Sending yer kidz 2 El4n?

[Anonymous]

Read some shit on here. All yer kidz issues are gonna be spread all over the net. El4n forces kids 2 talk. Take Skakel 4 example. When yer kids get out from a year 2 three years from now, kids are gonna start spreading yer kidz issues all over the net!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Do you want the world to GOOGLE yer son and know that he fucked yer daughter. Some kids at EL4n are FUCKED and they will influence yer children the wrong way. WHEN YOU son BASHES YER HEAD IN WITH A SLEDGE HAMMER( jeff ortiz-1994````former elan resident currently serving life for his adopted mothers murder) Remember that you read this as you rot in hell for placing your child in this place. Go ahead do it. Don't say I didn't warn you. It might be safer to kill a kid than to send them to ELAN SCHOOL. If you thin kYer kids not being abused you are being duped. I have a child of my own and never in a  billion years would I put them through what my parents did to me. Sorry If this gives it away, but I skipped school and talked back a little. Once I punched a hole in MY wall. That got me put in Elan for 28 months.  That's fair right. Love to see my mom jump over 20 hurdles in the snow and Yell about how Energizer Bunnies keep going and going and going ad going and goin and going and going and going and going and going and going and going...........................................................................................

[Chrysta]

Jeff Ortiz was one in a million, and your dates and facts are off. He graduated Elan in 96, killed his mom in 98. He didnt bash her head in, actually it was her back first. And none of this was BECAUSE of ELan. Jeff never truely GOT Elan, therefore, never learned what he needed to stay away from the drugs that he got strung out on that contributed to his state of mind that would allow him to do such a heinous crime.
Sounds like you also never really GOT Elan, so watch out for the drugs buddy, you may be on the same path.

[Pete]

I don't know what caused Jeff to do what he did, but the fact that years after the crime, he still insists that he's innocent makes me believe he has no conscience.  I never met a more frighteningly devious con artist than Jeff Ortiz.  And I actually liked the kid when I knew him.

The one thing about Jeff that I'll never forget was that the last time I saw him, he told me I "had a lot of willpower" for not drinking (everyone else at the New Year's '96-'97 party was drunk).  I didn't have the heart to tell him that willpower had little to do with it.  I hope one day that the God that keeps me sober helps Jeff too.

[Cynthia]

Dear Anon, My kid was homeless and on drugs. Once you are 16, you can come and go from your parents home, as you please.
You CANNOT throw them out or force them to get help, they are still your dependent.
You also cannot force them to come home.
A kid that is high everyday and refuses to go to school, won't get a job because selling drugs is higher paying, had brushes with the law (the ones he got caught for that is).
 What would be your advice on the best way to handle a kid who refuses help and is throwing his life away?
 I'll tell you, it isn't an easy choice to make and it is an emotional rollercoaster for the parents too.
I do believe that MOST parents do want what is best for their child, as I do for mine.
I believe there is no easy way out.
Until you have walked in my shoes (Which I truly hope you NEVER have to)try not to judge everyone.
I think from what you say, you were a pretty normal teenager. Some parents, like my own think you are a drug addict because you smoke a little pot. They are old fashioned and probably had done this to me had they known....
Just something to think about.

[Cynthia]

Art,
I am still unsure about why you dislike me so much. It really doesn't affect me in any way, other than I prefer to get along with most people.
If you keep your mean comments to yourself, you would be doing everyone a service.
 Who wants to read anger??
If you don't have something nice to say...it is better to keep it to yourself.
I will admit that I liked it better when you were kind to me, so I DO know that there is a nice person in there somewhere. CT

[Cynthia]

Art,
I don't need your respect. I have plenty of that from my family and friends. Courtsey is all I ask!
Not to pat myself on the back, but I am a good person who tries my best to do the right thing.
Where you come off thinking that I don't validate you horrific time there is something you concocted (sp?) yourself. It sounds like post tramatic stress.
I have read the horror stories, over and over again, from dozens of people. It WAS hell, that I know! I cannot pretend to imagine the pain.
Like losing a child, we can imagine the pain, but we can't really understand the maginatude, nor would we ever want to.
You began to disrespect me because I was happy that I sent my son to elan, and defended myself when idiots wrote sh#@ about me.
Why so mean?..CT
P.S.
 I don't know is this is what you call a "pissin match", if it is, this is not my intent.

