Author Topic: The US Department of State and Off-Shore Programs  (Read 3214 times)

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Offline spots

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« on: August 21, 2003, 06:52:00 PM »
If anybody, parent or child, has had direct contact, or seen a State Department visitor while at Casa by the Sea or Tranquility Bay, I would like to talk to you about it.  What I need is factual information about who is visited, do they have a list they are working off of, how they approach kids, who is part of the touring group (how many administrative folks, and who they are).  If you did not talk with such a visitor, but simply saw the group walking around, your input would also be valuable.  

I have been told that "surprise" visits happen every 2-3 weeks, but I know for a fact that there is no suprise there.  My Congressman would like further information.  Please email me privately at [email protected].

Sue
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Offline Carey

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« Reply #1 on: August 21, 2003, 08:40:00 PM »
How do you know that for a fact?  Are you there monitoring everyone who goes in and everyone who comes out?
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #2 on: August 22, 2003, 02:25:00 AM »
Spots - Ensenada has hotels.  Go park your nose outside Casa by the Sea and see how many parents are in and out of there on a daily basis.  Then go grab them and tell them how abused their children are and they better get them out while they can!  Now you're on a new mission to see if the State Department REALLY inspects on a regular basis.  Do you honestly think wwasp would let them "skip" their inspections?  NOT! You're a bit on the obsessed side.  Did PURE brainwash you too??
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Offline FaceKhan

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« Reply #3 on: August 22, 2003, 03:05:00 AM »
It has occured to me often that a lot of wwasp parents really only care about themselves and actually deep down want their kid to be abused for all the pain they feel they were put through.

Of course when their kid self-destructs after a few months or years because of the abuse in that place they will deny it has anything to do with the abuse except to say they are relapsing. Then about 30 years down the road the parent will wonder why they don't see their grandkids and why their own grown child does not visit or even call. The poor poor parents. I weep for you...really.

they need more cyanide in the coolaid just like they need more cancer in the cigarrettes.

But don't worry I am just venting, what people do when they are angry, I don't really mean all of it, just the part where the world would be a better place if parents who tried to send their kids to these hellholes were shot along with the ones who run them. I think Republicans call that a detterant effect.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #4 on: August 22, 2003, 11:55:00 AM »
FaceKhan

Your suggestion could be applicable IF parents knew their kids were being abused in the facilities WWASP tortures them in.

My experience,I was not aware what was transpiring within teh facilities until after he came home.

THAT'S the point!  

The purpose to share with the world the truth.

WWASP,Task facilitators,staff,Wwasp PARENTS WITH A FINACIAL AGENDA,Teen Help,THEY lie .

It isnt such a simple picture to paint.

Koolaid drinking definately is a fact to be considered.

Dont be angry with the parents.Help with the solution.   Contact your congressman and demand legislation governing these type of programs.
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Offline spots

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« Reply #5 on: August 22, 2003, 01:53:00 PM »
Thank you to the folks who have already emailed me privately about State visits, as well as FaceKhan and an Anonymous intelligent perspective.  Yes!!!!  Write your elected representatives.

It appears most people reading this request understand what I want and why.  Disregarding Carey and the other person posting really clueless sound bites about State visits...

State from Tijuana DOES visit regularly.  I positively know this.  Could be from the 3 weeks continual phone calls between me and Tijuana Consulate, or maybe my 1+ hour conversation when the main consular officer phoned me at home.  From these conversations, I know they do visit according to law, but their "random, surprise" visits are arranged well in advance, and usually involve lunch with Dace before the "inspection".  

If you are a former inmate or a parent of one, please ask if anyone ever personally saw visitors (an entourage of "suits") walking around.  Tijuana State told me he often brings Mexican officials with him on these inspections, thereby presumably also blunting the impact of the visit for the concerned Mexican authorities as well.  From his very candid and detailed call, I *know* what he does (because I believe what he said).

If a shred of what kids say on this and other Internet sites is correct, the consular officer is only being shown Upper Level areas (he is told other areas are off limits, because "it disturbs the students" to have visitors roaming around). He told me what food was being served, little anecdotes about student activities, the silence of nearly 600 teens which he equated to his Catholic school experience as normal.  Ask any of your Casa friends if 5 kids sunning themselves in beach chairs overlooking the Pacific Ocean is a normal Casa afternoon.  Mr. Anceldua thought so!

