Fornits Mythology

[SUCK IT]

There are a lot of myths on fornits, and only fornits, that are perpetuated about the troubled teen industry that are so ridiculous I can't help but take the time to point them out for people who might not have been in a treatment program, and aren't aware of the extreme stretching of the truth that happens here on fornits with regularity.

Jail is better than being in a program
Now this one should be just plain obvious. But for some reason the myth got started on fornits that being in jail or juvenille hall is somehow better than being in a program. Where to begin in crumbling this myth? First of all, you have much more freedom inside any program on this forum than you do in jail. Many of the so called abusive programs on this forum are wilderness programs, so you are camping out in a tent. Would you rather be locked in a concrete cell with violent inmates, or out camping under the Utah stars? Yeah, really difficult decision. Some go as far to suggest people facing treatment programs actually commit violent crimes to be sent to jail on purpose. Then these same people suggest other people like me offering some sanity are the "trolls", and they do so with a straight face. Fornits is a bizarre place, but I'm sure you already know that.

Running away is better than going to treatment
Even the resident intellectual with PhD's and schooling and everything, Dysfunctional Junction seems to believe this myth, as he recently offered this advice to a 15 year old girl facing treatment in a program with no history of abuse whatsoever. "But it sounded kinda fishy", according to fornits members. So they tell a 15 year old girl, think about that. 15 freaking years old, a girl, they tell her to run away from home. To a fornits extremist the only violence in society they care to notice happens in private programs. Truth is though, a 15 year old is about a brazillion more times to face being exploited, violently abused, or murdered on the streets than inside a treatment program. The fact this basic common sense fact can be so illusive to posters here shows how one sided thinking can become, and the group think of fornits takes over. Of course all the more ironic when people claiming these myths complain about people being "brainwashed" for saying treatment helped them.

Kids sent to treatment programs will likely be abused
Some bad things happen in treatment programs, kids get hurt and killed sometimes and it almost always an accident. The simple fact remains the number of kids who are abused, or hurt in treatment programs is a very slim minority of the overall group who attend. This is why fornits attempts to create an umbrella abuse, in the sense that if you attended a program at all, then you were abused. This clears up the fact that most kids aren't actually abused according to the definition of the word, but by defining treatment itself as abusive, therefore 100% of kids who go through treatment are abused. Problem solved! Those mental hurdles can get challenging though!

All programs are similar
The treatment program market is vibrant and varied. There are many different treatment options available for adolescents, varying from very lenient wilderness style programs, opulent residential programs, to more affordable options, there are so many programs that exist its hard to count. Fornits has about a dozen that they focus on, and discuss. Then they apply their conclusions to an entire industry, despite the variations in the different treatment programs. That's why it's better to offer advice to a 15 year old to run away than go to a treatment center with no signs or history of abuse. Its abusive because its a treatment program, so goes the myth. If I was abused in a long shuttered treatment program twenty five years ago, then why not also claim all treatment programs are equally abusive, it fits right into the fornits mythology.

All kids in programs are innocent, not troubled teens
The myth on fornits goes that programs will accept any old kid whose parents show interest, and all the programs are filled with teens who smoked 1 cigarette, and got sent straight to residential treatment, no passing go, no collecting 200 dollars. Sure there might be a few kids with parents this quick to the gun, but most troubled teens in programs are there after a long and sustained family problem and more than likely there parents had a good reason for seeking help, even if this reason is never divulged by the teen. Remember there's two sides to every story.

Once you have attended a treatment program, you will be traumatized and damaged forever
This is a favorite myth on fornits. That programs are so evil the kids all come out zombies of their former selves, killing themselves left and right, drug addicts and in prison. The idea of a successful program graduate diminishes the image of a PTSD riddled, drug addicted survivor so damaged by their time in a program there is no hope of recovery. This helps with the narrative that programs are evil much more than acknowledging that many people get on with their lives fine, and just might have been helped by it. This is why you get posters like dysfunctional assuming just because you went through treatment you work at Burger king, it fits conveniently into their mythology and world view of what programs produce, ie, damaged people with no hope, or brainwashed fanatics possibly also deserving sympathy and pity.

