Author Topic: Prescription pills  (Read 2167 times)

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Offline Mitt Romney

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Prescription pills
« on: May 15, 2013, 05:10:30 PM »
I found this article interesting.  It touches upon the prescription drug problem that teens are now struggling with and guides parents on ways to help their children from local to off-site placements.  Teen Challenge, Aspen Achievement Academy, Four circles recovery program and wilderness therapy are discussed.

http://www.goodhousekeeping.com/family/ ... drug-abuse



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Offline psy

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Re: Prescription pills
« Reply #1 on: May 15, 2013, 05:46:59 PM »
Quote from: "Mitt Romney"
I found this article interesting.  It touches upon the prescription drug problem that teens are now struggling with and guides parents on ways to help their children from local to off-site placements.  Teen Challenge, Aspen Achievement Academy, Four circles recovery program and wilderness therapy are discussed.

http://www.goodhousekeeping.com/family/ ... drug-abuse

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As in interesting for flambait or as interesting as in scare-the-crap-out-of-the-parents or what?  From skimming, it reads like DARE scare, not that there aren't legitimate dangers from prescription drugs (or over-prescribing Ritalin and Aderall).  I'm interested in whether you think they went over the top and what you think of their recommendations.
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Offline Mitt Romney

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Re: Prescription pills
« Reply #2 on: May 15, 2013, 08:42:24 PM »
Quote from: "psy"
Quote from: "Mitt Romney"
I found this article interesting.  It touches upon the prescription drug problem that teens are now struggling with and guides parents on ways to help their children from local to off-site placements.  Teen Challenge, Aspen Achievement Academy, Four circles recovery program and wilderness therapy are discussed.

http://www.goodhousekeeping.com/family/ ... drug-abuse

...
As in interesting for flambait or as interesting as in scare-the-crap-out-of-the-parents or what?  From skimming, it reads like DARE scare, not that there aren't legitimate dangers from prescription drugs (or over-prescribing Ritalin and Aderall).  I'm interested in whether you think they went over the top and what you think of their recommendations.

Pharm parties are one thing.  When I was young we would party on weekends, have our parties and then get back to school on Monday, but many of these kids are using pharmaceuticals all day long at school which isnt good.  The important thing is to intervene as soon as possible to reduce or stop the abuse and addiction.  The primary source for keeping kids safe is with the parents.  If the parents will not or cannot then outside agencies need to start getting involved.
Some parents overreact and send their kids away without even trying at home (and this can be hurtful)and other parents dont react at all and just let their kids get into dangerous situations and it ends up being too late to help them locally (and this can be hurtful too).
I found that the kids who went to programs made out really well.



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Offline psy

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Re: Prescription pills
« Reply #3 on: May 16, 2013, 09:37:49 AM »
See.  I don't see any real evidence that the problem is as bad as it's portrayed in that article.  The article says that according to the PDFA (and i'd take that with a grain of salt), 1 in 5 kids admitted to using other kid's medication on an off-prescription basis.  Does that include the kid who forgot his Aderall at a sleepover weekend so he takes his friend's Ritalin instead?  It's hard to know anything without the actual questions asked.  Was this an internet survey?  How was it conducted?  It's hardly hard evidence. I mean this is coming from the organization that linked smoking pot to becoming a terrorist.  If i recall correctly, it was only after Djokar Tsarnaev quit smoking pot and started smoking religion that he set off bombs in Boston. Do we blame religion?  No.  We go out of our way to excuse it.  The point is the bias coming from such an organisation speaks to the reliability of it's findings.  True science is searching for the truth.  What the PDFA does is a search for evidence in support of conclusions they already have and i'm not entirely convinced they wouldn't stretch or even manufacture evidence out of whole cloth if they felt it suited their agenda.

You say many of the kids are using drugs all day.  Perhaps that's the case, but is there any real evidence the abuse is more than, say, in the days of Jack Kerouac, or even ten years ago?  And even in cases where kids are abusing pharmaceuticals on a day to day basis, how is that any different than any other drug such as heroin or cocaine.  I agree parents should probably do a better job of keeping vidodin, oxy, etc, locked up and out of the hands of their kids -- common sense stuff, but the article goes further than that, and with quotes like this seems to encourage parents to look for evidence of abuse even when it's not there:

Quote
When Francine Haight looks back on the last months of Ryan's life, she realizes that there were small clues: He was more quiet than usual, slept more, and started hanging out with friends she didn't like.


Such behavior is common among teens and hardly indicative of drug abuse on it's own, but a parent reading this article could easily forget that and let fear draw conclusions for them.  All is needed is that fear to prompt a parent to contact an educational consultant or one of these programs directly and even you would admit that many programs will not care whether a kid truly has a problem so long as their parents are fearful, desperate, and preferably loaded. I'm glad the article suggests bringing a therapist in first, but lots of teens will refuse to talk to one for whatever reason, especially when they think what they say will be reported back to their parents.  At that point, the parents start questioning what the kid has to hide, and the first roach that turns up ends up being the smoking gun to contact the ed-con.  You're right that some kids who are sent to programs end up being better off afterwards than before, at least superficially, but at the same time, parents who send their kids to these programs are taking a terrible risk that their kids will end up in one of the more unscrupulous places that only care about the bottom line, or worse.  It's playing Russian roulette as history has shown that even programs that were once considered to be the best turn out being horrific in reality.  Even the Aspen programs you're so very fond of don't have the best reputation (MBA, etc).

