Summary: Devastating Indictment of TheWho

[Troll Control]

Here's the devasting indictment of TheWho which absolutely shreds his credibility, complete with quotes and links proving beyond a doubt that TheWho is an unmitigated liar.  Dialogue picks up where Whooter claims the OP cannot prove even the first statement about him, but the OP goes on to prove every one of them:

Heck, I'll just go for all of them to save time.

Rebuttal section:

Let's keep it short and go over just Whooter's lies from this thread.

Lie #1:  Whooter claims he never went to Chicago for a TTI meeting.
Truth #1:  Whooter had already bragged about it two years ago, but must have forgotten
and was quoted saying he did indeed go to Chicago for a TTI meeting.  This was proven
over Whooter's denials by simply quoting the post where he already admitted it.

Whooter, in his own words, admits to the trip he was just denying.

Lie #2:  Whooter claims to be just a "regular parent with no ties to

the industry."
Truth #2:  Whooter already admitted he was part of a "statistical group to assess TBS
safety" that met in Chicago.  This was proven over Whooter's denials by simply quoting
the post where he already admitted it.

TheWho admitting to being an industry player and saying TBS "is where the money's at."

Lie #3:  Whooter claims not be John Reuben.
Truth #3:  whooter has contacted at least one parent from this forum and provided her
the email address "onekidatatime@yahoo.com" for her to contact him "outside of Fornits"
because "everyone here has an agenda to discredit programs."  The email address has
been verified to be that of John Reuben and is the admin email account at
savingteens.org.  This was proven by posting the original PM from TheWho to Concerned
Parent, which TheWho subsequently altered in a quote and copped to altering it when
called out.

TheWho's PM to Concerned Parent is posted in its entirety.

Whois search for savingteens.org shows the email address Whooter provided belongs to John Reuben.

Lie #4:  RobertBruce is "Concerned Parent."
Truth #4:  Whooter dropped this claim and went on to blame someone else for being
"Concerned Parent."  Interestingly enough, Whooter has actually claimed to BE
RobertBruce many times and later copped to fabricating at least one "lookalike"
RobertBruce login to try to impersonate him (the login he admitted to creating "for
fun" was 'RobertBruce .' with a space and a period at the end).

Whooter begins his claim that RobertBruce is "Concerned Parent."

Whooter continues to hammer at the meme "Concerned Parent is RobertBruce" without a shred of evidence to suggest that.

...and hammering it some more...

Lie #5:  Ajax13 is "Concerned Parent."
Truth #5:  Ajax13 is not Concerned Parent, but Whooter clings to this meme like a life
raft anyway.

Here we have Whooter denying being himself, posting as "Dick Cheney" claiming Ajax13 and not RobertBruce "fabricated the PM."

Lie #6:  Ajax13 AND RobertBruce are "Concerned Parent."
Truth #6:  Both are provably NOT "Concerned Parent."  Whooter seems to have dropped
this notion now because obviously they both couldn't be "Concerned Parent" at the same
time, but that simple logic didn't stop him from floating it to distract from the
conversation.

Here Whooter claims both RobertBruce and Ajax13 are "Concerned Parent."  Now he's veering all over the place grasping at straws with no proof.

Lie #7:  Whooter claimed to have no criminal record when
confronted.
Truth #7:  Whooter had already admitted years ago, on this board, that he was "arrested
several times in Boston and once in Ann Arbor Michigan."

Whooter admitting to being arrested "many times in Boston" and elsewhere.

Lie #8:  Whooter claims not to have lied at all.
Truth #8:  Whooter has been caught lying like a rug using only his own posts and PMs as
evidence of the lies.  Essentially, he lied about everything, then had to walk it all
back piece by piece as he was caught again and again.  Now the only thing from the
above list he won't cop to is being Reuben, but considering he lied about and was
proven lying about the rest of the items in this thread, his  assertion is just him
howling from being bitten so badly.

No link required, see above.  ; )

So, that's 8 full-fledged, lie-through-your-teeth prevarications
offered by TheWho in just this single thread.  People should believe him for what
reason now?