AA is abusive, is a bad thing, should be shut down, etc
Its funny most of the people making the negative statements about AA never even have been a part of it. AA is a successful organization with chapters in every city all over the world. Fornits has about a dozen regular posters, take you pick, which is more successful? For some reason any form of treatment bothers some people here. This is another strange chapter in the book of fornits mythology, among many others.

Programs brainwash you
This one is just funny. DId you know in treatment they break out the twirly black and white thing, and also hypnotists with a stopwatch. You are feeling sleepy... sleepy... and when you awake, you will love your parents and regret your dangerous actions. AWAKE! Come on people, lets get real . Nobody is getting brainwashed. People change, sometimes for the better. Were you brainwashed into being a troubled teen? No? Then perhaps it doesn't require brainwashing to fall out of that behavior either.

There are more, and they will be added in time. I hope you enjoyed this first installment of Fornits Mythology, the sooner you free your mind of group think the better off you'll be. Think for yourself don't just accept fornits mythology because some people are emotoinally attached to falsehoods, because then you will ironically be doing what you claim programs do. You wouldn't want that now would you! Until next time.

[DannyB II]

Once again a topic worth discussing. Why is Whooter, Suck IT and Danny are the only folks here bringing topics to the site worth debating.
Com'on people.

[Oscar]

Jail is better than being in a program
Now this one should be just plain obvious. But for some reason the myth got started on fornits that being in jail or juvenille hall is somehow better than being in a program. Where to begin in crumbling this myth? First of all, you have much more freedom inside any program on this forum than you do in jail. Many of the so called abusive programs on this forum are wilderness programs, so you are camping out in a tent. Would you rather be locked in a concrete cell with violent inmates, or out camping under the Utah stars? Yeah, really difficult decision. Some go as far to suggest people facing treatment programs actually commit violent crimes to be sent to jail on purpose. Then these same people suggest other people like me offering some sanity are the "trolls", and they do so with a straight face. Fornits is a bizarre place, but I'm sure you already know that.

It is not only the Fornits posters who claim it. Prison officials believe it also. Young offenders have the best in prison, by Nikolaj Aarestrup Hviid, Denmarks Radio, December 5, 2008

Running away is better than going to treatment
Even the resident intellectual with PhD's and schooling and everything, Dysfunctional Junction seems to believe this myth, as he recently offered this advice to a 15 year old girl facing treatment in a program with no history of abuse whatsoever. "But it sounded kinda fishy", according to fornits members. So they tell a 15 year old girl, think about that. 15 freaking years old, a girl, they tell her to run away from home. To a fornits extremist the only violence in society they care to notice happens in private programs. Truth is though, a 15 year old is about a brazillion more times to face being exploited, violently abused, or murdered on the streets than inside a treatment program. The fact this basic common sense fact can be so illusive to posters here shows how one sided thinking can become, and the group think of fornits takes over. Of course all the more ironic when people claiming these myths complain about people being "brainwashed" for saying treatment helped them.

Running away is always a bad option. It is a bad advice. Instead the advice should be to reach out to either the extended family or a family in the community with help from the social services. In a large number of Danish cities the social services cannot afford residential treatment, so they try to guide the teenager to a stabil family. There have been situations where a teenager has entered the office and then the staff had to start phoning classmates etc. If you can use the community to guide the teenagers, then the entire community wins including the teenager.

Kids sent to treatment programs will likely be abused
Some bad things happen in treatment programs, kids get hurt and killed sometimes and it almost always an accident. The simple fact remains the number of kids who are abused, or hurt in treatment programs is a very slim minority of the overall group who attend. This is why fornits attempts to create an umbrella abuse, in the sense that if you attended a program at all, then you were abused. This clears up the fact that most kids aren't actually abused according to the definition of the word, but by defining treatment itself as abusive, therefore 100% of kids who go through treatment are abused. Problem solved! Those mental hurdles can get challenging though!

We maintain the wiki database. We don't have count of the times where a staff member have slept with a teenager or some other kind of intervention had to be done by the authorities. Let us not forget the number of cases where the local police worked so close with the program that no police report was made. How it is possible to secure the teenagers I don't know. There are cases of abuse in residential programs all over the planet. Even here in Denmark, so I am empty when it comes how to secure the teenagers.