What then is the solution?  Therapy, for one (let the kid choose the therapist -- one he trusts), and if it's the kid's choice, an short term inpatient detox facility coupled with some sort of outpatient support group of his or her choice.  Nobody, however, should be forced into treatment for the simple fact, first and foremost, that it doesn't work.  Some people do have to reach a sort of rock bottom before they realize they have a problem, and there is some wisdom in the theory that you can't fix a problem if you don't acknowledge it exists.  In the mean time it should be the parents job to be as responsible as possible keeping the home environment both safe and welcoming while at the same time providing offers of support if and when the teen decides he needs help.  You don't force a teenager to do something.  It simply will not work and breaking the teen is not a solution.  What you do instead is let the teen make mistakes and provide a way out if and when those mistakes become too much.
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Offline Whooter

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Re: Prescription pills
« Reply #4 on: May 16, 2013, 12:00:47 PM »
Quote
When Francine Haight looks back on the last months of Ryan's life, she realizes that there were small clues: He was more quiet than usual, slept more, and started hanging out with friends she didn't like.


There are many parents with deep pockets who would consult an edcon from the first sign of drug use.  An edcon, driven by commission, would steer the parent towards an inhouse placement.  I think this has been a problem all along, that is why I think a 3rd party signoff would be helpful in eliminating unnecessary placements.  I have always maintained that a parent should find local services for their child as an initial step and be aware of the warning signs.  After rereading the article based on your comments I feel it does tilt towards placement a little too aggressively and scares a parent into too much action.

As far as prescription drug abuse, I think it carries an extra danger in that it has been okayed by a doctor and therefore carries a false sense of security.  In my day when we took mescaline or various forms of acid we were aware of the risks, ie we didnt know what it was cut with, how pure it was, did it contain strychnine, how many times it was stepped on etc.  So we took caution and didnt over use it.  But pills like Black Beauties were considered safe because they were prescription and the thought was you could take as many as you want as often as you wanted because they were considered safe.  This mentality got kids into trouble in my day and ended up heading down a bad path.
 
So I feel kids today, taking prescription drugs, may be less aware of the dangers (based on my past experience) and therefore to be more prone to abusing it then if it were a “street drug”.  



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Offline psy

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Re: Prescription pills
« Reply #5 on: May 16, 2013, 12:30:43 PM »
Quote from: "Whooter"
There are many parents with deep pockets who would consult an edcon from the first sign of drug use.  An edcon, driven by commission, would steer the parent towards an inhouse placement.  I think this has been a problem all along, that is why I think a 3rd party signoff would be helpful in eliminating unnecessary placements.

Of course that all depends on the education level of the third party.  How often do you think it is that a psychologist, for instance, is even aware that educational consultants often take commissions from programs?  How many Psychologists are even aware of the industry's troubled past?  Not many, i'd wager.  A small minority, perhaps, but no more than that.  A third party is still a risk and no guarantee of safety.

Quote
I have always maintained that a parent should find local services for their child as an initial step and be aware of the warning signs.  After rereading the article based on your comments I feel it does tilt towards placement a little too aggressively and scares a parent into too much action.

As far as prescription drug abuse, I think it carries an extra danger in that it has been okayed by a doctor and therefore carries a false sense of security.  In my day when we took mescaline or various forms of acid we were aware of the risks, ie we didnt know what it was cut with, how pure it was, did it contain strychnine, how many times it was stepped on etc.  So we took caution and didnt over use it.  But pills like Black Beauties were considered safe because they were prescription and the thought was you could take as many as you want as often as you wanted because they were considered safe.  This mentality got kids into trouble in my day and ended up heading down a bad path.
 
So I feel kids today, taking prescription drugs, may be less aware of the dangers (based on my past experience) and therefore to be more prone to abusing it then if it were a “street drug”.

Well. I agree with you there that people (not just kids) think that because it's a prescription, it's safe.  Perhaps that can be solved by educating people better and perhaps prescribing such medications less frequently.  If the same social stigma attached to "heroin junkie" is attached to "pill head", I can see some benefit.  In a way Oxy already has a negative connotation as "Hillbilly Heroin".  There is a fine line, however, between education and propaganda, truth and scare.  Such drugs are (relatively) safe if taken as directed on a short term basis (though personally, I would not).  The same truth should be expressed of illegal drugs.  So far as I know, neither LSD nor mescaline has ever resulted in a single death (at least as a direct result of the chemical action, not some idiot without a sitter jumping out a window).  In a way i'm glad the focus is increasing on the dangers of prescription drug abuse, but at the same time I fear it's often used by people who have their own agendas.
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Benchmark Young Adult School - bad place [archive.org link]
Sue Scheff Truth - Blog on Sue Scheff
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Offline Whooter

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Re: Prescription pills
« Reply #6 on: May 16, 2013, 03:00:24 PM »
Quote from: "psy"

Of course that all depends on the education level of the third party.  How often do you think it is that a psychologist, for instance, is even aware that educational consultants often take commissions from programs?  How many Psychologists are even aware of the industry's troubled past?  Not many, i'd wager.  A small minority, perhaps, but no more than that.  A third party is still a risk and no guarantee of safety.

I think it would be a start, though.  A doctor may state that the son or daughter is not a suitable candidate for wilderness because of weight issues or drug use confided to the doctor via the child, or be able to suggest an outpatient program which is local.  I dont think may people are aware of therapeutic boarding schools, I never heard of them until the need arrived and someone suggested that I look into it.



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