My son at Aspen Ranch

[Whooter]

FYI, the truth about mail at Aspen ranch -all mail, incoming and outgoing is screened by staff.  This Nigel troll is just carefully making his point by not lying directly, but leaving out the obvious.  That is, he's intentionally vague as a trolling tactic.  

Example: he says his son "seals the envelopes" himself, BUT, what he leaves out is that his son's counselor reads the letter before it goes into the envelope.  If it contains any message that Aspen Ranch does not want converyed to the parent, the kid is simply forced to rewrite it as the counselor says or lose the whole letter home.  Nigel knows this, but tells the small nugget of truth, that his son physically seals the envelope, albeit with the contents censored.

Maybe his son is already brainwashed and only writes nice things about the program..... lol


Having a tough time swallowing the fact that Aspen isn’t the big bad monster you want people to believe it is?
Nigel’s son is going to be fine.  We all know that.

[NIGEL]

I know I probably shouldn't respond, but here goes:

In response to:

"FYI, the truth about mail at Aspen ranch -all mail, incoming and outgoing is screened by staff. This Nigel troll is just carefully making his point by not lying directly, but leaving out the obvious. That is, he's intentionally vague as a trolling tactic. "

This is not how it is done right now (whether it used to be done this way, I don't know).  My son writes his letters and is not required to show anyone its contents.  In previous letters he has complained about The Aspen Ranch and wrote about how horrible it is.  I truly beleive that his letters are private and confidential.  

As for the fact you think I'm "trolling", as I have said before, I probably can't convince you, so this will be the last time I address that (probably).  I am a parent of a current student at Aspen Ranch.  I am not an advocate of the school, and at this time I don't know whether I think it was a good decision to send him there or not.  I am evaluating the program and I will pull my son the second I think I should.  I have been posting here to ask for advice to help my with my own  decision making.  I will continue to do so for the duration of my son's stay, and will also give updates when he comes home.  I have listened and evaluated all the advice I have been given here, and I will continue to do so.

And to this:

"Nigel’s son is going to be fine. We all know that."

I don't know this (although I hope for it on a daily basis).

[Troll Control]

2/10 but only for posing as two people that disagree (even if only ever-so-slightly).

Aspen has been well publicized in the past month for killing a couple of kids.  I don't say they're "monsters," though.  They're child killers.  No need for hyperbole.

TheWho posts..."NIGEL" posts...TheWho posts..."NIGEL" posts...and on and on. :beat:  :beat:  :beat:

[Whooter]

I know I probably shouldn't respond, but here goes:

In response to:

"FYI, the truth about mail at Aspen ranch -all mail, incoming and outgoing is screened by staff. This Nigel troll is just carefully making his point by not lying directly, but leaving out the obvious. That is, he's intentionally vague as a trolling tactic. "

This is not how it is done right now (whether it used to be done this way, I don't know).  My son writes his letters and is not required to show anyone its contents.  In previous letters he has complained about The Aspen Ranch and wrote about how horrible it is.  I truly beleive that his letters are private and confidential.  

As for the fact you think I'm "trolling", as I have said before, I probably can't convince you, so this will be the last time I address that (probably).  I am a parent of a current student at Aspen Ranch.  I am not an advocate of the school, and at this time I don't know whether I think it was a good decision to send him there or not.  I am evaluating the program and I will pull my son the second I think I should.  I have been posting here to ask for advice to help my with my own  decision making.  I will continue to do so for the duration of my son's stay, and will also give updates when he comes home.  I have listened and evaluated all the advice I have been given here, and I will continue to do so.

And to this:

"Nigel’s son is going to be fine. We all know that."

I don't know this (although I hope for it on a daily basis).

Thanks Nigel.  It can be tough to ignore the trolls sometimes, but there are many of us who are interested in your updates and candid posting.  We would like you to continue.

[psy]

I will continue to do so for the duration of my son's stay, and will also give updates when he comes home.  I have listened and evaluated all the advice I have been given here, and I will continue to do so.

I hope so.  Regardless of whether or not I agree with your opinions, I do appreciate your input here.  Whether or not what you are saying is truthful is up to each individual reader to decide.

I hope Aspen Ranch isn't as bad as some of Aspen's other programs but frankly, i'm not convinced the chances of that are high.  Parent corporations of programs tend to dictate a lot of policy.  Time will tell. I hope for your son's sake I'm wrong.