All programs are similar
The treatment program market is vibrant and varied. There are many different treatment options available for adolescents, varying from very lenient wilderness style programs, opulent residential programs, to more affordable options, there are so many programs that exist its hard to count. Fornits has about a dozen that they focus on, and discuss. Then they apply their conclusions to an entire industry, despite the variations in the different treatment programs. That's why it's better to offer advice to a 15 year old to run away than go to a treatment center with no signs or history of abuse. Its abusive because its a treatment program, so goes the myth. If I was abused in a long shuttered treatment program twenty five years ago, then why not also claim all treatment programs are equally abusive, it fits right into the fornits mythology.

If it became mandatory for every program to post their student and parent handbook on the front page then this claim could be put into the ground very easily so why don't they? I agree that it is a myth to some extend but a myth which the industry does nothing about and they reinforce by their oppositon.

All kids in programs are innocent, not troubled teens
The myth on fornits goes that programs will accept any old kid whose parents show interest, and all the programs are filled with teens who smoked 1 cigarette, and got sent straight to residential treatment, no passing go, no collecting 200 dollars. Sure there might be a few kids with parents this quick to the gun, but most troubled teens in programs are there after a long and sustained family problem and more than likely there parents had a good reason for seeking help, even if this reason is never divulged by the teen. Remember there's two sides to every story.

As long as the industry accept members without publicly criticizing those who they consider to be parasites in the industry, then it is easy to claim that the industry accept everyone, but there is also the problem with the educational consultants which need to be solved. What can a program do even if they work based on the best motives, if they are lied to just because the educational consultant wants to earn fast money based on the referral money which is so widespread in the business?

Once you have attended a treatment program, you will be traumatized and damaged forever
This is a favorite myth on fornits. That programs are so evil the kids all come out zombies of their former selves, killing themselves left and right, drug addicts and in prison. The idea of a successful program graduate diminishes the image of a PTSD riddled, drug addicted survivor so damaged by their time in a program there is no hope of recovery. This helps with the narrative that programs are evil much more than acknowledging that many people get on with their lives fine, and just might have been helped by it. This is why you get posters like dysfunctional assuming just because you went through treatment you work at Burger king, it fits conveniently into their mythology and world view of what programs produce, ie, damaged people with no hope, or brainwashed fanatics possibly also deserving sympathy and pity.

Even a stay in a normal boarding school can result in problems when the student has to adjust to life outside the boarding school. It is the same subject here when I read about the experiences made by thousand of students returning home from our continuation schools. It doesn't matter how pleasent the stay was. It takes time for both the family and student to adjust. If the family expects miracles and ignore this need then it will go wrong. They get another child home than they sent. They need to be there and support the transition phase.

AA is abusive, is a bad thing, should be shut down, etc
Its funny most of the people making the negative statements about AA never even have been a part of it. AA is a successful organization with chapters in every city all over the world. Fornits has about a dozen regular posters, take you pick, which is more successful? For some reason any form of treatment bothers some people here. This is another strange chapter in the book of fornits mythology, among many others.

You can only change what you do acknowledge. Using AA is as good as standing on one leg when you have decided to battle your addiction. However if you force people through rehab, then it will be abusive just as any other method used.

Programs brainwash you
This one is just funny. DId you know in treatment they break out the twirly black and white thing, and also hypnotists with a stopwatch. You are feeling sleepy... sleepy... and when you awake, you will love your parents and regret your dangerous actions. AWAKE! Come on people, lets get real . Nobody is getting brainwashed. People change, sometimes for the better. Were you brainwashed into being a troubled teen? No? Then perhaps it doesn't require brainwashing to fall out of that behavior either.

I have heard a lot of histories where people have been forced to adapt a belief they had nothing to do with. Attend a church the program decide they have to attend regardless of the fact they don't believe in the belief the program has chosen. Of course you could say that it is an error made by the parents because they should have secured that on behalf on their child, but still the right to believe in whatever kind of God you choose is a human right. I call it brainwashing to manipulate with people's belief. What do you think?

