Cross creek manor

[laurabk]

It's been about 2 years since I got out of that place and I still think about it every damn day. I remember the feelings I would wake up with everyday there... the worst feeling ever. I can't even describe it.. it was the most surreal feeling I've ever experienced. I felt like a caged animal.. constantly nervous and vulnerable. I was a total mess. Scared shitless of being dropped even when I knew I had done nothing "against the rules." It was ridiculous. I would almost have a heart attack waiting for my family rep and couselor to come to Group. This, in my opinion, IS emotional abuse. They knew damn well that I was scared and anxious and they loved it. They wanted me to be in a vulnerable frame of mind so they could twist around my thoughts into how they wanted me to think and act. I was only there for 4 months, thank god, but I went thru the Discovery and Focus seminars and I dont think I have EVER in my life been so scared. Literally shaking, holding back tears.. feeling completely out of control and confused. These people feed on fear and they need to be put in jail.

[Anonymous]

Hi Laura, welcome to the forums. There are many people here who can relate to what you've been thorugh at Cross Creek. And I agree with you completely-- these people should be put to jail.

This forum is rather new, by the way-- most of the WWASP related discussion is taking place ta the Teen Help Industry forum right now.

[Anonymous]

On 2005-04-30 10:54:00, laurabk wrote:

"It's been about 2 years since I got out of that place and I still think about it every damn day. I remember the feelings I would wake up with everyday there... the worst feeling ever. I can't even describe it.. it was the most surreal feeling I've ever experienced. I felt like a caged animal.. constantly nervous and vulnerable. I was a total mess. Scared shitless of being dropped even when I knew I had done nothing "against the rules." It was ridiculous. I would almost have a heart attack waiting for my family rep and couselor to come to Group. This, in my opinion, IS emotional abuse. They knew damn well that I was scared and anxious and they loved it. They wanted me to be in a vulnerable frame of mind so they could twist around my thoughts into how they wanted me to think and act. I was only there for 4 months, thank god, but I went thru the Discovery and Focus seminars and I dont think I have EVER in my life been so scared. Literally shaking, holding back tears.. feeling completely out of control and confused. These people feed on fear and they need to be put in jail. "

Really?  Is that true?

[Anonymous]

On 2005-04-30 16:06:00, Anonymous wrote:

"

On 2005-04-30 10:54:00, laurabk wrote:


"It's been about 2 years since I got out of that place and I still think about it every damn day. I remember the feelings I would wake up with everyday there... the worst feeling ever. I can't even describe it.. it was the most surreal feeling I've ever experienced. I felt like a caged animal.. constantly nervous and vulnerable. I was a total mess. Scared shitless of being dropped even when I knew I had done nothing "against the rules." It was ridiculous. I would almost have a heart attack waiting for my family rep and couselor to come to Group. This, in my opinion, IS emotional abuse. They knew damn well that I was scared and anxious and they loved it. They wanted me to be in a vulnerable frame of mind so they could twist around my thoughts into how they wanted me to think and act. I was only there for 4 months, thank god, but I went thru the Discovery and Focus seminars and I dont think I have EVER in my life been so scared. Literally shaking, holding back tears.. feeling completely out of control and confused. These people feed on fear and they need to be put in jail. "

Really?  Is that true?  "

Yes, it is, you motherfucking WWASPie. That girl is telling the truth.

[Antigen]

Welcome Laura.

Have you ever thought to yourself "God, if only we could have this conversation out in the more comonly accepted reality.... :exclaim: "? Well I did. And I want to take a moment to express my deep gratitude to our anon friend here for helping to fulfil one of my long held dreams. [sniff!  :cry: ] I just can't tell you how much it means to me.

If that's appealing to you, well here's your chance! By all means, have at it. If not, just ignore the trolls and focus on what you like.

Either way, welcome.

Any policy that has Ted Byfield on the same side as many Rastafarians can fairly be said to have generated a consensus.
-- Ottawa Citizen August 28, 1997

[BuzzKill]

Laura's account closely mirrors my son's account.
He also felt the emotional distress was unendurable and took the worst toll; and he has also said jail is MUCH easier. After WWASP - Jail was a simple thing, hardly worth worrying about. This isn't what I was hoping for - as a parent.

BTW - I agree - the perpatrators of this abuse should be in jail - or rather Prison.

