Fornits

Fornits Home for Wayward Web Fora
An open discussion about the troubled parent industry

..and people who went to straight saw more than you did.  There was a recent poster who spent 4 years in Aspen Programs and didnt see any abuse.  So it is tough to get a level of the water based on a few posters here on fornits.

I am looking at the overwhelming number of reports coming out of our public school system compared to not any coming out of these programs on a daily weekly or monthly bases.  When was the last report we saw about a child having sex with their teacher in a program?  We dont have the ratios so we dont have exact numbers but the sheer volume is overwhelming.

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Once again, programs cut off all communication with the outside world. How are kids supposed to report abuse? As far as the poster who spent 4 years in the program, give him a few more years to shake off the brain washing. I didn't say anything bad about programs for almost 8 years.

As far as allegations of sexual abuse, here is a pro-program document admitting to just that.

Quote

THE CRISIS BEFORE US

What Happened In Samoa?

By: Thomas J. Croke,
Publisher

Because of the sensitivity of the information in front of us, we are not reporting everything we know or believe to be true regarding the account below. We are certainly not reporting everything we have been told. We will update on the web site as we can confirm or refute some of the issues that remain unresolved.

Several years ago, the owners and founders of Cross Creek Manor established a boys' version of their program in Samoa ? Paradise Cove. A few years later, another group, also from Utah, known as A Better Way, llc., started the program known variously as Robert Louis Stevenson Youth Academy, A Better Way Youth Academy, and Mole Ole Ava. One of the principals in this group was Sterling Deveraux, a man I had known, respected and trusted since his days as a therapist at Heritage Center when I marketed there, and again at the Western Youth Network (now part of YSI). Based upon that knowledge and trust, I was the referral person behind the enrollment of their very first student, a young lady who has done extraordinarily well, and swears by the program. Very recently, another program, New Hope, was organized, then disintegrated. According to published reports and multiple sources in communication with us, some of New Hope's students were literally abandoned in the village when that program closed.

The Samoa Story begins with the group of people who have banded together, mostly on the Internet, to attempt to shut down either the Teen Help affiliated programs or the entire industry. (See ?The Crisis Before Us?, page 3.) Perhaps it starts before that, but that is when, where and how Bridge to Understanding became aware of it. A semi-organized group of people was collaborating on the Internet, some to attempt to shut down the entire industry; some to shut down the Teen Help programs in particular.

Another group, which we believe was unconnected with those described in the above paragraph, made up primarily (probably exclusively) of the parents of the young people at New Hope in Samoa, kept in touch with each other via Internet. As a result, as soon as alleged abuses were known, the word spread quickly, to the other parents. Defections followed rapidly. We assume that the drop in enrollment this caused may have dissipated the assets of the New Hope organization, leading to its demise. Published reports and direct statements to us from multiple sources say that some students were simply abandoned. According to similar reports, at the request of U.S. Chargé d'affaires William Warren, both A Better Way and Paradise Cove absorbed some of these, and others were sent home with the assistance of Mr. Warren and Tom Mockett.

The impact of the new students at A Better Way either caused or contributed to a decline in morale at A Better Way. On that, everyone, including the management of A Better Way agrees. Several other events at A Better Way also led to problems. Seemingly with agreement all around, the classroom program carried out in cooperation with the correspondence curriculum from Brigham Young University was not working as efficiently as might have been hoped, and there were some protests from parent regarding that just at the time these events were developing. A fire damaged the building facilities on the older of the two campuses. A Better Way management acknowledges some communication problems. A very charismatic Samoan staff member who was greatly beloved by the students at A Better Way and seen as a father figure by many was let go. We are not at liberty to disclose as many details as we have in our possession, but we are satisfied that this action was not undertaken frivolously. We also believe that this staff member reacted in anger to undermine the program. We have been advised by A Better Way management that the dispute has now been resolved, and others tell us this man is now back on staff.

Another event at the same time was the loss of therapist Jeff Scott, and program director Adrian Faust, just about the time Sterling Deveraux relocated to live in Samoa and take over direction of the program. The issues with Jeff and Adrian seem to be primarily that both parents and students were on overload with change. Both Jeff and Adrian had their followings, but change itself seems more an issue than the particulars of their personalities.

Over this time, and beginning prior to the introduction of the students from New Hope, some of our own parent clients were beginning to complain loudly and energetically about the manner in which they and their offspring were being handled by the program. We could not conclusively establish what went on, but we were alarmed by two A Better Way parents, in very close sequence with each other, coming into sufficient conflict to pull their young people out of the program, following what was in each case their second visit to the island. Both reported deterioration in the functioning of the program between visits, and reported very angry confrontations with program owner / managers.