[Whooter]

Not sure I can agree with you,psy, on the Aspen Ed group.  From some of the information that I have seen Aspen Ranch has had a better track record than Academy at Swift River (ASR) and ASR is a very transparent program with great success among the kids that are accepted there.  So if that is any indication then Aspen Ranch is a good pick.  Aspen also oversees SUWS of the Carolinas which is a wilderness program and has served as a great alternative to boot camp for struggling teens.

[Anonymous]

I will continue to do so for the duration of my son's stay, and will also give updates when he comes home.  I have listened and evaluated all the advice I have been given here, and I will continue to do so.

I hope so.  Regardless of whether or not I agree with your opinions, I do appreciate your input here.  Whether or not what you are saying is truthful is up to each individual reader to decide.

I hope Aspen Ranch isn't as bad as some of Aspen's other programs but frankly, i'm not convinced the chances of that are high.  Parent corporations of programs tend to dictate a lot of policy.  Time will tell. I hope for your son's sake I'm wrong.

You're talking to it as if it's real? Any particualr reason you don't think it's just another Aspen Education Group troll?

[Troll Control]

Not sure I can agree with you,psy, on the Aspen Ed group.  From some of the information that I have seen Aspen Ranch has had a better track record than Academy at Swift River (ASR) and ASR is a very transparent program with great success among the kids that are accepted there.  So if that is any indication then Aspen Ranch is a good pick.  Aspen also oversees SUWS of the Carolinas which is a wilderness program and has served as a great alternative to boot camp for struggling teens.

Editor's note:  Each of the above-mentioned programs has killed children in their care.  This is spun as "great success."  Ask the dead children if they feel successful.

[Troll Control]

Hey, Nigel, in light of this admission by AEG lawyers, under oath, in open court, on public record, how do you feel now about the "treatment" your son is allegedly receiving at Aspen Ranch?  

I'm interested to hear your response now that it is indelibly self-admitted by AEG that they provide no treatment or therapy as construed by any legal definition.  Or how about the fact that your son's "treatment records" can be willfully disclosed to the police or general public because Aspen, not being a provider of treatment, feels it is exempt from HIPAA laws?

[Whooter]

Hey, Nigel, in light of this admission by AEG lawyers, under oath, in open court, on public record, how do you feel now about the "treatment" your son is allegedly receiving at Aspen Ranch?  

I'm interested to hear your response now that it is indelibly self-admitted by AEG that they provide no treatment or therapy as construed by any legal definition.  Or how about the fact that your son's "treatment records" can be willfully disclosed to the police or general public because Aspen, not being a provider of treatment, feels it is exempt from HIPAA laws?

Whoa!!  DJ, your desperation is showing. Nigel can easily check the credentials of his sons therapist.  The therapist is licensed and needs to adhere to the HIPPA laws which they do.  The counselors and staff who are not licensed do not need to adhere to these (see you misread it, the counselors and staff don’t need to be licensed).  Aspen education knows this and you just choose to misinterpret the posting.

You tried to blur the difference between therapist and counselor, DJ, Nice try.

Welcome back!!

[NIGEL]

The only thing I can comment on at this point is about what I know.  My son's main therapist is licensed.  He also sees a licensed psychiatrist.  His Therapist runs the show for my son's "team."  I am fully aware that there are counselors at the school that are not licensed psychologists.  All group discussions are either led by or coordinated by my son's therapist.  Is there the possibility that a counselor who isn't licensed might not know the best way to communicate with kids and thus do some harm---obviously (I think the same is true with a licensed professional---the license doesn't necessarily make one perfect). I can let you know what my son has reported.  He likes his therapist.  He says that some of the counselors are "really cool, they totally understand what I am going through"(his words).  He has also stated that there are some counselors that he thinks "hates him," and are thus "holding him back."  He hasn't reported anything to me that screams "abuse."  In all of my conversations with his therapist, I have been very impressed.  Does that mean that I have made up my mind on whether or not The Aspen Ranch is a good fit for my son----NO.  To the best of my ability, I am asking questions and checking things out.  I am talking to other parents that have kids at the Aspen Ranch. I will continue to check things out and report back.