This gentleman has his own agenda, which I interpret as maintaining the quiet status quo in his own little kingdom.  Since he has become the Front Man for the American Government, it is imperative to use the power of the US government to gain access to "questionable" areas of Casa by the Sea. The US Department of State has become the de facto arbitrator of whether there is abuse or not, not something his job description emphasized. Pressure needs to be put upon the State Department in D.C. to broaden the witnessing and recognition of abuse...to not accept a cursory look-see and declare this facility A-OK.  

Bruce Grant is the State Department official responsible for inspecting Tranquility Bay.  Only in the last 2 months or so has he begun to treat the public, his bosses in Washington, and inquring parents as anything more than nasty impediments to his tidy station in Jamaica. Parents have tried to determine the conditions at TB before they send their kids in, and State in Kingston, Jamaica has said there have been no complaints...when, in fact, there have been a raft of them specifically to the Embassy in Jamaica.  There has been a change lately, however, with a lot more candor and cooperation from Mr. Grant and his staff.  It may be a coincidence that several very high-profile media reports absolutely blasting Tranquility Bay have appeared in the media in the last 2 months.

I want to see the State Department do a better job in protecting US citizens in Mexico.  Please think hard, and let me know if you can add any corroboration, so we can talk to Washington, D.C. and implement the controls the government thinks it already has in place in Mexico.  Ask any WWASPS veterans you know, especially those who do not regularly read this forum.  Thank you.
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Offline Antigen

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« Reply #6 on: August 22, 2003, 03:37:00 PM »
Quote
On 2003-08-22 10:53:00, spots wrote:

"I want to see the State Department do a better job in protecting US citizens in Mexico. Please think hard, and let me know if you can add any corroboration, so we can talk to Washington, D.C. and implement the controls the government thinks it already has in place in Mexico. Ask any WWASPS veterans you know, especially those who do not regularly read this forum. Thank you."


1) Please do as the lady asks. It's not a whole lot of effort or expense on your part and it may well do some good. But...

2) Don't count on it! When it comes right down to it, what we're really talking about is "the controls the government thinks it already has in place in Mexico.", or elsewhere for that matter. And, despite having some credit hours in history and a few decades of experience with human beings, government and how the world works, some people actually believe that if the government certifies something, then it MUST be good and pure and wholesome and that, if it's not, then someone else is responsible and you can and will get paid for your trouble.

To those people I would like to say  

WAAAAAAAAAKE UP!!!! :idea: ...


...all the way! Come fully concious and come to terms with that fact that, you, and not some government functionary, are responsible for making sure that the people with whom you entrust your very own progeny are reliable, kind and honest. Make sure your kids understand this. Save a friend or neighbor some trouble and heartache by sharing this nugget of wisdom with them.

I'm not talking about some esoteric or abstract political view. And I don't mean should when I say must. What I mean is that, regardless of your or anyone else's fond wishes to the contrary, Big Brother is not watching out for your best interest. You must look out for yourself or don't come cryin' ta' me about it. I told ya' so!

The only difference between me and a madman is that I am not mad.
-- Salvador Dali

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Offline Carey

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« Reply #7 on: August 22, 2003, 03:57:00 PM »
Quote
Your suggestion could be applicable IF parents knew their kids were being abused in the facilities WWASP tortures them in.

My experience,I was not aware what was transpiring within teh facilities until after he came home.


Its your job to know!  There is no excuse for not knowing whether or not your child is safe...especially when YOU have placed them in an institution that holds them against their will.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #8 on: August 22, 2003, 09:39:00 PM »
You gotta be kidding, Uncle Sam to the rescue of America's youth incarcerated in private (meaning parent-funded) institutions?  Where have you been the past few years as more and more states voted to enact legislation making it easier to try kids as adults and lock 'em up on the taxpayers dime?

 :eek:
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #9 on: August 23, 2003, 12:45:00 AM »
Spots wrote::
State from Tijuana DOES visit regularly. I positively know this. Could be from the 3 weeks continual phone calls between me and Tijuana Consulate, or maybe my 1+ hour conversation when the main consular officer phoned me at home."