Sorry, Whooter, your lying chickens have come home to roost and nobody here believes
anything you say anymore.  Better luck next time.

Whooter has been fully owned yet again and busted out lying through his teeth yet
again.  Whooter, you better try something else, like going back to trolling with
endless emoticons to slow the page loading, because you are SO BUSTED in YOUR OWN WORDS
and you just can't hide anymore.  Your legacy here has cought up to you and just won't
go away.  Can't escape those facts, son.

What a smackdown, people!  Finally TheWho is held to account for all of his lies here.  He's very upset about it, too.

[Troll Control]

Dissatisfied at losing the argument again, Whooter demands more "proof" and was quoted saying "I wasn't there" (Chicago) and then quoted bragging about being there from two years prior.  Man, this guy is just too dumb to get out of his own way.  Rule #1:  When you're in a hole, stop digging!

Well why dont you humor myself and the readers and take the first one and show us how you proved it:

Lie #1: Whooter claims he never went to Chicago for a TTI meeting.
Truth #1: Whooter had already bragged about it two years ago, but must have forgotten and was quoted saying he did indeed go to Chicago for a TTI meeting. This was proven over Whooter's denials by simply quoting the post where he already admitted it.

Nice try.  Now stick with the first question:

You say that I claim I never went to Chicago for a TTI meeting... First When was I asked this question and second what was my answer.  How did you conclude that I lied about anything?

Sure, I'll dumb it down for you just this once.

Whooter adamantly denying he was ever in Chicago, of course, a confirmed lie.

You say both? You could probably document this Reuben guy as being there, but how do you place me there? You say you have documented evidence. Evidence would mean I was posting from Chicago at the same time this meeting took place. That may raise some eyebrows I would say. But you see you dont have that evidence because I wasnt there.

Underlined emphasis added by me...

Well, you just denied being there in that post.  But of course, as we all know, you were lying and exposed for it.  Here's the link where you admitted it two years ago:

Whooter, in his own words, admits to the trip he was just denying.

Well, I PM?d several people here on fornits and eventually we formed a ?Statistical group? and decided to meet at the Hyatt in Chicago about a month ago. We spent 3 days hammering out a direction and figured we would tackle the TBS sector first.

Again, you are a proven liar.  We all know you do it, so why bother entertaining any more of your fallacious posts?  These are just quotes of you denying what you already said.  How dumb can you really be to think we wouldn't notice these lies???

Oh, the readers are humored, but I bet Whooter isn't.  Ha, Ha, Ha.

[Troll Control]

Wow!  TheWho got smoked!  ::OMG::

[Troll Control]

Oh, boy.  This quote probably goes further than any in the entire "indictment" of TheWho.  This one is a zinger.  You know how TheWho is always saying he "has no ties to the industry" or He's "just a regular parent"?  Well, he he is admitting otherwise:

Oh no no no Cindy, you claimed there was a "long debate" and that it was decided that "we" were only going to look at TBS's as you define them.

Who specifically is "we"?

The debate was long, Bob...  many wanted to start with "Wilderness data" and I argued that the real money was in the TBS industry, so lets start there, although wilderness is usually the inital phase of any decent TBS.  So we went round and round....you, Bob have been a key player in collecting and presenting data on the entire industry and I have been focusing on small segments at a time.
I dont want to put names out there, people want to be anon's.

Whooter is evidently an expert on "where the money's at" in the Troubled Teen Industry.  Why would he try to pass himself off as something other than an industry guy?  That's not honest at all.

[Troll Control]

Drawing the logical conclusions/case summary:

The preponderance of the evidence shows he lies a lot about a lot of things and he likely is John Reuben. The circumstantial evidence is overwhelming, the direct witness (TheWho) was proven to have been involved in TTI meetings and advising his peers "where the real money is, the TBS industry." These, again, are his own words, so he can't deny the fact. Coupled with the fact he has been proven beyond a shadow of a doubt, much less reasonable doubt or the preponderance of the evidence, to be an unmitigated liar closes the book on him. Forever. No matter how he backpedals now or how he tries to walk back what he said or how he tries to shift the focus, an impressive case with has been compiled with copious solid evidence.

