Hidden Lake Academy - ORS Reports

[RobertBruce]

So 3,000 pages is meaningless unless we know what the average is… where will our kids feel safe and where is the best place for them. We need to find answers to these questions.

Then by all means, provide something from the public sector we can compare it to.

[Anonymous]

So 3,000 pages is meaningless unless we know what the average is… where will our kids feel safe and where is the best place for them. We need to find answers to these questions.

I dunno about other people, but personally I'd like a place with zero violations like my local school district and my local in/outpatient facilities.

Why would anyone be so stupid as to ask if 3000 pages "is more than average"?  Who cares?  It's hundreds and hundreds of violations.

[TheWho]

So 3,000 pages is meaningless unless we know what the average is… where will our kids feel safe and where is the best place for them. We need to find answers to these questions.

I dunno about other people, but personally I'd like a place with zero violations like my local school district and my local in/outpatient facilities.

Why would anyone be so stupid as to ask if 3000 pages "is more than average"?  Who cares?  It's hundreds and hundreds of violations.

Good luck finding a place with zero violations.  I went thru 6 pages of schools in the state of Georgia and there were not any.  You might want to consider home schooling... oh but you would need to get rid of your microwave because if your kid heated up some urine or tied a sibling up with rope you would be considered a highly abusive household.

[Troll Control]

My local school district has zero violations.  Neither do my local outpatient or inpatient facilities.  

As for Georgia schools, you'll have to post what you've found, as it sounds very suspicious.

The main point here is that HLA is dangerous, unsafe, untherapeutic and run in an illegal manner.  This is well-documented.  So I don't care how HLA ranks in a continuum of "TBS's" because all I have to do is take a five minute perusal of HLA's case file to know I would never, ever place any kid there for any reason.  It's really that simple.  I don't care which of these facilities is worse or "less bad" because if it's at all "bad" I wouldn't send any kid there.  Why would I?  My local school is safe and my local clinics are safe and my local hospitals are safe.  Why roll the dice and hope my kid is one who doesn't get abused.

And as far as the other items you listed, urine and microwaves don't make a place unsafe.  Taking kids that microwave urine until it boils and throw it in a sleeping kid's face because the only "supervision" is a camera is what makes HLA unsafe.  Also ty-wraps don't make a place unsafe, but taking kids who will bind other kids hand-and-foot while they beat the shit out of them with no supervision is what makes HLA unsafe.  Get it now?

HLA take dangerous kids, mixes them together with more-or-less normal kids and walks away, allowing the kids to make the rules and determine "justice" and this is what makes HLA so very dangerous for kids.  It's really not that deep.

Face the facts: HLA is a dangerous, poorly run facility.  No amount of arguing or deflecting will change that.  You spent years trying to tell everyone that these problems never happened or that HLA had fixed them.  Everyone now sees you were not telling the truth and that instead of fighting against a place that has been confirmed to break the law and hurt kids you try to mask the problems, thusly allowing more kids to be hurt and abused.  What you are doing by trying to muddy the waters is wrong and you are contributing to more children being hurt.  I guess you really don't care as long as HLA can still make money.  

It's sad that you show no care or concern for those who have been hurt and you actively campaign to allow HLA to continue this way.  This thread really shows your true colors.

[TheWho]

I am playing the devils advocate.  I havent nor would I send my kid to HLA for a variety of reasons.  But lets say we handed the stack of 3,000 pages to Len or whatever the owners name is.. let him select a few tidbits or line items and explain them in his own way.  Would you accept that and do you think the readers would get a fair view of HLA?

[Troll Control]

The ORS report is MORE THAN FAIR to HLA.  ORS went out of its way not to violate HLA on many items, yet they ended up having to do so because HLA failed to remediate itself over and over again, proving "self-policing" to be worthless (ala NATSAP).