We're supposed to believe YOU had anything to do with inspections?  That's funny :rofl: There are many parents in and out of there everyday from 8am until 8 pm.  How are they muffling the screams of the kids you think are being beaten and abused?  It's really not big - do they have underground compound no one knows about.  You've seen too many Stephen King movies or reading way too much fiction - Are you helping Ryan write his script?
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Offline spots

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« Reply #10 on: August 23, 2003, 11:57:00 AM »
Quote

We're supposed to believe YOU had anything to do with inspections?  That's funny :rofl: There are many parents in and out of there everyday from 8am until 8 pm.  How are they muffling the screams of the kids you think are being beaten and abused?  It's really not big - do they have underground compound no one knows about.  You've seen too many Stephen King movies or reading way too much fiction - Are you helping Ryan write his script?"


We could all probably move toward changing this industry if we could gain insight into why this poster responds as she does.  I think I wrote a pretty calm request, backed by reasonable explanations.  I am hoping that working the "regulation angle" might be ONE WAY to rein in the worst schools.  

*It is absurd to read into my statements that I had anything to do with inspections.  Obviously there is already a legal obligation in place for DOS to visit, whether requested to or not.  Why would Anon accuse me of taking credit?

*Parents may be there, but my point is (duh, read it again, Anon) that neither parents nor government officials are being allowed beyond carefully-selected places.  A parent requesting to see his child before Level IV and seminars is taken to a one-way mirrored room and observed through the glass.  [statement from 3 different parents I personally know of].

*Muffled screams and beatings are easy to "catch".  Think bigger here, Anon.  Whacking on your child at home with a plastic baseball bat is clearly child abuse, but then SO IS KEEPING HIM IN A DARK CLOSET FOR A YEAR, AWAY FROM ALL SOCIETY, DECENT FOOD, EDUCATION, NEEDING PERMISSION TO PERFORM BODILY FUNCTIONS, DEVOID OF SOCIAL INTERACTION WITH PEERS...at home.  Just enlarge the closet to a Casa or TB compound, and expand your definition of abuse.  You have to think big to understand abuse, Anon; the little "easy" stuff is not the worst.

*The comment about hidden dungeons and the ever-resourceful reference to Ryan and the Movie?  Well, if you run out of the intelligent things you can say after one post, might as well revert to the same ole-same ole.  It's always good for a rant and tickle.

My point is, what motivates this kind of response to my DOS question?  Why is it so important for this anonymous person to attack my question, with inane and really stupid "reasons"?  What is in it for her that she is so persistent with no new news?  She doesn't seem to have a child to defend.  She doesn't seem to have money spent that needs justification.  She may be protecting her job with fierceness, regardless of the impact that job has on families.  She doesn't seem to have anything on the "positive" side to justify all this negative that is her knee-jerk reaction.  Maybe she just hates her own mother, and this feels good to vent that hate.

What a sad, lonely, ineffective person this is.  I wish I could walk away and leave her screaming after me as I go into the sunlight.  But I must continue to bring sunlight down into the darkness, and this devil just happens to be hiding in every crevice on the path there.  ...Sigh...
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #11 on: August 23, 2003, 10:35:00 PM »
Its so easy for Carey and others to blame parents for reaching out for help for their troubled teens.

I take full responsibity for the mistake.

The issue is the ABUSE . Not the parent's error in trusting the untrustworthy.

Direct your ugliness in the correct direction.

This forum is not one of support, but of attacks against humanity. How sick.How unkind.
What do you all strive to accomplish?
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Offline Carey

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« Reply #12 on: August 23, 2003, 10:49:00 PM »
I have not blamed anyone for reaching out for help.  What I said is that it is a parents job to know whether or not their child is safe, especially if they have put them into a place that holds them against their will.

Do you not agree with that?

If you have guilt, well don't blame me.  All I am trying to do is to reach the parents of kids who are still in these types of programs.  I think it is their job to know, without a doubt, that their child is safe.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #13 on: August 23, 2003, 10:52:00 PM »
Spots,

FYI  Bruce Kraft is the American representative in the Embassy ,Jamaica. 876 929-5374  
fax 876 935 6018

Ambassador in Jamaica; Sue Cobb fax 876 935 6035


GRANT is the alledged sexual predator at  TB.
NO longer employed ???

Credibility is important.
Facts need to be accurate.

John Ashcroft US attorney General:[email protected]
Fax 202 307 6777
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #14 on: August 23, 2003, 11:00:00 PM »
Carey

I agree with parent's need to be aware .



Better yet, don't trust at all.
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