[ This Message was edited by: BuzzKill on 2005-04-30 19:52 ]

[Anonymous]

I remeber something really fucking weird about CCM. When I was there a short while, a girl from the upper phase campus stabbed her roomate. It was so surreal. We didnt really find out more than they wanted us to know about it, but I remember they didnt explain why it happened.

Crazy.

ginger, the more I think about it the more I realize CCM was not a good place. I can relate to the feelings of fear. Feeling scared to drop even when I hadnt done anything really wrong. I remeber soem staff members that i had forgotten that were very rude and verbally abusive. Anyone remember Ron Garret? My friend Jess and I were discussing today about how much he sucked. And David Gilcrese? How can anyone say he is a helpful good man. And I found out through a friend that my therapist was fired because he wasnt licenced to be a therapist for the things we were doing. And I found out from a really awsome staff member who quit, that they had a policy that if two girls got the same category, the one with the parents who could afford to keep her their longer would drop to phase one 0 points. The one with the parents who had little money only dropped a phase or two. It was scandelous. And she quit for various other unethical reasons. Some staf members really were there because they wanted to help the kids. I appreciated them. But I can see now ginger, the program uses intimidation to make people afraid and therfore more suceptible to brainwashing. It makes sense. Perri is going to be pissy at me, but I can see more about it now that is the truth. It wasnt physically abusive to me. But I can see how that is mental abuse. And Perri can agree wiht me that Ron Garret can be mentally abusive. I dotn think it is entirely evil, just for the most part. And the way they try to get you to change is wrong. And they dont know everything. But I do remember I liked discovery because of Jan. I would attend her seminar outside the program. And her Keys were pretty interesting too. Focus was so so and Accountability was fucking stupid. So Im going to stop babbaling now. Its been hard to come to these realizations about the program, so I get kinda sidetracked. Just kind of confessing in a way I guess. Well, Thanks for anyone who listens.
Amanda

[Antigen]

Amanda, I think it's wonderful that you're figuring this stuff out. If you understand it then you probably won't repeat the same patterns in future relationships.

And I deeply appreciate you sharing your thoughts on the matter with all of us. One of the reasons I never joined any action against Straight was that it was always about the overt violence and I thought that missed the mark. And that's why I'm especially interested in CCM over other LGA type programs.

I never did think that everyone involved in these programs was working from evil motives. For the most part, they believe that what they're doing is good and right and helpful, if unpleasant. Even David Gilcreace and Pepper Spray Jay probably tell themselves that and believe it.

But I don't think they understand the harm they do to people any more than doctors in the `50's who advised new mothers to take 6 weeks bed rest after a normal delivery, for example. The difference is that the real medical field has a strong tradition and public policy in place to help weed out bad practices. The troubled parent industry has only us.

The last struggles of a great superstition are very frequently the worst.
--Andrew Dickson

[Anonymous]

Its kinda funny. I remember in support meetings after I graduated, people were discussing how there were allegations that WWASPs programs were abusive and we all disagreed. Out of ignorance. But now that i know I wish I could go back and tell them the truth. Not that they would listen. sigh
I also remember soem heads of the program having us high phase girls go to a place to talk about how the program helped us. Now that I think about it, it is all a big cycle. They brainwash you, then they use you to recruit new kids, then they send you home unprepared for real life, and then you "relapse".

I am thinking of going into the early child development education field in college next semester. Or social work for kids from abusive homes. My Mom has alot of friends who could maybe help further this plight to stop the child abuse at these programs. I just want to do something to help, considering I have been blind to alot of this for a while. And I feel I was contirbuting to the problem not the solution. Anything I can do?
Amanda

[Antigen]

On 2005-05-19 13:20:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:

You're doing the best thing right now, educating yourself and talking about what you went though. Everyone has their own way of helping, you'll find your nitch I have NO doubt!  

I quite agree. I don't think those little recruiting junkets would be so successful if even a few audience members had a heads up on them. And there are so damned many of us who went through these programs. But, till fairly recently, no former Seedling or Straightling or whatever would have recognized the Program when they heard terms like boot camp or TBS. And vice versa. That's changing.

"Enlighten the people generally, and tyranny and oppression of both mind and body will vanish like evil spirits at the dawn of day."
Thomas Jefferson

I have always thought that all men should be free; but if any should be slaves, it should be first those who desire it for themselves, and secondly those who desire it for others.  Whenever I hear anyone arguing for slavery, I feel a strong impulse to see it tried on him personally.

