$tr8 stripped our social coping mechanisms...

[starry-eyed pirate]

Hello.  I was in the Springfield $tr8 for 23 months, from 85-87.  When I finally got out I had all kinds of social problems.  You know the feeling of being separated from yourself and the terror of not knowing the way back and the nervous breakdowns that beckon you.  The separation from self that comes from being held up and stripped of your self.  By others. Strangers you don't know.

When I went into $tr8 I was shocked by the invasion.  I mean I was hit by it.  I remember studying what was happening to me, as it was all goin down.  The betrayal.  I went along with things at first, because it was obvious they meant to use physical force to keep me.  They introduced me to group as I looked for some weakness.  A way to escape.  I was on front row, sitting there in shock, disoriented and yet knowing I'd been right all along.  I'd found what I was looking for.  Proof that they'd been espousing lies as the truth, the whole time.  I was right and now I had no doubt in myself. I had strong intuition.  

They were somehow threatened by the way I wandered out and astray.  Threatened by my adult potential which wasn't far away.  I was a bold experimenter before $tr8. I wanted to learn things for myself, in my own way.  I didn't want to be like everyone else.  I wanted wisdom and adventure, in it's infinite form.

I wanted to know what would happen, and I found out.  They'll sneak up around you.  Conspiring to imprison you.  Where once imprisoned they will stand you up in the middle of the prison room and take turns psychologically analyzing your every move, your every word and secret thought, until all your social coping skills have been revealed and destroyed in front of you.  They'll even watch the way you defecate.  Finally you'll stand there wondering how the heck you're supposed to react, or behave.  What the F do they want ??!!  All the little ways you used to have tucked away, that you could pull out of your pocket and say had been taken from you by then.  All your cool little ways that were the things your friends loved about you were identified as druggie ways.  Your coping mechanisms were smashed in front of everyone in group.  You were smashed.  

And as you stood there, surrounded by the group, completely psychologically shattered with nothing to cling to as your identity you were offered the program.  $tr8 stripped away all our natural( you could say organic, I guess) social coping mechanisms and social filters and installed instead a foreign and artificial system of thought in our heads.

Even though I was hip to their ways and even though at times I copped out and misbehaved, I still spent nearly 28 months directly under their influence, or in the cult.  So the program is in me and is something I am always wrestlin with, even though I reject it outright.  It was beaten into me.  

In my dealings with people since $tr8 I've had a lot of trouble. You know.  A lot of awkwardness.  Not the way I was prior to $tr8.  Before $tr8 I could handle every social situation I faced.  Quite adeptly even.  What $tr8 did to me personally was to stunt me socially by stripping me of all of my social coping mechanisms and then into that void they tried to put the program, but I rejected that, and so am left with nothing.  This has been very unnerving.

I'm seriuous.  When you don't have the usual social filters that most everyone naturally has then you lose.  When you can't cope with normal social situations because all your ways have been beaten outta you, it  can mess you up.  This is just another reason why $tr8 was bad.  The psycho-trauma and duress is a whole nother thing...

So in the end, even though I got the answers I sought, what I found was the true nature of things... :beat:  My advice...Don't believe the things they say...After all the talk of "Freedom" and "Liberty" and Justice" they will force you anyway they can.

I'm empowered by the knowledge and crippled by the experience.

[Froderik]

Hello.  I was in the Springfield $tr8 for 23 months, from 85-87.  When I finally got out I had all kinds of social problems.  You know the feeling of being separated from yourself and the terror of not knowing the way back and the nervous breakdowns that beckon you.  The separation from self that comes from being held up and stripped of your self.  By others. Strangers you don't know.

Yes, unfortunately I know the feeling.

Proof that they'd been espousing lies as the truth, the whole time.  I was right and now I had no doubt in myself. I had strong intuition.

I did too, to a point. (I know I've used the following example before, but music means a lot to me so...) I believed The Dead Kennedys had a realistic grasp on what was going down in America at the time and were trying to inform the kids about the ways of the system with albums like Fresh Fruit for Rotting Vegetables and In God We Trust, Inc. Now here I was faced with this creepy, Moral Majority-based brand of "Tough Love." Too weird, and too fucked up. (And before the DKs, there was Black Sabbath warning me with albums like Master of Reality.) Like you, I saw the writing on the wall at that early age...

I didn't want to be like everyone else.  I wanted wisdom and adventure, in it's infinite form.

I felt this way, too. I don't know about infinite, but the rest holds true for sure!

