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Offline Anonymous

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Mental Health Screening in Schools Signals the End of Parent
« Reply #135 on: August 17, 2005, 10:42:00 AM »
Defining Down Mental Illness

By Sally Satel and Christina Sommers

Sunday, August 14, 2005; Page B07

Last month the Army surgeon general announced that 30 percent of soldiers who returned from Iraq had developed mental health problems. A few days later, the House Veterans Affairs subcommittee on health heard testimony on how Department of Veterans Affairs clinics are preparing for a wave of veterans with post-traumatic stress disorder.

How many mentally ill veterans will there be? No one knows, but the testimony of Col. Charles Hoge, chief of psychiatry at Walter Reed Army Medical Center, was refreshingly optimistic. He acknowledged that some fraction of veterans would indeed become ill but also cautioned how important it is to "convey the message . . . that many of the reactions they experience after combat are common and expected."
   

Drawing the line between normal reactions to intense experience on the one hand and a pathological response on the other can be difficult for psychiatrists. The conundrum was starkly illustrated last June when the long-awaited National Comorbidity Study was published in the Archives of General Psychiatry. The study, funded by the National Institutes of Health at a cost of $20 million, found that a quarter of all adults in the United States -- 26 percent -- qualified as having a mental illness within a given year. Can a rate so high be true?

A closer look at the study reveals a less startling picture. First, the survey used in the study was based on the standard psychiatric handbook -- the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual, 4th Edition (DSM IV) -- which has a low threshold for calling a collection of symptoms a "mental disorder." For example, a balky, stubborn, aggressive child might well be diagnosed as having "Oppositional Defiant Disorder" (ODD), according to the DSM, and sent to a therapist. Yet a layman might simply regard him as spoiled and in need of a strict British nanny.

Harvard public health professor Ronald Kessler, the lead author on the study, acknowledges the problem of blurry boundaries that standard psychiatric definitions create. As he said on National Public Radio, the "vast majority" of reactions to life events are "self-limiting and mild and people get over them." He used moving from one town to another as an example. For a couple of weeks, he said, people may "get depressed because they miss all their friends and maybe can't focus on their work and so forth." According to the DSM, Kessler said, "that would meet minimally the criteria for a major depressive episode."

Technically, he is correct -- according to the DSM, individuals who report a certain set of symptoms with only mild dysfunction qualify for a diagnosis. What's missing from this practice, though, is the social context in which symptoms occur. A strong but temporary emotional reaction to moving -- a "psychiatric hangnail," in Kessler's words -- is not really psychopathology by common-sense standards. By contrast, a person who is persistently sad with no obvious cause might well qualify as having the mental disorder of depression -- perhaps, or perhaps not, requiring professional help.

The study classified disorders by severity. Six percent of the population had "serious cases" (and needed professional attention), while "moderate" and "mild" cases each affected 10 percent. Mild cases often represent garden-variety anxieties and despair associated with problems in living -- or moving. So, conservatively, 6 to 16 percent of us will suffer a mental condition this year, as defined by psychiatrists.

The other key finding of the study -- that half of all people diagnosed at some point in their lives with a disorder show signs of it by age 14 -- also warrants skepticism. True, many of the conditions examined in the study -- phobias, anxiety, obsessive-compulsive disorder, impulsivity -- are manifested in late childhood or early teens. But that does not mean that every child with these syndromes will have them as an adult.

This qualification is especially important because mental health advocates, such as the National Alliance for the Mentally Ill, are now citing this new study as proof that we should treat even trivial syndromes in childhood, because they could otherwise blossom into more serious forms of illness.

But while the catch-it-early approach might be the correct one for some number of youngsters who display minor distress or behavioral problems, we don't know which ones. If we treat all youths who display low-level symptoms, many risk being given medications or other treatments they don't really need. An already overburdened child mental health care system will buckle.

Furthermore, expectations are set up all around when we send the message to kids, their parents and teachers that little Johnny may not be ill now but if we don't send him to the psychiatrist for his minor problem he is destined for mental illness. If there is one thing that Freud keenly knew it was that the power of suggestion creates self-fulfilling prophecies.

Over the past 20 years or so there has been a massive and admirable effort to raise consciousness about mental health in this country. Increased awareness and improved treatments are saving millions from suffering. But we should not define mental illness down. Most of us -- and most veterans -- will never have a serious mental illness. Will we have periods of intense sadness, frustration, anxiety and insecurity? Sure. Not because we are ill, but because we are human. And being human is not a condition in need of a cure.