Why play "devil's advocate" for an obviously failing facility?  Where does your need come from?  There has never been any evidence that HLA's program is clinically valid or sound.  There is a ton of evidence that HLA is a shoddy facility AT BEST and a real shit-pit warehouse at worst.  I'm inclined to believe it's somehwere between "very bad" and "heinous" and that is a fair depiction.

Try actually reading the ORS reports.  If you're so interested in painting a "fair" picture, order up the docs from ORS, READ THEM and THEN opine.

HLA is a failure as a treatment modality and a failure as a business.  What MORE do you need to know before saying NOBODY should send a kid there?

Why not try playing CHILD ADVOCATE for once since you already know HLA is a terrible place you wouldn't send your own kid to??  Not doing so really hammers your credibility.  Be honest.  Call a spade a spade, man.

[Anonymous]

[DATE]
[DELIVERY SHOULD BE BY HAND DELIVERY OR BY CERTIFIED MAIL-RETURN RECEIPT REQUESTED]
Name Address City, State, Zip
Dear   :
Pursuant to the Georgia Open Records Law (O.C.G.A § 50-18-70 et seq.) (the Law"), you are hereby requested to make available for review and copying all files, records and other documents
in your possession that refer, reflect or relate to   .  This request includes, but is not
limited to, all documents, notes, correspondence and memoranda evidencing   , and
all   communication   and   correspondence   in   whatever   tangible   medium   between   and   among
   and,   .
If this request is denied in whole or in part, we ask that you cite in writing the specific statutory exemption upon which you have relied, as required by law. We also ask that you release all separate portions of otherwise exempt material. Please waive any costs associated with this request, or first inform us about such costs as required by Georgia law.
As you know, the Law requires a response by you within three business days of your receipt of this letter and provides sanctions for non-compliance. I look forward to hearing from you.
Sincerely,

[Anonymous]

With Hollowhead gone, Grimwood gone, Travers gone, Kathleen Heasley gone and a myriad of others...who exactly is minding the store?  The ORS visited in Dec. 2008 - more violations, remedy was expected by HLA Jan. 2009...  it's July... what is the ORS position now, not that they ever stuck their neck out to have one.

[TheWho]

I agree it would put to bed many of my questions if I had a copy for myself.   As far as being a devils advocate I think it is sorely needed…. here on fornits especially.  I do much to advocate for children and a small part of that advocacy is to try to keep an honest perspective here.  It would be a disservice to parents and children alike to water down the definition of abuse (as an example) to the point that every child in America falls under the definition.  We have posters here who claim to have been abused but when the details are looked at the person posting this was only in the program for a few weeks and was required to haul wood for the elderly, clean common areas and open fields etc..  So he places himself in the same category as a girl who was raped and beaten.  This isn’t fair to the kids who are truly being abused.

There are suicides and car accidents which are attributed to programs (by posters here) and when you take the time to read the details of the deaths it turns out these kids died years after leaving and were not even near the program when they died.  This level of desperation to discredit programs at all costs leaves one to wonder what the credibility is of their own personal stories is.  So my skepticism is not unwarranted and is renewed on a daily basis.

HLA may indeed be an abusive school, but I am justifiably cautious about the source of the information.  Like I said earlier if the stack of 3,000 pages was given to this guy Len would the information be disseminated differently?  I think of course it would.  This is why I am trying to read between the lines the best I can and trying to ask the right questions.

[RobertBruce]

I do much to advocate for children and a small part of that advocacy is to try to keep an honest perspective here.

Would that include you making fun of kids being abused, and denying their abuse and deaths ever occured?

the person posting this was only in the program for a few weeks and was required to haul wood for the elderly, clean common areas and open fields etc.. So he places himself in the same category as a girl who was raped and beaten

Are you serious? Who is this person? He should be admonished immediatly. Link to the post in question so we can hold this person accountable. Anyone pretending to be abused has serious issues.

This level of desperation to discredit programs at all costs leaves one to wonder what the credibility is of their own personal stories is. So my skepticism is not unwarranted and is renewed on a daily basis.