[Troll Control]

Oscar makes an effective argument here.  

The alternative is to take advice from:

SUCK IT - a poorly written fictional character who claims to have been to a program but can't name the program or describe anything about it

Whooter - the guy with a fiduciary interest in Aspen Education and professional shillpiece who has slaved here for the TTI for five years and 10,000+ posts under various usernames and aliases

DannyB II - self-described and confessed serial child abuser who dragged a girl on a rope behind his car in the name of treatment for her being, in Danny's opinion, a "fat piece of shit"

Parents do have choices here.

[Pile of Dead Kids]

SUCK IT - a poorly written fictional character who claims to have been to a program but can't name the program or describe anything about it

Whooter - the guy with a fiduciary interest in Aspen Education and professional shillpiece who has slaved here for the TTI for five years and 10,000+ posts under various usernames and aliases

DannyB II - self-described and confessed serial child abuser who dragged a girl on a rope behind his car in the name of treatment for her being, in Danny's opinion, a "fat piece of shit"

[SUCK IT]

SUCK IT - a poorly written fictional character who claims to have been to a program but can't name the program or describe anything about it

Whooter - the guy with a fiduciary interest in Aspen Education and professional shillpiece who has slaved here for the TTI for five years and 10,000+ posts under various usernames and aliases

DannyB II - self-described and confessed serial child abuser who dragged a girl on a rope behind his car in the name of treatment for her being, in Danny's opinion, a "fat piece of shit"

Thank you for adding  these to the list of fornits mythology.

This is a good reminder that conspiracy theories are an important part of the architecture of fornits mythology, as exampled by this poster who is currently under its delusional influence.

[DannyB II]

Oscar makes an effective argument here.  

The alternative is to take advice from:

SUCK IT - a poorly written fictional character who claims to have been to a program but can't name the program or describe anything about it

Whooter - the guy with a fiduciary interest in Aspen Education and professional shillpiece who has slaved here for the TTI for five years and 10,000+ posts under various usernames and aliases

DannyB II - self-described and confessed serial child abuser who dragged a girl on a rope behind his car in the name of treatment for her being, in Danny's opinion, a "fat piece of shit"

Parents do have choices here.

Dysfunction Junction was and is a employee of a Treatment Center, his last job was with "Daytop". He refuses to tell the truth about where he works today but keeps saying they do not abuse people here.
Why would a person who worked and still does work for the very TTI he so despises, badger 3 individuals who 2 have never worked for the Industry and the last one worked there when he was 17-19 yrs old, 33 yrs. ago.
May I say also that 2 out of the three did go through a program as children and the third placed his daughter there.
We were all entrusted to the very likes of Dysfunction Junction at these programs, ya know the same person who is saying abuse is rampant in the treatment centers. As a matter of fact he said that the mere behavioral model is inherently abusive. This all coming from a gentleman that says he has a Phd. So who would better know about the abuse the him.
So why is he here now abusing 3 integral parts (posters) of fornits who have suffered (as DJ would put it)from the Treatment Industry and he still works for the Industry.
I know this all sounds crazy and I admit I still need to work on this theory but believe me you will see DJ is a very troubled man. I think we need Awake to step forward and maybe take over at this point, I believe we have entered into the Psychological Arena of the "Double Blind x Two".
Pile and Dysfunction Junction running Double Blinds simultaneously within each other. Ya I know does not make much sense now but it will unfold.

[Pile of Dead Kids]

I know this all sounds crazy and I admit I still need to work on this theory but believe me you will see DJ is a very troubled man. I think we need Awake to step forward and maybe take over at this point, I believe we have entered into the Psychological Arena of the "Double Blind x Two".
Pile and Dysfunction Junction running Double Blinds simultaneously within each other. Ya I know does not make much sense now but it will unfold.

This is a good reminder that conspiracy theories are an important part of the architecture of fornits mythology, as exampled by this poster who is currently under its delusional influence.

*Bonk!* Nyuk nyuk nyuk.

[Troll Control]

Oscar makes an effective argument here.  