Sally Satel, a psychiatrist, and Christina Sommers are resident scholars at the American Enterprise Institute and co-authors of "One Nation Under Therapy."

© 2005 The Washington Post Company
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Offline Deborah

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Mental Health Screening in Schools Signals the End of Parent
« Reply #136 on: August 17, 2005, 02:53:00 PM »
We Couldn't Get Much Higher
A Pill for Every Ill
 :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:
http://www.grab.com/fun/specials/licensetopill
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Offline Deborah

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« Reply #137 on: August 17, 2005, 03:11:00 PM »
As I said, Tx was the proving ground. Search WWF for ?Gleason? or ?Medicating Aliah? and read what happened to one of the first young victims of this initative. Long story, short- screened at school, dx w/depression, parents disagree, CPS put kid in State Mental Hosp where she is given 13 psych drugs. Some not approved for use in pediatrics, some off-label. Not an isolated incident.

Flaw? What, You don?t think psych drugs are addictive? Ever known anyone who tried to get off? I have, and they usually decide to stay on. ?ADD/ADHD? drugs are equivalent to cocaine, with all the potential harms. Ritalin or Crystal meth? Either can kill you, the former just does it slower.

Shell shocked? People are being dx?d PTSD for very minor things, like a major move.

The ?US?, as in government, should not ?TREAT? anything. Where is that duty spelled out in the constitution? They owe the vets free care for services performed, but let?s hope they seek out a good EMDR therapist and skip the drugs.

Get over it? Who said that?
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Offline Nihilanthic

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« Reply #138 on: August 17, 2005, 10:05:00 PM »
Quote
On 2005-08-16 21:45:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Deborah,



What happens if someone gets treated for a newly identified disorder and it works, improving their lives and for those around them and creating a more successful person?



What do you say then?



What would you say directly to them?



What if it was you?



Would you not seek treatment because the diagnosit classification is new.



Do you only drive old cars?"


Im not deborah but I'll bite for my own amusement  :grin:

Id want peer review of the disorder, peer review of how to diagnose it, peer reviewed methods for treating it, and obviously not using a damned LGA seminar based coersive program to just make them act normal as opposed to actual therapy.

And yeah I'd say that to everyone.

As far as treatment because its a new classification, well, hey! People fuck up, even scientists, plus when shit is debunked such as "oppositional defiance disorder", Id be critical and wary. I mean god, female sexual arousal used to be 'hysteria'  :roll:

Oh, I drive only old cars, but mostly so I can bypass all that computer bullshit, and because I found out a chassis from the 80s thats cheap, that I can put a junk yard v8 into and get viper power, 30 mpg if I drive it sanely and the handling of an Elise. Plus its cheaper to get a used car... AND you know whats gonna get fucked up. New cars are like rolling the dice... never buy the first model year of anything.

"The FARC is part of the history of Colombia and a historical phenomenon", (President Pastrana) says, "and they must be treated as Colombians". ... They come and ask for bread [aid from Washington], and you give them stones.

Robert White is a former American ambassador to Paraguay and El Salvador, and former No. 2 man with the U.S. Embassy in Bogota, is president of the Centre for International Policy in Washington D.C.
http://narconews.com/' target='_new'>Robert White

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DannyB on the internet:I CALLED A LAWYER TODAY TO SEE IF I COULD SUE YOUR ASSES FOR DOING THIS BUT THAT WAS NOT POSSIBLE.

CCMGirl on program restraints: "DON\'T TAZ ME BRO!!!!!"

TheWho on program survivors: "From where I sit I see all the anit-program[sic] people doing all the complaining and crying."

Offline Antigen

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« Reply #139 on: August 18, 2005, 10:34:00 AM »
Quote
On 2005-08-17 19:05:00, Nihilanthic wrote:

New cars are like rolling the dice... never buy the first model year of anything.


Exactly!

Think for a moment about the sheer absurdity of the various shades of propaganda. In my own living memory, so far we've been through a small parade of hobgoblins. Heroine, angel dust, crack... we were assured that people using these drugs were going to turn American into one big orgy of violence and riot. It never happened, but when has reality ever put a damper on the beliefs of a true zealot?

Now comes the next hobgoblin, Methamphetamine.

There's no doubt at all on any side of the issue that some millions of kids and a growing number of adults are currently taking daily doses of potent amphetamines.