I wanted to know what would happen, and I found out.  They'll sneak up around you.  Conspiring to imprison you.  Where once imprisoned they will stand you up in the middle of the prison room and take turns psychologically analyzing your every move, your every word and secret thought, until all your social coping skills have been revealed and destroyed in front of you.  They'll even watch the way you defecate.  Finally you'll stand there wondering how the heck you're supposed to react, or behave.  What the F do they want ??!!  All the little ways you used to have tucked away, that you could pull out of your pocket and say had been taken from you by then.  All your cool little ways that were the things your friends loved about you were identified as druggie ways.  Your coping mechanisms were smashed in front of everyone in group.  You were smashed.

And as you stood there, surrounded by the group, completely psychologically shattered with nothing to cling to as your identity you were offered the program.  $tr8 stripped away all our natural( you could say organic, I guess) social coping mechanisms and social filters and installed instead a foreign and artificial system of thought in our heads.

Well said, and very true. The ridicule, the endlessly repeated bullshit...

Even though I was hip to their ways and even though at times I copped out and misbehaved, I still spent nearly 28 months directly under their influence, or in the cult.  So the program is in me and is something I am always wrestlin with, even though I reject it outright.  It was beaten into me.  

In my dealings with people since $tr8 I've had a lot of trouble. You know.  A lot of awkwardness.  Not the way I was prior to $tr8.  Before $tr8 I could handle every social situation I faced.  Quite adeptly even.  What $tr8 did to me personally was to stunt me socially by stripping me of all of my social coping mechanisms and then into that void they tried to put the program, but I rejected that, and so am left with nothing.  This has been very unnerving.

I'm serious.  When you don't have the usual social filters that most everyone naturally has then you lose.  When you can't cope with normal social situations because all your ways have been beaten outta you, it  can mess you up.  This is just another reason why $tr8 was bad.  The psycho-trauma and duress is a whole 'nother thing...

I also experienced social debility after I got out, and to this day I can still get 'rubbed the wrong way' by things most people would probably let roll off their backs...

So in the end, even though I got the answers I sought, what I found was the true nature of things... :beat:  My advice...Don't believe the things they say...After all the talk of "Freedom" and "Liberty" and Justice" they will force you anyway they can.

Yes, they were always "full of shit" and still are, no doubt about that!!

I'm empowered by the knowledge and crippled by the experience.

Well said!

:peace:

[Inculcated]

http://www.veryicon.com/icon/ico/Object ... bottle.ico
   

http://www.veryicon.com/icon/ico/Object ... easure.ico
For the Starry-Eyed Pirate ^

(Sorry it necessitates a treasure map by link, I let it down load and it did something, but hmmm, no image)
 

 
 http://www.veryicon.com/icon/ico/Art/Ra ... shroom.ico

For Froderik ^

[Botched Programming]

Pirate my brother.. Probobaly one of the most elequenly wrote post I have seen you compose, and I have seen a few from you. When I read your post I felt, I remembered, I felt the feelings, the desperation, and most of all I wanted freedom. We were stripped of our youth. Pardon the expression "Get them while they are young and they will follow your every order." This was an infamous idealogy that transpired way before Sembler grasp the concept. Mind control began with the US government with MK Ultra and Sembler must have read alot on the project as he has always had some sort of Government influence.
Straight's tactics were to strip a person of being human and transforming them into some type of robot that follows authority without question, they have no individuality.

Without individuality people become a progam that only does as ordered.. There is no shades of gray that only a human can make decisions on. "Life is not just black an white."

While in Straight I was forced to endure more than any prison sentance I could have ever gotten. I would still have a shred of dignaty and at least know when I would get out had I been properly informed of my rights as a us citizen. However he knew that minors have no rights. This is just food for thought.


I am honestly trying to hold my profanity to a minimum for the benefit of a parent looking for help. I want them to know that programs are not the answer. It actually severs ther relationship and puts even greater distance between parent and child.

Thank you Pirate for reminding me of "Why I come to Fornits"

And most of all "Thanks for reminding me I am a human being, I am not a puppet on a string."

[Anonymous]

You know the feeling of being separated from yourself and the terror of not knowing the way back and the nervous breakdowns that beckon you. The separation from self that comes from being held up and stripped of your self.

I don't even know what to say.

That whole post was beautifully put.

[Woof-a-Doof]

Hyya Pirate

My My how you have grown in recent months!

In our discussions over the years and even up till the time we spent together in PA. your discussions of Straight Inc. were laced with anger, hatred, pollitics and conspiracy. Not good, not bad, not right, not wrong. It was just you at that point in time.