The alternative is to take advice from:

SUCK IT - a poorly written fictional character who claims to have been to a program but can't name the program or describe anything about it

Whooter - the guy with a fiduciary interest in Aspen Education and professional shillpiece who has slaved here for the TTI for five years and 10,000+ posts under various usernames and aliases

DannyB II - self-described and confessed serial child abuser who dragged a girl on a rope behind his car in the name of treatment for her being, in Danny's opinion, a "fat piece of shit"

Parents do have choices here.

Dysfunction Junction was and is a employee of a Treatment Center, his last job was with "Daytop". He refuses to tell the truth about where he works today but keeps saying they do not abuse people here.
Why would a person who worked and still does work for the very TTI he so despises, badger 3 individuals who 2 have never worked for the Industry and the last one worked there when he was 17-19 yrs old, 33 yrs. ago.
May I say also that 2 out of the three did go through a program as children and the third placed his daughter there.
We were all entrusted to the very likes of Dysfunction Junction at these programs, ya know the same person who is saying abuse is rampant in the treatment centers. As a matter of fact he said that the mere behavioral model is inherently abusive. This all coming from a gentleman that says he has a Phd. So who would better know about the abuse the him.
So why is he here now abusing 3 integral parts (posters) of fornits who have suffered (as DJ would put it)from the Treatment Industry and he still works for the Industry.
I know this all sounds crazy and I admit I still need to work on this theory but believe me you will see DJ is a very troubled man. I think we need Awake to step forward and maybe take over at this point, I believe we have entered into the Psychological Arena of the "Double Blind x Two".
Pile and Dysfunction Junction running Double Blinds simultaneously within each other. Ya I know does not make much sense now but it will unfold.

That's funny, Danny.  I work for a medical device manufacturer, as has been previously discussed here ad nauseum.  Are you now going to claim I work for a program and use the kids for forced labor in clean rooms making thin film transistor arrays or amorphous silicon photodiodes?  Complimentary metal oxide semiconductors?  You're a moron.

Also, how is Whooter, an industry shill, now a "survivor"?  How is SUCK IT, a fictional character, a "survivor"?  How are you, a self-confessed child abuser, a "survivor"?

You're too much, Danny boy.  And Pile just pwned you to boot.  You are Fornits mythology. :rofl:
 
All this effort in order to deflect from the fact you dragged a girl behind your car for "treatment" for her being a "fat piece of shit."  You're not well.  Not well at all, Danny.

[SUCK IT]

You're right dysfunction, I'm not a "survivor", because I reject such ridiculous terminology outright. When 100% of your peers survive the experience you were in together, how does that make you a "survivor" of anything? None of the people I was in treatment with were killed, so the term is just meaningless propaganda and only people with an agenda use it. I am someone who went to a treatment program with its own sub forum on this website though and choose to comment on it. Nobody I've ever talked to from treatment ever refers to themselves as a "survivor" this is, once again, a fornits only phenomenon. All part of upholding the mythology, it all ties together.

[Troll Control]

Which experience is that, SUCK IT?

I believe people who were sexually abused but were not killed are called "sexual abuse survivors" or "rape survivors."  It's pretty common terminology, even for people who didn't get killed by it, that is, they survived.

Why here's a whole website for people you deny are "survivors," because they lived through it.   :lala:  But you probably don't want to hear their "whining" I suppose.  To you, they just have an agenda.  

For a fictional character, you sure are a heartless sonofabitch, SUCK IT.

[DannyB II]

DJ wrote:
That's funny, Danny.  I work for a medical device manufacturer, as has been previously discussed here ad nauseum.  Are you now going to claim I work for a program and use the kids for forced labor in clean rooms making thin film transistor arrays or amorphous silicon photodiodes?  Complimentary metal oxide semiconductors?  You're a moron.

Well I don't believe you, no one has corroborated this. The only thing I have seen on this site is your employment at Daytop and I wish you would, admit to this again. You are not beyond this time in your life DJ it is still happening, know what I mean.

Also, how is Whooter, an industry shill, now a "survivor"?  How is SUCK IT, a fictional character, a "survivor"?  How are you, a self-confessed child abuser, a "survivor"?

Oh we just work it out.