I know what you mean. It's sort of like posters who refuse to provide evidence to back up their own pro-program position, or when faced with difficult questions simply make up things. It really ruins that programmies credibility.

Like I said earlier if the stack of 3,000 pages was given to this guy Len would the information be disseminated differently? I think of course it would. This is why I am trying to read between the lines the best I can and trying to ask the right questions.

Well the thing is Buchi doesnt feel he should ever have to answer any questions, hence why he settled. This is the same guy who threatened to fire his employees for allowing people with warrants onto the school property rather then being arrested. What are your thoughts on that?

[TheWho]

I agree it would put to bed many of my questions if I had a copy for myself.   As far as being a devils advocate I think it is sorely needed…. here on fornits especially.  I do much to advocate for children and a small part of that advocacy is to try to keep an honest perspective here.  It would be a disservice to parents and children alike to water down the definition of abuse (as an example) to the point that every child in America falls under the definition.  We have posters here who claim to have been abused but when the details are looked at the person posting this was only in the program for a few weeks and was required to haul wood for the elderly, clean common areas and open fields etc..  So he places himself in the same category as a girl who was raped and beaten.  This isn’t fair to the kids who are truly being abused.

There are suicides and car accidents which are attributed to programs (by posters here) and when you take the time to read the details of the deaths it turns out these kids died years after leaving and were not even near the program when they died.  This level of desperation to discredit programs at all costs leaves one to wonder what the credibility is of their own personal stories is.  So my skepticism is not unwarranted and is renewed on a daily basis.

HLA may indeed be an abusive school, but I am justifiably cautious about the source of the information.  Like I said earlier if the stack of 3,000 pages was given to this guy Len would the information be disseminated differently?  I think of course it would.  This is why I am trying to read between the lines the best I can and trying to ask the right questions.

^^TheWho^^   Why do you obsess with the suicide and car analogies.

[Anonymous]

I agree it would put to bed many of my questions if I had a copy for myself.   As far as being a devils advocate I think it is sorely needed…. here on fornits especially.  I do much to advocate for children and a small part of that advocacy is to try to keep an honest perspective here.  It would be a disservice to parents and children alike to water down the definition of abuse (as an example) to the point that every child in America falls under the definition.  We have posters here who claim to have been abused but when the details are looked at the person posting this was only in the program for a few weeks and was required to haul wood for the elderly, clean common areas and open fields etc..  So he places himself in the same category as a girl who was raped and beaten.  This isn’t fair to the kids who are truly being abused.

There are suicides and car accidents which are attributed to programs (by posters here) and when you take the time to read the details of the deaths it turns out these kids died years after leaving and were not even near the program when they died.  This level of desperation to discredit programs at all costs leaves one to wonder what the credibility is of their own personal stories is.  So my skepticism is not unwarranted and is renewed on a daily basis.

HLA may indeed be an abusive school, but I am justifiably cautious about the source of the information.  Like I said earlier if the stack of 3,000 pages was given to this guy Len would the information be disseminated differently?  I think of course it would.  This is why I am trying to read between the lines the best I can and trying to ask the right questions.

^^TheWho^^   Why do you obsess with the suicide and car analogies.

Because he, John Reuben, drove his own son to suicide.

[TheWho]

Oh, I get it!!   DROVE.  Thats where the car analogies come from.  I almost missed that.  Thats really cleaver

[Anonymous]

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With Hollowhead gone, Grimwood gone, Travers gone, Kathleen Heasley gone and a myriad of others...who exactly is minding the store?  The ORS visited in Dec. 2008 - more violations, remedy was expected by HLA Jan. 2009...  it's July... what is the ORS position now, not that they ever stuck their neck out to have one.

Yep, they're all gone, and then some. Check back in another couple of weeks and you just might find that HLA's longest surviving employee, Len's very first hire, is also among the missing.

[RobertBruce]

Who? Lee? Jim?