So, if you believe the hype, you'd better be building and stocking a bunker cause, any minute now, this army of tweakers is bound to bust out in rampant violence and insanity.

If, on the other hand, you're of the opinion that these psych drugs are just as harmless as cute fuzzy bunnies, just helpful friends, then you should be out campaigning to reel in those moon bats who want to go around arresting people for manufacture and distribution of mehtamphetamine.  

The rest of us will just sit back and watch.  :rofl:

All of these comforting and reasonable things were taught by the ministers in their pulpits -- by teachers in Sunday schools and by parents at home. The children were victims. They were assaulted in the cradle -- in their mother's arms. Then, the schoolmaster carried on the war against their natural sense, and all the books they read were filled with the same impossible truths. The poor children were helpless. The atmosphere they breathed was filled with lies -- lies that mingled with their blood.
--Robert G. Ingersoll, American politician and lecturer

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Offline Deborah

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Mental Health Screening in Schools Signals the End of Parent
« Reply #140 on: August 18, 2005, 01:09:00 PM »
You homeschoolers might want to pass along a warning to your groups and organizations.

http://www.homeedmag.com/blogs/groupnews/

ISSUES TO WATCH ~-Mental Health Surveys
Recently, on a large Ohio homeschool list, there was a request by a psychiatrist asking that home-educators and homeschool support groups  participate in a mental health survey.  He stated:

"The first phase of my project will involve getting baseline data to determine the prevalence of mental health issues in homeschooled children in relation to the general population (state-schooled children). This will eventually
be used to determine the existence (and potential reasons) of protective factors that homeschooling provides. I am asking for homeschool organization's permission and aid in distributing a short questionnaire."

As you can see, the Dr. expressed good intentions, stating that he thought his study would offer proof that home education provides protective factors for children.  This is not a bad point to prove, but I do not know that a survey attempting to prove it would do home education a service.  Instead, I support the method that has worked for years, which is individuals sharing why home education works for each individual with other individuals.

These types of surveys, whether well intentioned or not, may undermine home education freedoms.

Before deciding whether or not to participate, homeschoolers could consider that this type of research may undermine our freedom to home educate in the following ways:

1.    This research could result in increased monitoring of homeschoolers via attempts to disprove this very study.

2.    This research could also bring us under further scrutiny in light of the New Freedom Commission's National Mental Screening
Initiative (children will be screened from birth for mental illness), possibly bringing us under more narrow scrutiny from this type of initiative than already exists.

Research and surveys are often an invasion of our privacy.  Instead of relying on such data that is often presented by detractors as slanted, isn't it much better that we tell others of our own experiences with homeschooling?
When we submit research via surveys the information takes on it's own story and may be used in harmony in a way that the user of the survey chooses to present the data.

If you would like to know more about the new Mental Health Initiatives visit:

Home Education in Illinois- Legislation and Learning (HILL)

If you would like to know more about federal preschool visit- Universal preschool
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #141 on: August 18, 2005, 01:17:00 PM »
Quote
On 2005-08-18 07:34:00, Antigen wrote:

"



Now comes the next hobgoblin, Methamphetamine.


"


What percentage of people are testing positive for meth when initially arrested.

Obvioulsy a harmless drug, compared to prescription medication, but nonetheless, it would be interesting to know.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #142 on: August 18, 2005, 01:22:00 PM »
Quote
isn't it much better that we tell others of our own experiences with homeschooling?

"


Except that this non-scientifically based way of analyzing and sharing information is usually not effective.

For instance, if studies where made of the outcomes in WWASPS don't you think places like Brown School's would have been exposed and shut down long ago?

Word of mouth is the same as hearsay.
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Offline Deborah

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« Reply #143 on: August 18, 2005, 02:00:00 PM »
How many people expect the personal experience of a home schooling parent to be subjected to scientific analysis.
There may be some exceptions, but I've never know a homeschooler who was out beating bushes to recruit other parents. 'Effectiveness' would be a non-issue.

If homeschoolers in general decided to put forth a public campaign to recruit other parents, they would be wise to select an independent researcher, preferably someone in (hello) EDUCATION, not psychiatry.

Studies of WWASP would cause the closing of Brown Schools. Huh?   :???:
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Offline Antigen

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« Reply #144 on: August 18, 2005, 02:34:00 PM »
Quote
On 2005-08-18 10:17:00, Anonymous wrote:


What percentage of people are testing positive for meth when initially arrested.



Obvioulsy a harmless drug, compared to prescription medication, but nonetheless, it would be interesting to know."