As difficult as it is, I have always suggested removing the emotions of the experiance to have a better view of our experiance. Not implying that one simply be passive, yet like a professional boxer in the ring. If the boxer is angered, it becomes a distraction and soon the athelete finds themselves flat on the mat, hazzely looking toward the ceiling.

I am not saying that you were ever wrong in your view point. Nor am I denying your your emotions, that are real and deserved...you came by them honestly. Yet the emotions of anger, rage, wrath all those kinds of emotions both of us share, along with the rest of us, don't serve us well in the long haul.

As I know you, you are an extremly thoughtful, insightful being. Having met you and enjoyed your hospitality, my instincts were proven correct beyond a shadow of a doubt. One of the greatest things I witnessed at the "gathering" was VALIDATION. And what I have noticed since that time is peacefulness which I attribute directly to that "validation" experianced by all of us that attended. That "validation" came from listening to others experiances, discussing my own experiance and the pondering of healing.

The "gathering", rather after the "gathering" my mind has been for the most part tranquil and productive. I was anxious to write of the experiance, and yet my mind had no inclination to continue, at least with the angst that fueled the need to compose. Again, I can only attribute that to "validation".

Survivors, face to face with other survivors...probably frightens many of us beyond belief! But that was not my experiance. My experiance after the "gathering" I thought was my own. Although I believed others there experianced the "validation", I certainly didnt expect the benifits to linger as long as they have continued to last. You may not have actually said the words, but from reading your words, I sense strongly you also were deeply affected by the "validation" during the "gathering".

I have what I begain to write still and my memories of the "gathering" are strong and vibrant! I havent felt the desire to write, perhaps because my emotional motive has changed. However, I see a new reason to sit and write the story. Like I said, I walked away with my experiance as my own and now I see that the experiance was not mine exclusively...alas, another "validation".

Survivor facing another survivor, looking into the eyes of another that understands my own. I can not begin to express the value of such a meeting. We proved, if only to ourselves (and the others that attended), that we as survivors can sit and talk, peacefully, calmly and most of all, productively.

Again, I am inspired! I feel refreshed, re-newed. I know now what the benifits of a "gathering" can have. I may not be able to articulate them in a logical sensible manner just yet, but your post illustrates it perfectly...especially I think to those that know you and have followed your writtings. You have reaffirmed my suspicion that we can heal, that we can have peace of mind and we can all get abong....errr, along.

Tears dont come easy to me, but as I write these words, tears burn my eyes. I am genuinely happy for you...I am happy for me and I am happy for all of us. The term survivor has taken a new meaning this morning!

I wish you:
Continued Peace
Continued Healing
Om Shanti my Brotha
woof

[Anonymous]

Social retardation? Yep, ok, we're validated, but but but do survivors continue to make it harder on themselves and others anyway because of the inherently intense critiquing aspects of this ingrained presence? I notice a need to stamp disclaimers on damn near everything I say or write unless I am attacking someone like an open program or whathaveyou. Why? Can people not decide for themselves the meaning of my speech and writings? Why put disclaimers on them when simply making observations and basic conversations? I'll be glad when that tendency dies. It's hard to maintain a conversation in a social situation having to worry all the damn time about what I'm trying to say. I tell myself; SPIT IT OUT DUDE!!! Yeah, well, it takes too much time sometimes, lots of times actually processing the "disclaimers",  :beat:
I have hope though, as I have seen many survivor folks who have overcome this most devious side effect.

And..
Hi Starry, let's play phone tag...  :cheers:  :roflmao:

"Beehive Wilson"

[starry-eyed pirate]

..."Beehive Wilson"...??    

Who's that ??...

Anyway, yes, thankyou all for responding.  I just, you know, find myself thinkin about these things sometimes, brooding even.  Some even call me "the brooder", cause I'm so serious all the time.  But I am just considering things in my own way...that's how I get sometimes, or I guess more of the time than I like to admit...

Ahhh.  "Hatred" is a strong term Woof.  I don't feel it much.  I mostly remember it immediately after the program and during the times when I was always hungry and cold.  I have at times embraced my hatred though, when I felt like it, never settled into it, really. But you're right, everything is in motion and the 1st one now will later be last.  The stone that the builder refuse will be the head corner stone.

Validation is a big deal when you've suffered an invisible trauma.

Hey Botched, Frod,  glad you enjoyed the read.