By February we had our fourth report, confirmed by A Better Way management of possible inappropriate sexual contact between staff and students we had referred (when I use ?confirmed? and ?possible? in the same sentence, I mean that the management was taking the reports seriously, but in at least one case and perhaps three of the four, had some doubt about the allegation).

The first two reports had involved the night staff and we believed had been addressed properly, with respect to the victims, their parents, us as referral source and the alleged perpetrator. Of particular significance, I understood that a procedural change had been put into place to prevent similar incidents. I came back from my April, 1997 visit to Samoa understanding that female students would always sleep behind locked doors when only the all male security staff was on duty. Samoan custom does not permit Samoan women to work overnight without taking on a moral stigma, and A Better Way was limited in the number of Americans they could bring in on work visas. This made it difficult to put female staff on duty overnight. I was uncomfortable with the young women being exposed to a minimally trained all male staff in this manner, but believed the problem to be solved. I later learned (see below) that ?policy? was not maintained.
The third report of staff crossing sexual boundaries was strongly substantiated, and fit no recognizable pattern, as it involved a female staff member. The fourth was recent, and again involved the Samoan security staff. All of these involved students I had referred.

Beginning about February, we began to pick up completely unattributed and unsubstantiated allegations of sexual impropriety at A Better Way on the Internet. Our contacts in the ?opposition? group were quick to let us know they were not responsible and to attribute the source to their opposition in the pro-Teen Help group. They also made a point of not confirming the accuracy of the story, although they repeated their opposition to all offshore programs. The storm really broke for us when we began to receive phone calls and email messages from one educational consultant and several parents who were NOT our clients expressing concern about what was happening at A Better Way in Samoa. We initially doubted these stories because the two parents who had pulled their kids under very angry conditions did not support the particular issues raised. I had several conversations with owner Rodney Rice who vehemently denied most of what was being added by the latest group of protestors. He also denied the reports of the two angry parents who were our clients, although he acknowledged the four sexual incidents referred to above as being at least worthy of serious attention even if not conclusively proven. For purposes of determining procedure, they were assuming them to be true. Nevertheless, in the course of these conversations, I learned that A Better Way had not maintained what I had understood to be its policy of allowing females to sleep behind locked doors and its management denied ever having told me that. They confirmed that students at the ?basement? level had been required to sleep in an open fale (Samoan word for house or hut, pronounced ?FAH lee?), and strongly defended the propriety of that, implying that the policy would continue. I do not suggest that the managers are lying. The assurances I was given on this occurred during my visit in April, 1997, after which there has been almost 100% turnover in staff. David Smyth, one of the owner managers was present for part of this discussion, but I do not know the degree to which he was paying attention. The therapist, at the time, clearly participated in the discussion, and it was primarily he who provided the assurances, but he left the program only a few months later.

As the intensity of the matter escalated, I began to contact other IECA member consultants to gain other perspectives. Except for the one who had initiated a call to me, all reported very positive impressions, including one of great excellence with therapeutic programs, who had just visited in December. However, there was at least one additional story of crossing sexual boundaries from a consultant who believed that was the only case that had ever occurred. If that consultant, who had strongly positive regard for the program, was talking about an actual confirmed case, the total was now five.

Since the downsizing, there has been a rash of allegations of sexual abuse beyond the ones noted above, but referring to a time period before the downsizing. The common element in those complaints is the Samoan night security staff. We can neither substantiate nor refute those allegations.

There have been reports of drugs on campus. Management acknowledges that has occurred. With respect to both drug use and inappropriate sex, management gives a very different description from what some former students are saying. We all know students in behavioral change programs frequently accuse the programs of all kinds of things in order to get out, and that allegations from those sources need to be examined closely. But allegations specifically of sexual abuse can never be ignored. Programs that expect the kids to allege untrue things are in a difficult spot when that happens unless there are witnesses. That is why all staff-student behaviors under these conditions should be witnessed. That is for the protection of both staff and students.

As of this point, A Better Way has downsized, removing many of its negative students. A Better Way has issued two strongly worded letters reassuring parents and referral sources that all is now under control. We have offered to put them up on the Internet, and would like to publish excerpts here, but they will not give us permission to do that at this time. They suggest they might do so later. We will definitely give them space on the Internet for that purpose. They are accepting no female intakes and will transition remaining females out. They have pledged to keep awake female night staff on duty while females remain.

Many parents and other educational consultants, with whom we speak, give rave reviews on this program. Even our parents, who pulled their offspring in anger, confirm that their son/daughter made gains they would not have made any other way. ?Parents Corner - LifeSaver? is another sample tribute by a mother of how a program helped bring her son back to her and their family.