--Abraham Lincoln

[Anonymous]

Ok yesterday it wouldnt let me reply and now it will so great. i had a long talk last night with my mom about CCM. She was shocked at what I told her about the forum and the abuse at Straight, Ive ridge, CCM, ect. She and I talked about something interesting. Her ex boyfriend, who was one of the people who helped my parents find a program for me, I really dislike and still do. He is a controlling bastard and my Mom and I were lucky enough to get away from him after I came home from CCM. But she remembered that when they had to go through Discovery to get to go through seminars with me, he pitched a fit in the seminar. He asked for credentials and asked for their lisence to practice therapy. When they didnt give him that and they made his wanting credentials abotu him being manipulative he walked out of the seminar and refused to go to any of them. He was a bastard, but he knew what was up. I remember when he told me how he disliked the way they were doing things at CCM, I got so defensive and mad at him. Guess I should have payed more attention. And we were alos talking about when they woudlnt let my Mom talk to me and she pitched a fit, they told her she was being "controlling" and if she wanted me to get better, she had to "let go". She might come join the forum soon which I think woudl be a good thing for her to see whats going on.
Amanda

[Nihilanthic]

And we were alos talking about when they woudlnt let my Mom talk to me and she pitched a fit, they told her she was being "controlling" and if she wanted me to get better, she had to "let go"

"Letting go" does NOT mean abdicating parental responsibility or knowledge of whats going on with your child, or cutting off contact.

Unless I am mistaken, the *ONLY* reason to cut off a child from contact with loved ones/family and especially their parents or guardians, is if that person is abusive to them.

Sorry, but that just strikes me as typical program bullshit.

They came with a Bible and their religion- stole our land, crushed our spirit... and now tell us we should be thankful to the 'Lord' for being saved.
--Chief Pontiac, American Indian Chieftain

[Antigen]

Amanda (and everybody), sorry about the forum being flakey lately. We're fending off a DOS attack over in the Straight forum and, well, we made a few mistakes along the way. I think it's all better now. But we're still tweaking. I know we accidentally blew out all of Cayo Hueso's posts in the last three weeks or so (since her IP address changed) I'm trying to get those back from the backup. If you notice anyone else who's gone missing or if you hear of anyone who got banned for no good reason, please tell them to contact us. It's no bother at all, it would be nothing but helpful.

ty

On another note, maybe you should drop the old bastard a line and thank him for paying attention. His hissy fit probably helped a lot of people get a clue, even if they didn't put it all together and act on it right away.

Oh, and I look forward to hearing from your mom. But please tell her to brace herself for some hostile responses. It's difficult for ppl to understand where the parents are coming from sometimes. But it helps a LOT when parents tough it out and speak their peace on the matter.

If there must be trouble, let it be in my day, that my child may have peace.
--Thomas Paine

_________________
Ginger Warbis ~ Antigen
Drug war POW
Seed `71 - `80
Straight, Sarasota
   10/80 - 10/82
Anonymity Anonymous
return undef() if /coercion/i;

[Anonymous]

Niles,
You dont have to apologize. I agree.

Ginger,
Well, he lives on a beach with his mother and they drink martinis all day, so I dont think if I even thanked him he would care. He saw through the bullshit, yes, but I would rather spend a week locked up in a room full of my Dad and Step Moms Right wing Presbyterian friends than talk to him for one minute, so there you have it.

My Mom is a great person. Im not sure if she will actually get on here. Shes a super busy lady. But she might if Im over and am on the website or something. I agree her perspective might help alot.
Amanda

[Antigen]

Sorry to hear about your step dad. I think you can't live w/ someone w/o coming to love them just a little. It's sad when they're unable or unwilling or just too cowardly to reciprocate.

Sounds like you and your mom have teamed up on scammers and bullies lately.  That is just SO good to hear! :nworthy:

My dad and I got along just fine once we were able to talk like reasonable human beings about all that bad water under the bridge. Any random quotes you might see attributed to Crazy Mac, that's him. He was a real living, breathing hero to me, despite his flaws and misteps. WTF, he eventually forgave all of mine!

 

Don't hate the media. Become the media

--Jello Biafra