Author Topic: 18th Birthdays  (Read 4913 times)

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Offline Timoclea

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« on: April 13, 2004, 01:24:00 PM »
What is the usual experience nowadays when a child incarcerated in a Program turns 18?

What *usually* happens?

I and my friends have a friend in a program who's coming up on her birthday, and want to ensure that if her ordeal does not end *before* that date, that it certainly ends *on* that date, and that she has money and transportation to get to wherever she decides she wants to go---that she has the resources necessary to make a free choice.

What should we expect?

The parents have made noises about her coming home before then, as I understand it, but since the story has changed, repeatedly, on other issues related to her incarceration, nobody can really count on that.

Anybody on here who experienced their 18th birthday in a Program?  Anybody have 2nd or 3rd hand accounts of people who have experienced their 18th in a Program?

It is *possible* that she'll be in a foreign country on her 18th.  How would that complicate things?

Are they likely to let her go, or if they don't, what legal strategies have proven effective in the past?

How do you get access to someone in a Program who's just turned 18 to ask her if she wants to leave? (legally, I mean)  What if they move her or even just say she's not there?

Any help of people describing their 18th birthday in Program experiences would be very helpful.

Thanks.

Men seldom, or rather never for a length of time, and deliberately, rebel against anything that does not deserve rebelling against.

--Thomas Carlyle

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Offline Timoclea

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« Reply #1 on: April 13, 2004, 01:26:00 PM »
Oh, also, anybody who knows of recent accounts where legal action has had to be employed to make a program cough up an 18 year old, links would be much appreciated.

Of course we all hope this will not be the case, but the uncertainty factor is very high.

Life may have no meaning.  Or even worse, it may have a meaning of which I disapprove.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #2 on: April 13, 2004, 03:37:00 PM »
AT the magic age of 18 any one has the right to leave any facility they have been sent to by the parents such as the behavioural facilities. If they are in a foreign country they can go to an embassy and requet repatriation. If they have no means to get to the embassy they may need assistance by a friend to help them get there. Tmay not have any papers with them. The embassy can take care of this and supply a passport and a plane ticket to get them home.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #3 on: April 13, 2004, 04:38:00 PM »
It might help if you could tell us which program you are talking about.  I've heard of various techniques being used to keep kids in programs when they reach the magic age including:

1. Plain old illegal detention, possibly with the assistance of corrupt local officials.
2. Fake court orders.
3. Telling the kid their friends have forsaken them (no way to check if held incommunicado) and the family will leave them homeless, unskilled, inexperienced and destitute unless they graduate.
4. Telling the kid they are free to leave but the nearest road is seven miles away and if they try to make it through the swamp they are likely to be eaten by alligators.
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Offline Kiwi

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« Reply #4 on: April 13, 2004, 05:02:00 PM »
:wstupid: BTW that was me.

Looking though your other posts, they seem to be mainly about WWASP.  My understanding is that the current WWASP favorite is number 3 above, though they have used 2, and possibly 1, in the past.

And if the kid is abroad, don't expect any more than the bare minimum help from the embassy.  WWASP seem to maintain a very cosy relationship with them.

[ This Message was edited by: Kiwi on 2004-04-13 14:09 ]
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #5 on: April 13, 2004, 05:43:00 PM »
Quote
On 2004-04-13 14:02:00, Kiwi wrote:

" :wstupid: BTW that was me.



Looking though your other posts, they seem to be mainly about WWASP.  My understanding is that the current WWASP favorite is number 3 above, though they have used 2, and possibly 1, in the past.



And if the kid is abroad, don't expect any more than the bare minimum help from the embassy.  WWASP seem to maintain a very cosy relationship with them.



[ This Message was edited by: Kiwi on 2004-04-13 14:09 ]"


This isn't WWASPS.  It's ASR, and nobody seems to know much about them.

It is possible that 4 is an option---Cummington MA is the back end of nowhere.
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Offline Timoclea

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« Reply #6 on: April 13, 2004, 05:46:00 PM »
That was me.

So are you saying it's routine for these places to try to hang on past age 18?

Is there some kind of place I can go to get evidence that that happens a lot?  It might actually be helpful.

Julie

The government is much more interested in preserving the purity of its ideology than it is in allowing patients to get effective medicine.
-- Ethan B. Russo, neurologist at Western Montana Clinic

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Offline Kiwi

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« Reply #7 on: April 13, 2004, 06:14:00 PM »
Quote
So are you saying it's routine for these places to try to hang on past age 18?


Don't know.  But the combination of a facility that is only interested in making money and parents who are only interested in control would seem to make it a distinct possibility.
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Offline Kiwi

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« Reply #8 on: April 13, 2004, 06:27:00 PM »
Quote
So are you saying it's routine for these places to try to hang on past age 18?