[Anonymous]

You've already lost. The game's over. Why? Why the fuck do you keep trying to convince us you're real? You can't even interact. You have failed the Turing Test. -2/10.

[Anonymous]

Whoa!!  DJ, your desperation is showing. Nigel can easily check the credentials of his sons therapist.  The therapist is licensed and needs to adhere to the HIPPA laws which they do.  The counselors and staff who are not licensed do not need to adhere to these (see you misread it, the counselors and staff don’t need to be licensed).  Aspen education knows this and you just choose to misinterpret the posting.

The only thing I can comment on at this point is about what I know. My son's main therapist is licensed. He also sees a licensed psychiatrist. His Therapist runs the show for my son's "team." I am fully aware that there are counselors at the school that are not licensed psychologists. All group discussions are either led by or coordinated by my son's therapist. Is there the possibility that a counselor who isn't licensed might not know the best way to communicate with kids and thus do some harm---obviously (I think the same is true with a licensed professional---the license doesn't necessarily make one perfect).

Eh, John Reuben's latest marionette, Nigel-sockpuppet appears to expand on John's rationalization of Aspen Education Group of Torture Chambers failure to provide a licensed therapist for their "patient’s" therapy. Surprise!

Asshole, there‘s no relevant distinction between a "therapist" and "counselor."  These terms are fairly interchangeable, and, anyway, to call yourself either one you need to have a LICENSE—something the people overseeing Pence’s "therapy" did not.

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_d ... to_possess
http://www.counselingseattle.com/consumer/2.htm

In this case, Aspen education program, plaintiff and judge use the terms "counselor" and "therapist" interchangeably about the woman in question.

NorthStar did not promise to do the things that plaintiffs complain they failed to do, such as provide counseling by a LICENSED counselor

Matthew Pence met with NorthStar COUNSELOR Trudy Godat sometime around 5:00 or 5:30PM on July 2, 2003.

Plaintiffs complain that Matthew Pence was seen by an unlicensed THERAPIST, Trudy Godat

Plaintiffs find the duty of confidentiality in Oregon's confidentiality statute, Oregon statutes regulating professional COUNSELORS, and the federal Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act (HIPAA). Oregon's confidentiality statutes provide only that a confidential relationship is not breached if a disclosure is permitted by state or federal law. Or. Rev. Stat. § 192.523; Or. Rev. Stat. § 192.520. Because she is not a LICENCED COUNSELOR and there is no evidence she is an employee of a licensed counselor, Harless is not subject to confidentiality laws applicable to licensed counselors and their employees.

Aspen Education Group’s whole defense stands on the premise it NEVER promised to, nor it does provide therapeutic treatment conformative to accepted medical practices, that it is not a treatment program for mental or drug disorders, by any legal definition, that the “counseling sessions” it provides are not therapeutic processes, and that the employees that provide them are not licensed therapists or medical personnel enough for it  to be libel  HIPPA statutess.

[Anonymous]

P.S.

Aspen Education Group specifies on its website it does not differentiate between counselor and therapist
http://www.northstarcenter.com/drugtrea ... #honorcode

definition of Counselor This term is used interchangeably with therapist to indicate the staff member who is primarily responsible for the emotional growth of the student. The counselors meet with students one to two times weekly and work on a wide range of recovery, emotional and family issues

Aspen Education Group specifies on its website it does not differentiate between counseling and therapy

definition of Individual Therapy
This is used interchangeably with counseling. The counselors meet with students one to two times weekly and work on a wide range of recovery, emotional and family issues. A variety of therapy techniques are used depending on the counselor. Due to confidentiality restrictions, what takes place in therapy sessions is between the student and his/her counselor.

Meanwhile states that what is discovered under the treatment process will be kept confidential

Confidentiality
Because the students at NorthStar are legally adults, parents have no access to student files without student permission. Much of the treatment process will be kept confidential from the parents. However, since parents are usually the financial sponsors and must be kept abreast of student's progress for this reason, students agree when enrolling to have general information conveyed to parents

and the "residential treatment staff" are included within that confidentiality rubric." In that rubric were the "clinical directors" and therapists that induced Pence's confession, and then reported to the police.

[Whooter]

Thanks for clearing it up for us Nigel.  Sometimes there is confusion around which staff are licensed and which are not.