Although we have been less positive in the past about Paradise Cove in particular and the Teen Help programs in general than we have been with respect to A Better Way, we can absolutely confirm that those programs, too, have been lifesavers for many parents.

As I get the opportunity really to understand the volumes of material before me on this topic which I have not yet fully absorbed, I will probably say more on the Internet, and later maybe in print. Maybe by that time concern will have died down. I understand a person of great credibility will be going to Samoa soon to review the program. I hope he is in a position to publish a strong affirmation. This program is too valuable to lose. But we can't afford a repeat of some of the recent past history.

Sounds fishy.  The Ed Con admits sexual abuse and kids forced to sleep outside, but then calls the program "a life saver."  Fishy.

Also it seems to be the typical "level" sysytem and behavior modification used by most abusive facilities.  They didn't name a single teacher or therapist on their website.  The above article describes a "100% turnover" of staff.

Lots of red flags here.  I'm going to keep looking.

Public schools are having all these problems with teachers abusing students and programs are not experiencing this level.



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Some information regarding abuse.
http://www.wwaspsinfo.net/paradisecove/ ... 03.02.html

Some information alleging that WWASPS operates programs and lies about their affiliation.
http://www.unmarriedamerica.org/emancip ... awsuit.htm
"Although the St. George, Utah businessmen, Robert Lichfield, Karr Farnsworth, and Ken Kay, claim High Impact was not affiliated with WWASP, former employees and parents testified otherwise. Employees said they were told not to reveal the program’s affiliation with WWASP. One former employee testified she had personally traveled to High Impact with current WWASP President, Ken Kay, who solicited her silence."

This one is very interesting.
http://www.wwaspsinfo.net/carolina/caro ... 06.03.html
"Clinical psychologist Roderick Hall has spoken with five former students of the corporation's facilities and says these programs do more harm than good.
"The people I have talked to have post traumatic stress disorder and there's no question about it," he said. This is often referred to as shell-shock. "I have one kid who e-mails me who is in college and still has nightmares.""

Those days are long gone, Gonzotherapy, programs today don’t operate like that.

I am not trying to slam you Gonzotherapy, but I think you perspective comes from a place that is not occurring now a days and is obsolete.  It has been shut down and you don’t have any insight to what todays programs do or how they are run.

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The WWASPS name is all that is disappearing. If you take the time to read through some of the articles on these sites, you will find that is the only thing that is on the way out. Same people, same programs, same abuse, different names.

And of course I don't mean you Whooter. You are obviously well aware of all of this information. If you choose to pick this post apart, please site some evidence to back up your claims.

Again (and I have pointed this out to you before) you are confusing your personal experience with those of others.  Behavior Modification can be abusive or non abusive.  LGATs can be abusive or non abusive.  If you experienced an abusive time in your program it doesn’t mean everyone does.   I am sure the kids who attended Columbine highschool during the time of the massacre feel their high school experience was an unsafe one, but it doesn’t mean that all highschools are this way or that all kids experience the same events.

You are only able to view the industry from your single experience,Shady, where I am able to see the larger picture and can see the good along with the bad.  Yes, I have read stories of kids who were abused, but I have also seen kids do extremely well.  You have only experienced negative stories so naturally you would not be aware of the total picture to make an informed decision on any of these topics with only partial information.

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Yes, Shady's experience, my experience, and a whole hell of alot of other people on here, all of us have similar abused experiences in a program. And we all have been in programs. Just curious Whooter, exactly where do you draw your experience as such a grand authority on programs? The only place I have ever seen a positive review for a program is on their websites, or their advertisements. I don't see an entire website dedicated to exposing programs for all the good they do, but I see many, many sites out there to expose how wrong and abusive they are.

If you are so for programs, I'll make you an offer. I will gladly give you the full program experience for the bargain price of 10 grand. Then you can come here and actually have some credibility when you talk about programs. Hell, I've staffed "Teen Help" seminars, I've got a closet and some duct tape, I will hook you up.

So what I see so far is that programs may do a better job at doing criminal background checks and that is why we are not seeing the level of reported activity of abuse by staff and teachers that we are seeing coming out of our public schools..

I am not sure that is entirely accurate. The report stated that residents who were over 18 did not have sufficient background checks. Many of these programs have staff that live onsite for several days at a time. In my program some staff would live onsite for over a week or two at a time. I think resident could certainly mean staff. If the background checks were on 18 year old students, usually someone who was 18 and still in a program was court ordered. Usually a court order meant they would have a criminal history. I guarantee you no matter what that background check said those students would be allowed to stay anyways. Programs don't refuse money.

Public schools are having all these problems with teachers abusing students and programs are not experiencing this level.