All this effort in order to deflect from the fact you dragged a girl behind your car for "treatment" for her being a "fat piece of shit."  You're not well.  Not well at all, Danny.

You are way to late my friend that train left a long time ago. Pile and yourself have fun though.

[SUCK IT]

Which experience is that, SUCK IT?

I believe people who were sexually abused but were not killed are called "sexual abuse survivors" or "rape survivors."  It's pretty common terminology, even for people who didn't get killed by it, that is, they survived.

Why here's a whole website for people you deny are "survivors," because they lived through it.   :lala:  But you probably don't want to hear their "whining" I suppose.  To you, they just have an agenda.  

For a fictional character, you sure are a heartless sonofabitch, SUCK IT.

So going to a wilderness program is akin to getting sexually assaulted or abused? Or do you actually believe every kid in a treatment program is going to be raped? Nobody while I was in treatment was raped, or killed and I never once saw abuse.  So calling myself a survivor doesn't make any sense. People on fornits do it and get used to it, I've never heard it in real life before ever. What I choose to call myself and why is something you obviously get very emotional about, perplexing isn't it? I went to a treatment program with its own forum on this site, and I went to another that has never been mentioned here. I also have been in AA/NA and so I have experience with that. You can keep believing in your conspiracy theories, it doesn't change the reality of what I experienced, only your skewed perception of it. It's no skin off my back, but it might benefit you to be more honest and open to other people's experiences and opinions instead of finding dubious theories to dismiss them outright.

[Troll Control]

Of course, your response is a conflation and non sequitur, but hey, why let that stop you.  Nobody ever said "every kid in a program gets raped" or anything even approaching that.

The simple point is people don't have to be dying around you in order for you to be a survivor.  It's common terminology for all sorts of distgusting, revolting or genuinely horrific but non-fatal things, like rape and shipwrecks.  

In your world, you deny people who have been raped status as a "survivor."  To you, or your writer more accurately, if people aren't dying you aren't surviving.  That''s an obvious fallacy of logic, but I suppose unimportant to someone whose main line of critical questioning consists of "Do you want fries with that?"  

I've never heard it in real life before ever.

That's because you are woefully ignorant, SUCK IT.  You have no life experience.  See above, re: rape survivors.  "If I haven't seen it it never happened" is your mantra.  But just because you live in an insular bubble of ignorance doesn't mean others do.  Ever hear the phrase "Ignorance is bliss"?  Well, you're blissful alright.

Come back when you have functioning cerebrum or a new writer.  This one is so stupid it's not even entertaining to engage.

[SUCK IT]

For a fictional character

This is pretty funny. Think about it dysfunctional junction, if I really wanted to be a fictional character of a survivor on fornits I'm not doing a very good job. I call extremist bullshit out for what it is. I tell the truth about what really goes on in a treatment program, namely that there is plenty of good going on, not just the bad people focus on here. The agenda driven language of fornits is cult like and the group think that propel the myths outlined in this thread is ironically pathetic.

No if I wanted to be a fictional survivor that you would believe and not question I would of named myself DamagedGoods. Then I would talk about how my life sucks and I work at McDonalds and use drugs all because I was sent to treatment a dozen years ago. It, like, infringed on my civil rights man. They made me do group therapy and jumping jacks, thats like, emotional and physical abuse. I'd say my parents are assholes who sent me to a gulag and once I saw some kid restrained for some reason I don't know, and it definitely looked painful. That's guantanamo bay shit there man, these places need to be shut down. That's me being a fictional survivor believable to the likes of Dysfunctional Junction.

What I do is simply state my opinion, without an agenda. I am not arrogantly delusional like yourself, you speak as if you are surrounded by people of importance in a debate hall. This is fornits, take it down a notch. I actually am someone who went to treatment, and guess what, it actually saved my life. This isn't that hard to believe, but since I present an inconvenient truth you'd rather look for ways to dismiss my opinions without good reason. I have a lot of experience in treatment programs, unfortunately due to problems I had and so I have some things to say on the subject. The reality of it is not the black and white, evil vs. good extremism that is so prevalent on fornits. Here's something that might blow your mind, fornits is way more cult like and full of group think than any treatment program I was ever in , chew on that for a while.