It hasn't been easy.

[animals all of us]

The worst decision I ever made was to come and visit old mah' in La Florida.

I've spent my whole life identifying with mom, and her lack of taking care of herself rubbed off on me. So, like her, I began young looking for others to watch after me.

She dumped me off in Straight and I didn't get out until I was 18. After graduating she told me, 'You stayed in there to rebel against me' and 'You didn't do what you were supposed to do'.

A couple years later when my younger sister was out fucking the city and staying crazy high on all kinds of drugs I narked her out to my mom. Mom told me 'It's not right to incarcerate another human being'.

IT should be obvious that my mother has always had some type of sick issue with expecting men to take care of her. I have another younger sister who used to physically fight with my mom, my mom never called the police or tried to punish her in some destructive manner.

Today, years later, my mother has decided she wants to 'talk' and that Perhaps some abuses did happen in Straight Incorporated.

Most children were dumped off and forgotten in Straight Incorporated and the parents thought - well this place will naturally help me take care of a burden I don't want to handle and they will take care of our family.

I see that the problem started for me long before I went into Straight. I mean if parents were not to blame as well - why would someone like Lulu Corter be allowed to Stay in a fucking institution for THIRTEEN FUCKING YEARS, or why would I be allowed to stay in some programm without my parents asking EVEN ONCE 'Hey, son, what is going on in there that you are not telling me'.

Now I understand why my father will not speak to her - person to person.

I have seen time and time again how women do very, very strange things to their children to punish them because they have sour issues with the father or other men, and also that the law allows women to have more control (for now) over the birth and rearing of the child. Ultimately men have no say so when it comes to whether or not a child should come into this fucked up world, nevermind if you can afford to feed the damn thing - some women just FEEL that it is not right to abort what is 'part of themselves'.

Sooner than later, I know many people sense that the 'mysogonistic egg' that we have been waiting to hatch for a long time actually will crack open - and EQUALITY will be equal with the sexes. No more, 'he's a dead beat dad' or 'I was an accident'. Nope.

For other reasons this was not the issue I am trying to discuss here. I think the responsibility for something so great as institutionalizing those damn kids that they didn't want to take care of lies on both parents. My father never put forth any earnest true effort to get me out of their or to understand why I got put there and he never really made effort to get in touch with me while all of us child patients were motherfucking brainwashing each other. I am absolutely certain my other parent enjoyed telling my father, 'You can't talk to your son'.

Fortunately my parents have half paid for their mistakes. I fought with both of them even more after I got out of Straight, dumb fuckers didn't even register what they had done to me. I have come really close to actually buying a gun and factually killing them; so I feel that they are lucky that they don't have to feel the full effect of what they created. Hey, lots of people kill their families for lots less.

Buutt, I guess I am lucky, too. Opposed to that worst decision I ever made coming to Florida I would have to take all the heinous shit that has happened to me over time and realize that the best decision I have made based on those shits is to get a counselor.

Helps me to realize a number of things. Where does the responsibility with my parents end and where do mine begin

Don't get me wrong - I am in no way excusing Straight Incorporated for its severely numerable crimes against anyone. What I'm doing here is just shedding some hard light on my pathetic existence.

Alot of children did benefit from Straight Incorporated, and add up quintuple the number of succesful graduates and you would have maybe closer number to the dysfunctional families who put their oh so prized children away expecting them children to make the whole family better. 'We're depending on you Billy'. Aah, bullshit.

It is I guess healthy for me today to focus on what my responsibilities are now. And reconcile and deliniate with the folks back home where their responsibilities are at. I have spent an awful long time looking and feeling like I want others to take care of me against the things that have happened or even perceived or felt injustices to me - and then attempting at punishing others when they wouldn't do what I needed them to do, just like my parent who I completely identified with, or being oblivious to those around me, like my other parent, and not putting forth effort.

Unluckily this therapy is not what I thought it would be. I thought I would go in to see that counselor and speak about some things that happened to me and my life would change and I would feel better. Nope.

Its never easy reliving the things that have happened to you and wanting to punish the people who did it to you. I am no cold murderer or rapist like my enemies, but it certainly doesn't feel fresh having enemies in family that I've had to go back and ammend some shit that they did to me and etc.

The latest venture is kind of looking at post violence and how it continues violence. My parents were silent and violent long before Straight helped them to be that way. And I became that way, Straight merely honed it and solidified its drive home for me. I still have urges to yell at others, especially those I want to punish for doing me wrong, to release my anger. I have found myself with restraining orders because of it. Nobody wants to be called a piece of shit and told to turn themselves in for crimes. The parent who put me in Straight wanted me to be violent because of the jealousy against my other parent. I became that. I trained in it all day for three years. I spit on others, they spit back in the name of counseling, too. That shit doesn't fly in public. If you find a person to tolerate that - you might not be far from their relatives who were in Straight as well. I reckon punishing others is not okay unless you are some god or a judge or the police, or a teacher. heh heh heh.

Luckily and fortunately I don't have to be in counseling all m.f.ing day and get honest all day and be pleasing all day getting belt looped to the restroom when I need to go. I can take it as I will.
I can do these things by myself without others tricking me to do it.

[Anonymous]

Dude, you are still WAY screwed up.

A man has EVERY control over whether a child of his DNA comes into this world.

All he has to do is not spray sperm around like a fucking firehose.

Or use his hand.

Or avoid procreative forms of sex.

Or get a vasectomy.

Or wear a condom and use contraceptive foam, too, with older women (late thirties or so).

The last has a very small risk of failture.  The next to last has a vanishingly small risk of failure.  The first two work absolutely.

