Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform > Aspen Education Group
Ellen Behren's Industry Study Funded by AEG
Whooter:
--- Quote from: "Guest" ---
--- Quote from: "try another castle" ---
--- Quote ---Try making a few posts that you were abused in a program and then try making a few posts that says you were helped by one or introduce a study. See if you are welcomed equally
Interesting to say the least.
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Maybe it's time to move the only positive program reviews away from the referral pimp sites and just push it all out onto yelp. The good, the bad, the whatever.
Might as well. Consumer reviews and feedback are always fun to read.
--- Quote ---Try looking at it from our point of view
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Wow. Irony.
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Imagine if a Pulitzer prized author decided to investigate the Industry and joins a peer group and lives at a program 24/7 for over a year and then writes a book about his findings. Wouldn’t you think this would be valuable information? Do you think it would be discussed here?
Well it all happened and the book was tossed aside here at fornits because no abuse was found and the reality didn’t fit with the fornits perception. We all see the books being offered at the top of each page here yet this one was withheld. Something to think about.
If fornits was about transparency and honesty then why is information constantly withheld or omitted ?
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I never knew there was someone who wrote a book about being programs. Give me the name of it, I would like to take a look.
try another castle:
--- Quote ---Wouldn’t you think this would be valuable information?
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No. There are plenty of books/films/interpretive dance in the works on both sides of this issue, and as far as Im concerned, it's just another personal anecdote, regardless of what kind of dog license you keep behind your desk, and regardless if it's pro, con or in between. I'm sure it would most likely be compelling and interesting, and it would probably something I would be interested in reading. I agree with the above poster that I would absolutely be into checking out this book.
However, it's absolutely devoid of science, and as such, totally worthless in establishing any variance or deviation to any sort of control or standard.
According to you, this book is kind of an "embedded reporter" first-person account of their own experience. The data I think we should all be interested in is what happens after the program... 5, 10, 20 years out, and the data should have the format of a census, not a story.
Troll Control:
--- Quote from: "Guest" ---
--- Quote from: "Actual Mark DeGroot, The Original Canyon Poster" ---
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--- Quote from: "Mark DeGroot" ---For the record, I did NOT write the above. It appears the poster is so weak of mind and evidence he or she feels the need to impersonate me to try to prove a point. Obviously, this person has conceded that I have credibility and he/she doesn't, or he/she wouldn't be trying to convince people he/she is me. Just goes to show this person has no credibility.
I worked for Canyon and it's an "inside business" creating marketing materials for programs, mostly Aspen programs. Most Aspen programs don't even offer any treatment and all of the ones Canyon looked into provided no therapy or treatment plan, which was the concern of legitimate researchers on our staff. It quickly became clear that this exercise was purely for marketing and sales, not science, so roughly 75% of Canyon employees resigned due to this ethical problem.
It didn't stop Canyon from collecting AEG's money, plus "royalties" for every kid sent to Aspen where the intake revealed the parents relied on this information. Canyon is essentially making referral fees or lasting royalties based on Aspen enrollment, so of course Canyon will make Aspen look successful, even if the data don't suggest that at all.
Ellen was the director of an Aspen program and failed to disclose tht fact to us or to critics of the study. It's a massive red flag in research science.
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I posted this, but am again being trolled by someone trying to impersonate me. Is this how 'program parents' behave here? I've been on other forums where they are respectful even if they disagree. This person represents the worst type of person: the ones who only seek to stifle dialog, like the one everyone calls 'The Who' here.
Someone before said the guy trolling me is him. If so, why doesn't he just make some sort of factual argument to rebut what I've said instead of playing games like a little kid?
I worked at Canyon Research, so just ask if you want to know the truth about their business. this other person pretending to be me obviously is some sort of marketer wanting to change the subject when it gets ugly, just like at Canyon. Hmmm...
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I'm not going to engage in baby games with this John Reuben guy. I wrote the above, but none of the other posts and now that guy has made a username of MY NAME. That still does not make him me. He obviously knows nothing about Canyon and doesn't know any of the people there. I do. But you people can handle your own trolls here, I have better things to do with my time than engage'The Who' in juvenile games. But, just so everyone is clear, I DO NOT have a username and the person posting as username "Mark DeGroot" is not me.
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Thanks for sharing what you know about this so-called study, Mark. Industry people hate it when insiders spill the beans about what they don't want to become public. They turn on, and eat, their own with vigor. It's a sign that they know they're losing ground or have lost the argument.
This TheWho fellow that has created a log in name with your name is typical of this. You can see he abandoned rational debate and went right on to ad hominems and impersonating you. He couldn't refute your information, nor does he know anything about Canyon, or even studies for that matter. He's basically mindless, only present to disrupt. All he wants to make sure of is that nothing gets discussed.
Impersonating you is the way he deals with the fact that he lost this argument. But don't feel special. He lost this argument several years ago to a woman named Deborah who exposed him as a fraud. He's so venomous and bitter about this that he still brings her up to this day, even though most people don't know who she is, as she hasn't posted in years.
Programs are hurting. The economy is weak and killing their revenue. They have been exposed legally in many states and have lost millions upon millions in lawsuits. They're shutting down left and right. And places like Fornits expose the workers who help to break the law and hurt kids so that they can't work with kids if employers check.
Like the child abuser who recently got hired and fired from a school district. He was exposed by Fornits to show his criminal history and outstanding charges of battering a child and he was fired right away. This incenses people like TheWho that support child abusers and even refer children to be abused by them, like he did his own two sons. The older one is dead now from an overdose. The younger one said in his groups at HLA that he thought his father caused his mother's death. This is one screwed up person you're dealing with here, Mark. Plus he runs a feeder group that uses government juvenile justice money to send delinquents to Aspen Education Group programs.
He's deeply invested and will fight dishonestly, tooth and nail, to keep his piece of the pie. He is actually the only poster that disagrees with you on this thread, but he spends a lot of time posting as various people and trolling anyone who brings substance, as you did by exposing Canyon as the fraud that it truly is.
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Even the research staff won't support this obvious fraud! Geez.
Whooter:
I don’t understand why people would try to impersonate me and twist my words. The last post used my name but was not written by me. I thought by getting a user name this would stop.
The research done by Canyon Research and Consulting was a good solid study. The people working there are dedicated and professional. This attempt to damage their reputation and the results is appalling and void of any truth or bases.
Anonymous:
You're going to get sued Reuben, but in the interim we can all hope that your employers get wind of your psychopathic activities on Fornits.
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