 :poison:  :peace:

[Withdraw]

It is nice to come here and read what you write. I keep waiting for the book. I am not sure why, but your words cradle and soothe me. I guess it is some kind of validation that I feel when you write about how you experience things. I can't help but picture you coming back to group with your black hair and looking so rebellious. You validated me even then, I knew that you knew that place was fucked up.. I always wished I could run away like that, but they never let go of my belt loop...I envied you.

I know you felt striped away, but your strong spirit shone through. Those of us with true eyes could see it. Even through all the angry writing, it was never gone. Remember how I use to post my spirit was lost? I found it, it never left.. It was exactly where I left it... =) Thank you for reminding me where I left it. I may have never gone to college.. (dam that made a starry eyed-Withdraw **Tears). You and the expression of your struggle has made an impact in my life, forever. I am sure you impact many people the same way. Pirate, I am proud to say that you are my friend.

The power they worked so hard to keep... was just that.. They needed us to believe we had been stripped away, somehow lost forever.. If we had nothing left but the group...Then the group is what we needed to identify self.

I posted awhile back about finally being able to identify myself through my present abilities and accomplishments, and not all the terrible things that were done to me.. That is what I meant, I found my real self... the child-self who isn't all bogged down with the psychological noise of control dramas... and tragedy. That noise has faded.

Learning to function socially is slowly coming along. I have to be very careful about fully disclosing my personal life...I am learning that it is not always appropriate in public. I have to pretty conscience during any conversations with non-close friends.. I tend to say way too much. It is amazing, how stunned people are when you talk about family and institutional abuse like you would talk about anything mainstream and socially normal....

Today I received an invitation from the college to apply to their scholarly program because of my 4.0 GPA. I cried. I can't believe how far I have come from that stripped away, shell of that straightimposed Hell. A livable amount of healing is possible, forgetting and forgiving is not.

Peace2u

[Froderik]

If I were to say that Pirate's words cradled and soothed me, people might start to wonder if there was something they didn't know about me. But I will say I always liked reading his posts (as well as Dragonfly's) from the beginning, and still do. There is something hope-inspiring and validating about them, for sure. I remember thinking to myself, "It'd sure be cool to meet and hang out with this Pirate guy someday; to talk about what a crock Straight was, what a crock society is; and to kick back in "the shed" and listen to some vinyl while we get outside of our minds for a while...so it has been almost like a prayer answered (sorry for this analogy, if it rubs the wrong way) to meet him in real life. I was going through a lot of emotional trauma then (to make a long story short), and felt a strong need for understanding ears.

Withdraw, I like what you had to say about the psychological noise of control dramas fading away. They (the program ignoramuses) never knew shit about us or anything (especially treating drug-addiction) and they never will. The whole program was based on lies and bullshit disinformation from the start. Hell, it can be traced back to MKULTRA and Korean brainwashing camps, as you probably know already...

Congrats on that 4.0!! I went to college a few years ago (took Pre-Alg and English 101, and like you, aced both courses), but did not continue the school-year for lack of money, time, not to mention I seem to have trouble getting myself to focus on academics for any length of time; I've always had this trouble. This is part of what landed me in Straight (punk rock, getting caught having sex, running away, and getting caught dealing didn't help much either). Anyway, we all have our paths in life, and it's good to see you are still on your way (I'm working on it.)

[Withdraw]

Beh! You know you feel cradled and soothed! Admit it! ;p

That didn't need to imply intimacy.. silly. I am also cradled and soothed by the voice of Joanne Shenandoah, in much the same way. She sings the reality of the native people of this country. Her song, "Tonight, I wear Black".... really touches that distant part of myself that embraces the eternal pain.


And I also like to read Dragonfly's posts too =) I haven't seen any in awhile though. Maybe, I just don't pop in enough.

[Froderik]

And I also like to read Dragonfly's posts too =) I haven't seen any in awhile though. Maybe, I just don't pop in enough.

Dragonfly posts once in an ultra-blue moon these days...but I forgot to mention, aside from reading Pirate & Dragonfly's posts, I really enjoyed reading your posts as well! I loved reading those stories you would post about how you lived off of the land, etc. Some of those old threads would be cool to read again...

[Anonymous]

I am on my way to a Pow Wow now <3

I need the drumming. I need the beauty of the dancing and the smell of burning sage.

You know, my brand of cult-ure. ;p

[straight is shit]

Bravo... Damn, that was good.

Two days ago, I watched the film Nick Gaglia made titled "Over the GW". It really took me back. And... I guess, has brought out a lot of anger. I've been angry, moody, on edge the last couple days after watching it. Reading your post calmed me. Thanks for that.

Peace...

[dragonfly]