Is there some kind of place I can go to get evidence that that happens a lot? It might actually be helpful.

Julie

Why not ask peanut crunch?

http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?fo ... 2826#30186

Quote
i can answer pretty much any question from a-z regarding asr, so pm me if you have a q.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #9 on: April 13, 2004, 07:01:00 PM »
I know someone who turned 18 in a WWASP facility in Jamaica and his parents had to buy him a ticket off the island because he chose not to stay. The school took him to the airport and waited for him to leave and that was it.
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Offline Deborah

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« Reply #10 on: April 13, 2004, 07:52:00 PM »
Is your friend on life-saving meds? One story that has been told went like this:

Teen turned 18. They told him he could leave, his choice. But, as he was preparing to leave they refused to give him the meds he needed. Stating that they "were his father's property". Ironically, just like his son- chattel.

That's not choice, that's manipulation and deception- ironically what all warehouses boast about 'treating'.
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Offline Timoclea

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« Reply #11 on: April 13, 2004, 09:27:00 PM »
Quote
On 2004-04-13 16:52:00, Deborah wrote:

"

Is your friend on life-saving meds? One story that has been told went like this:



Teen turned 18. They told him he could leave, his choice. But, as he was preparing to leave they refused to give him the meds he needed. Stating that they "were his father's property". Ironically, just like his son- chattel.



That's not choice, that's manipulation and deception- ironically what all warehouses boast about 'treating'."


We could deal with that.  Take her straight to a doc-in-the-box to get a replacement prescription.  No problem.

The right of self-defense is the first law of nature; in most governments it has been the study of rulers to confine this right within the narrowest possible limits. ... and [when] the right of the people to keep and bear arms is, under any color or pretext whatsoever, prohibited, liberty, if not already annihilated, is on the brink of destruction.
-- St. George Tucker, Judge of the Virginia Supreme Court 1803

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Offline Deborah

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« Reply #12 on: April 13, 2004, 09:46:00 PM »
That works, but could be contingent on the inmate knowing there's someone outside willing to do that.
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Offline spots

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« Reply #13 on: April 13, 2004, 09:49:00 PM »
OK, third-hand experience:

My grandaughter, from Casa by the Sea (WWASPS) in Mexico, told me:

She had a friend, a great basketball coach for my grandaughter, who turned 18, and, being on already-treacherous ground with her parents, signed herself out and was completely alone.  She was basically pushed out the front fortress doors, and was said to have tried to make her way to aunts and uncles in Texas with $50 from WWASPS. Remember that Casa is about 12 miles out of Ensenada, on a freeway, and getting into the town itself is a challenge. One can only imagine how this 18yo made it to Texas.  [All this was pre-release, as my grandaughter talked to her just prior to the 18yo's release.] My grandaughter, who was very fond of the girl, still wishes she could make contact to assure that all went well, but contact between former inmates is as impossible as WWASPS can make it.

Another girl, upon turning 18, was set to go to her uncles's dental practice in a town near us in Northern California.  {We thought maybe this information was passed by our grandaughter in a censored letter to us in hopes that we would contact this girl.  We called every dentist in Mt. Shasta and Redding, asking for "Monica"..."uuuhhhh, no one here by that name".  Turns out, it was just a random statement, and our grandaughter still wonders if the girl made it into a "real life" after Casa, as she seemed to have not been afforded the opportunity to train in her uncle's dental practice.)

A third girl {first-hand experience by emails between her and me), left when she turned 18, fortified by money from her step-father, one of two stepfathers, who financed her ***38 months*** in WWASPS, the last in Casa by the Sea.  She was financed home, but home was not the Northern California place where she came from, but another location in Connecticut.  This girl, who viewed WWASPS positively, as it was the "best" family she had ever lived in, returned for a visit about 6 months after she was released [she was now looking toward college]. The visit went horribly, with Dace Goulding being his usual hurtful self, and she being escorted by two Level IV's, never allowed more than 10 feet from her escorts.  When she asked about her best friend in Casa, Dace told her the girl had been returned home.  Sadly, our "career WWASPIE" saw her best friend, and physically pushed past her "escorts" to hug the good friend who was indeed still incarcerated at Casa by the Sea. What purpose could be served by such hurtful action on the part of Dace Goulding, the director of Casa by the Sea?  To lie in order to manipulate two girls who formed a bond?  Sadism?  Meaness?  Evilness????

New parents, judge for yourself the character of the man set in complete, absolute, unregulated, unknown charge of your daughers. Is this really what you want to do?
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #14 on: April 14, 2004, 12:56:00 AM »
Even if you turn 18 in a WWASP program they CAN hold you for longer if you are there by court order as a risk to yourself or a risk to those in society. I knew a girl who was there for 6 years
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