Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform > The Troubled Teen Industry
Here is my take on the subject.
Anonymous:
Cayo is right. Carey is PIG SLOP, so let's just move on. I think I got the answer to yesterday's thread too. Is it hosebeast?
Antigen:
--- Quote ---On 2003-12-16 11:22:00, Anonymous wrote:
"What WWASP tortures children? When? "
--- End quote ---
Thank you for posing this question, Anon. It well illustrates a point I'm trying hard to make here.
In their view, WWASP is not torturing anybody. They're helping everybody and taking all kinds of flack for it. That is not just a cover story for them. They believe it. Jim Jones' followers, for the most part, believed in everything they were involved in too and so did most Germans throughout WWII.
I view it very differently. WWASP is, as I understand it, a corporation set up to facilitate recruiting for these schools and programs. The people who make up this corporation have a long history of direct involvement in these types of programs, but they're not involved at the moment, at least not on paper.
To say that WWASP does not torture children is like saying if you hire a hit man, then it's not murder. You'd have to believe either that what goes on in these schools and programs is not torture (and some people do believe that) or you'd have to believe that they have nothing to do with getting kids into these programs, which doesn't make any sense at all. Even they don't deny that.
--- Quote ---On 2003-12-16 11:22:00, Anonymous wrote:
No quoting newspaper articles or heresay...just the facts, please.
--- End quote ---
This is the good part. I can't even find a definition from the Nizkor list to cover this. But it's just so damned familiar, it really needs a name. Maybe someone can help.
It has to do with defining the rules of engagement in an illogical way. You want proof that WWASP tortures children. But you won't accept any of the evidence as valid. In order to hold WWASP harmless, you have to ignore it all. Newspapers, court testimoney, eye witness accounts, financial interest.
What, exactly, would you accept as proof? Would someone have to come up with a video tape showing a kid in OP, starting some time before the event to proove he didn't bring it on himself? That will never happen, or at least it's extremely unlikely. That's one reason, imo, for the full body cavity search. As long as you rule out evidence you can't control, you can always be right.
Incidentally or not, this is just exactly how the DFAF and their philisophical bretheren went about killing Anonymity Anonymous
Anonymous:
Thanks Ginger -
Your forum, as well as others, say that all programs for teens are torture. I guess it all depends on your definition of torture. Juvenile prison is torture, not just mentally, but physically. Suicide, cutting (self torture) bulemia, anorexia...symptoms of ADD (anger, self medication, stomped on self esteem by teachers, etc.) are torture as well.
Finding a program where the underlying reasons for teens self abusing can also be torture - for the parents that have tried so much and still nothing is bringing their child to be what could be considered normal. They torture themselves for not being able to handle it themselves. Torture for the kids that can no longer manipulate their parents into whatever they are manipulating them into.
Rules to following can be torture, sitting in an isolation room can be torture. Parents getting letters from their kid saying they are being abused can be torture. Separation can be torture.
Choices can be painful.
Watching your child destroy their life can be torture, even more torture, in the worst case, would be a lifetime of torture if the child dies and you didn't do anything.
So wwasp torture children...I guess all of these types of schools also torture children. These programs are "private pay" and that makes it a bad thing? What about the state run facilities that hire unqualified staff? Does it make it better because we are all paying for them? Problem with those types of programs/whatever you call them, is that are so short term, they rarely have positive results. Children in the private pay schools not only learn to make better choices, they actually have the time to apply what they've learned.
Do they come home perfect little robots? I wouldn't think so. They are better prepared for life's challenges, though...assuming they complete the entire program. Do they fall? I'm sure they do, we all do in life. We fall, we get up, we fall, we get up again...or not.
Your analogy of Jim Jones is digging pretty low, Ginger. Go to any bookstore and you'll find racks and racks of self-help books. The same things that these schools are actually having the students apply (Bradshaw, Covey, Thom Hartmann...just to name a couple).. not to just read.
Is it torture...could be, just depends on your perception. Kinda like newspaper articles and he said/she said allegations.
Froderik:
Don't worry, someone will come along any minute with alot more to say about this. I will offer you this advice on the fly though - do some more reading before you jump to that conclusion. Do a google search on Tranquility Bay, etc. and see what you find...
Ok, next -
Cayo Hueso:
--- Quote ---On 2003-12-16 12:21:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Cayo is right. Carey is PIG SLOP, so let's just move on. I think I got the answer to yesterday's thread too. Is it hosebeast?"
--- End quote ---
DO NOT include me in the name calling :exclaim: :exclaim: :exclaim: I never said ANYTHING REMOTELY LIKE THAT.
I would rather be exposed to the inconveniencies attending too much
liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it.
--Thomas Jefferson, 1791, in a letter to Archibald Stuart
--- End quote ---
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