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Program abuse is far above and beyond any level I have seen in a public school. In my program if a student was deemed "out of control" they were manhandled/beaten into submission. Tied up, put in isolation, sometimes for days at a time with minimal food and water. And lets not forget the fact that programs have found the perfect market to pick their victims from. What do child molesters look for? The kids who are dejected, lonely, and quiet. Damn near every kid who gets sent to a program is feeling completely lost and abandoned. They get stuck in a strange place with abusive people in power over them and are completely cut off from the outside world. Sounds to me like a child abuser's wet dream. Why don't they get reported as much? I think there are way more allegations of program abuse than public school abuse. But program victims have nobody to report to except their abuser. And you will be punished if you are still in the program and you write home or complain in the program about the abuse. You don't move up in a program unless you agree to be abused and assist in abusing others. By the time you go home if you haven't been completely brainwashed, there is very little evidence to prove your case. Why is it that communication is completely cut off? They don't let you talk to your parents until you have sufficiently accepted their psychotic ways.

These are some good points, Gonzo.  Its too bad that the private sector are not required to keep the same records as our public sector does so that we could compare the 2 directly.  At first glance I would imagine that the 2 would be fairly close in numbers because they use similar background check agencies.  


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You mean these similar background checks?Name of Provider or Supplier
RIDGE CREEK, INC
Street Address, City, State Zip Code
830 HIDDEN LAKE RD
DAHLONEGA, GA 30533
Inspection Results
As of: Saturday, October 30, 2010
the agency documented only one reference.
(2) During an interview on September 9, 2010 at about 2:15 pm with Staff EE, Staff EE indicated
that she/he is responsible for completing and maintaining employee personnel files. Staff EE
monitors the files for compliance when time permits to ensure that files are updated; however
Staff EE indicated that she/he was not fully aware of all requirements in maintaining personnel
files other than what is indicated by the agency wide checklist of the required documents needed
in the personnel files.
(3) During an interview on September 9, 2010 at about 2:35 pm with Staff DD, Staff DD indicated
that agency protocol is that staff members are required to provide references within 90 days of
employment.
This tag was previously cited on 12-03-08.
[Written personnel records] records shall include the following: ...
5. Satisfactory preliminary criminal history background check determination and a satisfactory fingerprint records
check determination as required by law for the director and foster par
This Requirement is not met as evidenced by:
Based on a review of resident files and e-mail correspondence with staff, the facility failed to
document a satisfactory preliminary criminal history background check on adults aged eighteen
or older who reside at the home;

You mean the background checks that they dont do?

Quote from: "seamus"

FOREGONE  FUCKING CONCLUSION :twofinger: WTF kinda question is that? DO POLITITIANS? LAWYERS? the  Fuckface talking heads on CNN,or FOX? HOWs ABOUT USED CAR SALESMEN? fuck me runnin. :wall:

 :roflmao:

This brings up an interesting point. Used car salesmen lie for what, $500, $1000 maybe? Programs are pushing their stink for 2,3,4, $5,000.00 a month, for usually a year or more. So if a used car salesman will sell you a line of bull for a grand, how much bullshit do you think a program will feed a parent for 50 grand?
 :bs:

In my experience it is a money issue, compounded by the psyche of true sociopaths. I was in Paradise Cove. One of the upsides to that program was the fact that the staff was Samoan. Most of the Samoan staff were actually good people. They probably didn't know much better as they grew up in third world conditions. The abuse inflicted on us was more an issue of greed by the higher ups. They ran that program like a mexican orphanage. We were fed as little as possible, and given very few necessities. In fact if you wanted your clothes clean you had to wash them yourself in one of the two tub sinks available for the 100+ kids (on my beach, there were three beaches total) that were there at any given time, with one of those old time washboards.

The whole idea behind upper levels being staff was to cut down on employee costs. I mean if you look at the way that place was set up it really is a work of genius. The Samoan staff told me one time that they got paid around 43 cents an hour, and there was a ratio of about one staff member to every ten kids. The food probably cost about 3 dollars a day per person. Now that was over ten years ago, I think my parents were paying somewhere around 2,300 a month for my tuition. Not to mention the one time enrollment fee and random medical costs etc...

So basically the gross profit was about 75 dollars a day, I would guess after factoring in all costs Samoan staff pay, rent, bills, director pay etc... they paid out no more than 25 dollars a day, that leaves them with a 50 dollar a day net profit. And I think that is extremely conservative.

Talk about a fucking cash cow. $50.00 a day per student for over 300 kids. NET profit $15,000.00 a day. Now throw in a psycopathic lack of human compassion and any sense of morality, you have just won the lottery.
Everybody has a price right, how much money would it take for you to torture children?

Karma is a bitch though. And I hope I have a front row seat when Karma smacks the fuck out of these assholes.