All he has to do is have some fucking self control.  Or, more to the point, self control about fucking.

You are a grown up.  Okay, you had a sucky childhood.  You are responsible for your behavior.  Whatever help you feel you need to get to help you do that, great, but you are STILL responsible for your behavior, help or not.  

You can blame mommy and daddy for making it hard for you to control your behavior, but it is YOUR responsibility to control it, "hard" or not.

Just because your mother was an irresponsible bitch doesn't excuse your taking it out on all other women and giving men a free pass.

Get over the misogynism.  Unless you're gay, misogynism is ultimately a self-destructive attitude.

[Anonymous]

misogynism is destructive only if you are a woman.

[Antigen]

Well I don't think you're so fucked up, Animals. I think you just described the ageless struggle to sort out the valuable bits of our heritage from the parts that are better left behind and to improve on the work of the last generation. That's all we can hope for and more than we can expect from most.

Life is like a bird, at any given moment it is droping a load. It is only a matter of time before one eventually find you.

http://fornits.com/about_us.htm' target='_new'>SysAdmin

[Anonymous]

On 2003-11-07 06:55:00, Anonymous wrote:

"misogynism is destructive only if you are a woman."

Wrong.

Everybody has fundamental human needs, one of which is intimate partnership---with a member of the opposite sex, if you're straight.  For a straight person to carry around a blanket hatred and resentment towards the opposite sex is a self-punishing act---it's an act of self-hatred or personal emotioal insecurity because it self-sabotages that person's potential for forming an intimate romantic relationship.

(Intimate in the sense of the deep emotional intimacy that takes at least ten years of a relationship to develop.)

When I see a straight male misogynist, or a straight female misandrist, my first thought is to wonder what scars they're carrying around that they need to punish themselves like that.

In this case, it's pretty obvious where the scars come from.  I'm just pointing out this piece of damage as something that still needs work for the original person to ultimately get to a place in his life where he's happy instead of carrying around all that baggage.

[animals all of us]

It's funny how people read shit like a post and that it can have enough power over them to make them attempt to strike out not guessing at their own futility.
Heh heh heh  

It would be even more funny and inflicting to say I know to whom the retardation, baggage, and the deep, emotionally scarred pride belongs.

I am taken at my own happiness that I could invoke  your emotion mr/ms anonymous writer.

[Anonymous]

On 2003-11-07 18:52:00, animals all of us wrote:

"It's funny how people read shit like a post and that it can have enough power over them to make them attempt to strike out not guessing at their own futility.

Heh heh heh  



It would be even more funny and inflicting to say I know to whom the retardation, baggage, and the deep, emotionally scarred pride belongs.



I am taken at my own happiness that I could invoke  your emotion mr/ms anonymous writer.



"

Inflicting?

That's a weird bit of program-speak.  At least, I assume it is, I wasn't in a program, so I don't know if it's program-speak or a personal idiosyncracy.  An odd way to use words, anyway.

If you were trying to guess at my mental state, you missed.  It's really kind of weird why you would feel that way, and I'm not going to guess, because you've gone someplace where I can't empathize at all---which is not good, or bad, it's just....I've lost any sense of where you're coming from.

Anyway, hope you straighten out whatever is still giving you problems and have a nice life.

[animals all of us]

If I were not ever in a cult program, why would I want to log onto a SURVIVORS sight for people who had been in a program who are trying to heal and then bastardize their posts and tell them Again that they are no good and try to make their scars more noticeable

[animals all of us]

Since you claim to never have been in a 'program', since you decidedly choose to come to a place where you state that you are lost; hmm, you would do well to sign in to a program and bring along your sexual issues and see what they do to them.  When you get out and can 'relate' then you might have something worth posting here.  Unfortunately 'ALL' are welcome here, even those who can't find themselves.

You clearly have the right not to disclose your own 'mental baggage' but have mishappenly done so bringing words like scars and baggage into the front.  
 
You could go on to write that you were merely pointing out my fault (I think this may have been your actual intent - mixed with some confusion about my first post) and what needs to happen like so many might do only IF you were in the same shoes, or that you will now keep silent, or that you 'are still lost on what I'm saying and you can't empathize'.  You say you can't see my personal ideosyncracies.

Agreed.  But I do see yours.  You went on in all of your posts about my manhood and straight male mysogyny and used the word 'he' identifying this word with me.  I made NO mention at any time as to my personal gender.  Hmm.  If you further your interests in segregration of the sexes by probing as to my sexuality you will succeed in your further unsecretive desires to appease your own personal sexual confusion and identity crisis.

Unlike you I am not going to attempt to advise you on what you should 'do' with your gender issues, in as much as you attempted to make your issues mine.  But if I were to advise I know you know what the advice would be.
 
Again it is obvious to whom the deep, emotional baggage belongs to, program or no, especially after I had waived a nice, large flag simply to speak of my own personal healing experience.

Agreeably so; no one likes blanket hatred or blanket statements.

[Antigen]

On 2003-11-08 10:53:00, animals all of us wrote:

"If I were not ever in a cult program, why would I want to log onto a SURVIVORS sight for people who had been in a program ..."

Compassion? Human interest? Journalistic ambition? Morbid curiosity? Whatever! Any publicity is good publicity, so long as the truth is on our side. The more the merrier!

Wherever the standard of freedom and Independence has been or shall be unfurled, there will [America's] heart, her benedictions and her prayers be. But she goes not abroad, in search of monsters to destroy. She is the well-wisher to the freedom and independence of all. She is the champion and vindicator only of her own.

--John Quincy Adams, Speech to the U.S. House of Representatives [July 4, 1821]

[animals all of us]

Full on, Right on.