[Cynthia]

Art,
Thanks, my son is doing well. He is actually enjoyable to be with...Wow, I never thought I would say that again.
He did hate being there, I will not discount that! He spent most of his time scrubbing floors & toilets.
 I didn't know all the staff, but most of the ones I met I liked, and so did he. A couple of guys I didn't care for were Pete Rowe, he creeped me out and I don't like his attitude. Another was that guy Marc with the dyed black hair that looks strung out.
I don't know their history, but Brian liked them both so I had to get over it.
I was a major thorn in elan's side because I called there 3-4 times a week for a progress report.
When they wouldn't take my calls,I left messages stating how I would be there in the A.M. to see things for myself. They were NOT going to blow me off!
 I had regular calls, phone conferences and his supervisor Missy would give me extra calls with him when I was feeling down. She was the one that got us through it all.
I will forever be grateful to her for that.
 I heard about the abuse, 15 or so months into the program. So what I did was get my son away from his SP and interrogate him,  ask him if any of this was going on. I told him I would pull him right out of there if it was happening. I would not send him back for 5 minutes, and I would contact the police and whoever else I needed to to make it stop. But he had better not lie to me just to leave.
He assured me he was safe, but begged to leave.
He is very happy that he got his diploma and enjoyed being on the track team.
We both wish things could have been "normal" but you don't get to choose some things in life and when you do, many times it isn't the right choice.
Fortunatly for us, elan was a desperate choice that helped.
As for these abusers, I would like to see them punished. It sounds like the horrific stories my Dad tells me about the orphanage he was in.
CT

[Anonymous]

Did Marc Rosenburg Dye his hair black? It was grey and silvery when I was there in 96.

[Chrysta]

I, on the other hand, have a lot of respect for you, Llahsram. I know it wasn't an easy desicion to send your son to Elan, nor were you giving up on him because you did. In fact, I see your move as an act of desperation. My parents were in your same shoes over 10 years ago. I can only imagine now, having 3 small children of my own, how horrific an ordeal it was for you. I applaud you for being in their faces. My parents didn't have exactly that charisma. Not to say that they didn't support me, but I was never questioned about the type of place it was by my folks...Good for You!!
As for Marc Rosenberg, I can assure you, he is NOW a decent man. One of the most influential people during my stay in Elan. As for P. Rowe, I have no clue. I only know him because I was on his cross country team. I didn't care for him, but Im sure, in E7 he helped many students.
No one claims Elan to be a picnic, and No, we don't all understand or appreciate the way Elan use to be. Can we, for future arguements sake just understand that Elan sucked both in the past and still today.
Lets all acknowledge that there were some horrific times at the hands of the same people who are now responsible for saving people.
But lets also acknowledge that the abuse IS gone. They are a different community now, and lets just be grateful for those lives that are changed for the good because of Elan.

[Cynthia]

Dear Chrysta,
Thank you for you kind comment. It is because of people like you that I continue to read and post here.(Art)
It inspires me to see how other people in a similar situation have progressed.
My son has a long way to go still, and is not nearly as level headed as I would like him to be, but you take what you get and make the best of it.
You see, my Dad was an orphan, which in turn made him obsessed with keeping his children safe. I guess this rubbed off on me. Although I HATED it as a teenager. Being a middle child, I naturally became someone who stood up for what I believed in and fought for it. Where I did mess up, was when they wanted to label him Special ED at 7. Being a layman in the school system, I flat out said no, not understanding how I may have helped him. I was too concerned that it would prevent him from getting in colleges.

I so clearly remember when I saw Brian's beautiful little face the second he was born, WOW, I finally understood it.
It is too bad that most of us, don't appreicate, nor understand how much our parents truly love us until we become parents ourselves. Thank you again.
Cindy

[Cynthia]

Art,
You have never answered my question. You know what I was dealing with. The promise to runaway from any school I sent him to really limited my options.
I needed him to stay in New England so I could afford to travel there often. I was stuck between a rock and a hard place....And Yes, we did family counciling for years. That was who steered me to theraputic schools. Hyde wouldn't take a kid that didn't want to go.
I pray not, but just a scenario, If your grandson, 16 years from now, was in a similar situation, what would you give your daughter for advice?
It this is too private, please e-mail me, or post on the the private elan site. If someone were to ever ask me for advice, I would like to have as much information as possible. I wish I had someone to go to when I needed help. That is why I hope someday I can help another family in need.
 Cindy

[Cynthia]

On 2005-03-01 20:10:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Did Marc Rosenburg Dye his hair black? It was grey and silvery when I was there in 96."

Very black! Gothic looking almost. Looks sickly with no skin color. It was summer too!
I gave him a hug as I was leaving one day,(the first time I met him)and it was creepy, I wondered if he thought I wanted him. Yuck!  I wouldn't want him near my daughter.

[Cynthia]

Art,
 This is a seroius question. What would YOU do is a similar situation? I'm not trying to give you a hard time, I am looking for opinions of better choices. I thought you would have plenty of positive choices.

[Anonymous]

Here's an interesting thread that deals somewhat with this

http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?So ... =9&start=0

[Cynthia]

Who is that? Village idiot???

I too would like to see those people put in prison. I just don't know who they are.

That Joe Richie seemed like a real piece of work. I guess his early demise was a good thing.

I think all child abusers should be punished. I don't understand why this was allowed. Was it what "the authorities" thought was the best treatment at that time? It makes no scence to me. Were they reported? Obviously there are enough people to back up the allegations that the courts should have got involved.
I'm guessing the statue of limitations has run out, at least for you. That sucks! Although you would be an excellent witness.[ This Message was edited by: Llahsram on 2005-03-02 17:06 ][ This Message was edited by: Llahsram on 2005-03-02 17:07 ]