We still haven't really discussed this part yet, but let's begin to examine when the Board of Advisors was formed at STICC and added to the website. We already established that STICC started fishing for its first placement in August, 2006. We already established that TheWho was at a TTI meeting in Chicago in December, 2006.

What I haven't yet revealed is that STICC's website was updated on December 30th, 2006 and in that update, the Board of Advisors was announced and posted on the website for the first time. This was a mere week after TheWho had admittedly met TTI players in Chicago. So it's pretty clear that he went to this IECA "professional development seminar" in December of 2006 in order to "develop professionally," i.e. establish a network whereby he could achieve his first placement with STICC and make some insider connections. So to speak, to "launch" his business, STICC, which until that time had failed to get off the ground (make a placement) in nearly four months of trying since STICC was awarded Department of Juvenile Justice funding to place state-mandated children into Aspen Programs.

The evidence is simply overwhelming.Guest
 

[Anonymous]

FUCK

[Troll Control]

*bump*  For educational purposes.

[Whooter]

So lets see where we stand with our anonymous guest:

I challenged him to go through each item on his list... lets take a look:

Our anonymous guest said :Link
“you both took a trip to Chicago to meet with Lon Woodbury, Martha Kolbe and a host of other industry bogeymen just before STICC was launched.”
.......  Fact: STICC was launched in April of 2004
....... Fact: My post places me in Chicago January of 2007.

Conclusion:  Our anonymous guest was off by 3 years.
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Next our anonymous guest said: Link

I also have a little PM exchange between you and me (using the login "Concerned Parent"). I wrote you a PM asking for info on ASR and you wrote me back to contact you privately at your email address:
PM Between TheWho and Concerned Parent from 2007 wrote:
Re: Is ASR a good program?
Sent: Fri Jun 06, 2007 1:07 pm
From: TheWho
To: Concerned Parent

Personally I think ASR is a good program. It worked for our family. My kid was there

when Dave Marcus wrote his book based on the kids in the program and they got back on

track and matured. I have been to the campus many times and think if it's a good fit

for your son that you shouldn't worry about it. Don't trust what you read on this site

because the members here are all anti-program and have an agenda to discredit all

programs. If you want to contact me outside fornits I can help you get in contact with

someone who can help you make the right decision. You can email me at

onekidatatime@yahoo.com. Good luck and I hope it all works out for you.


Going to deny this as well? I never called you out on it before, but I held onto it just in case you wanted to deny later that you said it.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
We all asked that the PM be authenticated, Psy offered to do the work.  But our anonymous guest declined.  I wonder why?

Can anyone guess why they wouldn’t want the PM authorized?

[Troll Control]

Since when does anyone need to have their PMs "authorized"?  That's a stupid statement from a stupid person.  I don't see how December 2006 to January 2007 is three years.  Funny math there, Whooter!  Why don't you have your personal information "authorized"?  

Thanks for reposting your PM though, even if youdidn't have it "authorized."  at least now everyone can see you give out Joh Reuben's email address while soliciting business.  Weird how you two have the same email address, huh?  i think we all see what's going on here, John, er, Whooter.

[Troll Control]

Funny, I just read through this whole thread and nowhere, ever, does it say anything about '2004" anywhere.  Whooter made that part up.  Read for yourself.  Start at the top and read through.  IT'S NOT THERE.  I think he snagged an anon quote from another thread and tried to pass it off as the OPs assertion, which it clearly isn't.  Whooter is just lying about it as usual.

[Whooter]

This may help:

STICC
FIRST PARAGRAPH:
SAVING TEENS  In Crisis Collaborative (STICC) is a 501(c)(3) non-profit organization formed in April of 2004 to assist troubled teens and their families struggling with substance abuse and other emotional issues.

[Whooter]

So lets see where we stand with our anonymous guest:

I challenged him to go through each item on his list... lets take a look:

Our anonymous guest said :Link
“you both took a trip to Chicago to meet with Lon Woodbury, Martha Kolbe and a host of other industry bogeymen just before STICC was launched.”
.......  Fact: STICC was launched in April of 2004
....... Fact: My post places me in Chicago January of 2007.