Meth harmless? Hardly! I expect the fad will pass about as quickly as the crack "epidemic". People aren't near as dumb as they look.

But facts is facts, man. The history is easily available for anyone who dares to look into it. Methamphetamine was a Sched III drug up until the mid `80's. That meant that it was easy to get; any doctor could write a scrip for anything from a need to stay awake to a desire to lose weight w/ little scrutiny. And it was very popular among truckers, college students and dieters. Then the side effects started to show in very scientifically sound, peer reviewed studies. And so we (congress, at the urging of DEA) moved meth to Sched II, same as cocaine, opioids and some other rather potent formulations.

The funny thing is that some of these new and improved ADHD drugs are quite as potent and dangerous as meth, except that they're readily available as pure, regent quality products of known dose and origin from a droll little person in a lab coat.

So we don't have to deal w/ the black market, the accidental overdoses and poisonings. Just the regular side effects of the drugs themselves. By comparison, those are negligable provided the patient or patient's guardian understands them and properly weighs them against the hoped for benefits!

Tip for the day: To meth heads:
How to ditch your dealer and get your fix at reduced cost and risk. Find a regular medical doctor and describe to him or her the symptoms of adult ADHD. It may even be covered by insurance. Plus, if you ever want to get good medical advice on how to quit, you won't have to confess to a felony or be asked to snitch anybody out to get it.

Locate the blind spot in the culture--the place where the culture isn't looking, because it dare not--because if it were to look there, its previous values would dissolve.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1561769118/circlofmiamithem' target='_new'>Terence McKenna

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Offline Antigen

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« Reply #145 on: August 18, 2005, 03:43:00 PM »
Quote
On 2005-08-18 11:00:00, Deborah wrote:

There may be some exceptions, but I've never know a homeschooler who was out beating bushes to recruit other parents. 'Effectiveness' would be a non-issue.

Oh, they're out there, b'lieve it! I only know of one hsing group in the area that's not pretty strident. It's not a formal organization. It's just a bunch of ppl who met through the same evaluator and who like to do cook outs and swap books and info. The rest that I know of are... well, too organized and exclusive for my blood.

Quote
If homeschoolers in general decided to put forth a public campaign to recruit other parents, they would be wise to select an independent researcher, preferably someone in (hello) EDUCATION, not psychiatry.


6 of these, half dozen of the other. I think the better argument is built on personal responsibility. It's not your job to educate my kids and visa versa. If you think the public schools or a private school or some other option is the best thing for your kid, then that's what you should do.

But always remember and never forget; if the school system fails to properly educate your kids, they're not going to be the ones w/ incompetent, illiterate adults munching potato chips in their living rooms.

The legislature is to society as a physician is to the patient. If a physician ignored side effects of medications like today's legislators ignore the side effects of their legislation, the physician would be accused of malpractice. I accuse today's legislators (with rare exception) of legislative malpractice. Many of the ills that are so obvious in our society are a direct result of previous legislation. Their solution? More laws!
-- John A. Bennett, DO



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Offline bandit1978

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« Reply #146 on: August 18, 2005, 05:43:00 PM »
Meth is hardly harmless!

But it's harder than ever to get MDs to write prescriptions- everyones worried they will be investigated if they write too many scripts for narcotics!
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egan Flynn
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #147 on: August 18, 2005, 05:49:00 PM »
But...I do know some people who have used meth to get them through some 12 hour overnight ER shifts.
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Offline bandit1978

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« Reply #148 on: August 18, 2005, 10:24:00 PM »
Quote
On 2005-08-17 06:43:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Excuse me but, isn't 50 % a little over exagerated? You seriously believe that half of Washington is HIV positive? I think not. I would say it's more along the lines of 7-9 %. "



Do you live in DC?  Do you work for the health department or something?  Have you ever been here?

I work at a university hospital downtown DC.  I'll try to find some statistics for you, but I assure you, it is estimated that 50% of the city population is HIV+.
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egan Flynn
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #149 on: August 18, 2005, 10:32:00 PM »
Well, if you count 50% of the patients that use that hospital, that's not an accurate statistical measurement of the population of Washingon, DC. There are many hospitals in the city, and it is quite possible that that particular hospital is convenient to the particular segment of the population that is high risk for HIV due to location, medicaid access etc. However, being familiar with the city of Washington DC, I cannot imagine 50% of congressmen, presidential aides, Georgetown college students, and government employees have HIV. Show me those statistics.
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