, "how are you like an orange and are peeling away the tough exterior of your past and getting to the soft inside of your pesesnt..."  blah blah.  mainly an excuse to talk in the acceptable manner.  Yes, they were destoying the past for the present.  But I have my past back, you?  Then back to the staff room in the back or out to smoke a cig.  Answer to COC letters.  Always the big homes board was looming.  It was on the wall to the left as you walked into the office.  I was always a pain in the ass to get that thing complete, it was like a puzzle.  There was always some parent that had refused to take kids other than their own, others that couldn't go to certain houses etc.  I was in a few therapy planning sessions but they were nuts and bolts as well.  Client "A" misbehaves, we have tools 1,2,3,... to use, what can we do.  Yeah it is breaking people down but I think they were coming from the perspective of jail/PI and this is the way they did things.  As an aside I have been in detention as an adult for traffic stuff and had the same crap done to me. Then there was Fri nite rap.  I think they picked peple that were going to be confrontational anyway to run that rap.  I was chosen I think once.  I yelled at this kid to start taking and get on with it because I actually cared about him.  I was working from the above perspective.  I thought all he had to do was just get through all this shit and you would be free, enter the "it's only 1/75th of your total life" argument.  I also did a few open meetings.  I was soo nervous that all I could think about was the basics.  Mom feeling those are actions etc.
  Wow, that was a weird walk through the past I hop it helps.  When I look back at the staff part of it as a whole I look at it as a job 1st and then as a continuation of my own therapy at the time (now i would term it as experience).  Do I think it was good or bad?  There was good and bad in it (the job and my program).  I was never physically abused, I was hurt plenty.  I am happy now.
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Offline Antigen

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« Reply #25 on: January 28, 2006, 12:23:00 AM »
Well, I don't know if you ever get your past back or not. But I did build myself a fine life. No degrees or anything, but happily and uneventfully married for close to 20 years, couple of kids, one fully grown.

But it's the future I'm interested in. I want my kids and grandkids to live in a country where that kind of interminate imprisonment w/o due process or any appeal or contact w/ the outside world is unacceptable. And I ain't leavin' this one, it's mine, by birthright.

I'm guessing you were in Virginia when Riddile was in charge. I've heard tell it was far less militant then. But I don't think I want to accept "not as bad as Virgil" as equivalent to "damned good enough." I think it's just fundamentally wrong to use force and deception to change someone's very mind against their will.

Cops; you wake `em up you gotta dance with `em. They lead.
-- Jack McNulty

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"Don\'t let the past remind us of what we are not now."
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Offline Antigen

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« Reply #26 on: January 28, 2006, 12:31:00 AM »
Oh, check out that link. That explains the Therapeutic Coffee Shop. It's funny if you read it in just the right voice.

Also, you said "Come out with what? I was sitting right next to you (figuatively speaking)" Yeah, that's sort of my point.

And "As an aside I have been in detention as an adult for traffic stuff and had the same crap done to me."

Yeah, me too. Only overnight, though. And I spent a couple of months in juvenile detention, too. You know some insane judge in Florida had me extradicted from Georgia just a couple of months before my 18th birthday for the "crime" of being a chronic runaway in Florida! That was a spooky, scary time. If they had gotten me back in there in Sarasota in late `82, they would have beat the piss out of me. I had split from 5th phase pre-training and sought help from HRS. Thank god that didn't happen!

But there are really important differences between jail and the Program. When you go to jail, whether the virdict is perfect or not, you did get convicted of something and had a right to a trial. You know when you're getting out. You can send and receive letters with your friends. Your parents don't show up once a week to tell you you deserve everything you're getting and not welcome home till you agree.

Now, again, I don't think there are insidious evil bad guys in this story to be identified and shot at dawn. I think the system, the plan, the concept upon which the program is built is more than just a little faulty, it's downright insidious.

No school at all is better than a bad school.  Nothing else in the child's environment is capable of such systematic destruction.
--George Dennison

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"Don\'t let the past remind us of what we are not now."
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #27 on: January 28, 2006, 04:23:00 AM »
Thanks for the easy conversation.  Great to hear you are doing well.  I had not thought much about Str8 'till I ran into this site.  Though I often wondered what happened to all those people.

  I think I did get my past back in the form of not feeling bad about it anymore.  The time I did 'shrooms and talked about how bad I felt for doing them was B.S., but back then I convinced myself it was a bad time.  Now I know I HAD A BLAST! I guess my point is that the past is what you believe it is.  They took it away for a year or so but I got it back the rest of the time.

  The future is ours as well.  I hope I can make better decisions than my parents did because we will have different tools related to our experience.  My parents were not as familiar with what sort of options were out there and we never actually sat and talked like we do now.  They had other parents telling them this was the right thing to do.   And as I said before drug rehab seemed to be a fad back then.  We just ended up in a very weird one.  But the fact is that we live in a society that will use force to change your mind.  Just try not paying taxes for a few years because you don't believe in it and see who shows up at your door.

You wrote "Now, again, I don't think there are insidious evil bad guys in this story to be identified and shot at dawn. I think the system, the plan, the concept upon which the program is built is more than just a little faulty, it's downright insidious."

I don't understand the use of insidious.  Do you think Str8 is trying to entice us into their way of life?  Well I ain't buyin' what they're sellin' anymore.  I have free will and am not afraid to use it.  Well, within reason.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #28 on: January 28, 2006, 04:23:00 AM »
Thanks for the easy conversation.  Great to hear you are doing well.  I had not thought much about Str8 'till I ran into this site.  Though I often wondered what happened to all those people.

  I think I did get my past back in the form of not feeling bad about it anymore.  The time I did 'shrooms and talked about how bad I felt for doing them was B.S., but back then I convinced myself it was a bad time.  Now I know I HAD A BLAST! I guess my point is that the past is what you believe it is.  They took it away for a year or so but I got it back the rest of the time.

  The future is ours as well.  I hope I can make better decisions than my parents did because we will have different tools related to our experience.  My parents were not as familiar with what sort of options were out there and we never actually sat and talked like we do now.  They had other parents telling them this was the right thing to do.   And as I said before drug rehab seemed to be a fad back then.  We just ended up in a very weird one.  But the fact is that we live in a society that will use force to change your mind.  Just try not paying taxes for a few years because you don't believe in it and see who shows up at your door.

You wrote "Now, again, I don't think there are insidious evil bad guys in this story to be identified and shot at dawn. I think the system, the plan, the concept upon which the program is built is more than just a little faulty, it's downright insidious."

I don't understand the use of insidious.  Do you think Str8 is trying to entice us into their way of life?  Well I ain't buyin' what they're sellin' anymore.  I have free will and am not afraid to use it.  Well, within reason.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #29 on: January 28, 2006, 09:26:00 AM »
To former staff: Did you have a green car?
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