Conclusion:  Our anonymous guest was off by 3 years.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Next our anonymous guest said: Link

I also have a little PM exchange between you and me (using the login "Concerned Parent"). I wrote you a PM asking for info on ASR and you wrote me back to contact you privately at your email address:
PM Between TheWho and Concerned Parent from 2007 wrote:
Re: Is ASR a good program?
Sent: Fri Jun 06, 2007 1:07 pm
From: TheWho
To: Concerned Parent

Personally I think ASR is a good program. It worked for our family. My kid was there

when Dave Marcus wrote his book based on the kids in the program and they got back on

track and matured. I have been to the campus many times and think if it's a good fit

for your son that you shouldn't worry about it. Don't trust what you read on this site

because the members here are all anti-program and have an agenda to discredit all

programs. If you want to contact me outside fornits I can help you get in contact with

someone who can help you make the right decision. You can email me at

onekidatatime@yahoo.com. Good luck and I hope it all works out for you.


Going to deny this as well? I never called you out on it before, but I held onto it just in case you wanted to deny later that you said it.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
We all asked that the PM be authenticated, Psy offered to do the work.  But our anonymous guest declined.  I wonder why?

Can anyone guess why they wouldn’t want the PM authorized?

It would only make sense that the PM was made up.  Why else would he run away from having it authenticated?

[Troll Control]

What have you ever had "authenticated"?  Nothing.  You can solve the "mystery" yourself, but it's interesting to see you avoid it.  Let's authenticate your personal information first, and maybe the poster of that missive will agree to do the same.  That seems fair to me.  I'm sure she'll do it, but you first.  Lead by example and stop being a hypocrite.

Anyway, that's only a small piece of the puzzle.  Let's also authenticate your ties to the troubled teen industry.  Please tell the readers why you claim to be just a "regular" parent, but you go to TTI meetings 1200 miles from your home to discuss where the money's at in the TTI.  We're all ears.

[Troll Control]

This may help:

STICC
FIRST PARAGRAPH:
SAVING TEENS  In Crisis Collaborative (STICC) is a 501(c)(3) non-profit organization formed in April of 2004 to assist troubled teens and their families struggling with substance abuse and other emotional issues.

Great, but it has nothing to do with this thread.  Nowhere, ever, is the formation of STICC even mentioned.  Seems like you're just posting random information.  Nobody asked for it or mentioned it, but you seem to be trying to deflect from the questions.

Why did you travel 1200 miles from your home to host a TTI meeting and inform your TTI colleagues "where the real money is, the TBS industry"?  I'm sure you can see there's a huge disconnect between your actual behavior and your statement that you're just a "regular parent."  I think you weren't telling the truth.  Care to clear it up for us?  Or should we all just believe you're a liar, because they can't both be true.

[Troll Control]

Oh, boy.  This quote probably goes further than any in the entire "indictment" of TheWho.  This one is a zinger.  You know how TheWho is always saying he "has no ties to the industry" or He's "just a regular parent"?  Well, he he is admitting otherwise:

Oh no no no Cindy, you claimed there was a "long debate" and that it was decided that "we" were only going to look at TBS's as you define them.

Who specifically is "we"?

The debate was long, Bob...  many wanted to start with "Wilderness data" and I argued that the real money was in the TBS industry, so lets start there, although wilderness is usually the inital phase of any decent TBS.  So we went round and round....you, Bob have been a key player in collecting and presenting data on the entire industry and I have been focusing on small segments at a time.
I dont want to put names out there, people want to be anon's.

Whooter is evidently an expert on "where the money's at" in the Troubled Teen Industry.  Why would he try to pass himself off as something other than an industry guy?  That's not honest at all.

Whooter, please explain your direct quote above so that readers can understand your role in the troubled teen industry.  Who was at this meeting you attended?  Why would a "regular parent" go to a meeting like this?  How did you determine where "there real money is" and why?

Forgive me if I seem repetitive, but your assertion that you have no ties to the TTI and your statement above are mutually exclusive and require your explanation.