Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform > The Troubled Teen Industry
Lets get back to WWASPS
Anonymous:
I agree with everything you just said except being pulled from one abusive school to be admitted to another. Again, show me PROVEN cases of abuse at WWASPS, not just some whiny kid saying they were abused just to get their parents to bring them home. Newspaper articles are not proof, as we well know. And the posters on this board are not proof either.
Carey:
Well I define abuse obviously differently then you define abuse.
I think it is abusive to cut off communication with parent and child.
I think it is abusive to be forced into isolation and placed in positions of pain.
I think denying people of their feelings and their abiltiy to express their feelings abusive.
I think it is abusive to take away a persons right to privacy.
This is only a few of the things that occured at Dundee that I think were abusive. All of these things have been admitted to by childre who favor the program and children who oppose the program.
Like I have said in the past, my boys did not witness beatings. They did witness restraints and they themselves were put in isolation. One was put in isolation for trying to fix a window air conditioner. The other was put into isolaltion for wearing his shoes in the dorm. Neither one were a risk to themselves or to others. That is abuse!
[ This Message was edited by: Carey on 2003-08-08 11:43 ]
Anonymous:
Cut off communication between parent and child?? Letters/faxes are never cut off. Any parent can ask to speak to their child, but who would want to in the beginning? It's only a recommendation that the kids earn the "priviledge" of phone calls.
Denying expression of feelings, etc. Carey, where did this come from? These kids are encouraged to dig deep to uncover the feelings they are masking with their former drug/alcohol/high risk behaviors. They do this in group and in seminars and with their therapist. They lose points for bragging about their former behavior outside of these situations. I guess some would consider that abusive. I don't.
Take away the right to privacy? They were the ones that took that away from themselves by abusing it at home.
I have no experience of Dundee, but do of another WWASP school. So I can't speak about the OP and the set of rules they had. My experiences were that I didn't always agree with the rules, but I don't always agree with the rules in my place of employment either. Breaking the rules in either place, have consequences that we are aware of, no matter if we agree or not.
While I do agree that changes need to be made at Dundee, I would hate to see it turn into an unstructured, whatever the kids want, type of program. WWASPS schools are always open to change what isn't working to change behaviors... from personal experience.
It's been interesting to read that some think it changes personalities! It's about changing choices.
Carey:
--- Quote ---Cut off communication between parent and child?? Letters/faxes are never cut off. Any parent can ask to speak to their child, but who would want to in the beginning? It's only a recommendation that the kids earn the "priviledge" of phone calls.
--- End quote ---
I am speaking from personal experince on this one. I WOULD WANT TO!!!! YOU MAY NOT WANT TO, BUT I DID AND I DO AND I ALWAYS WILL!!!!! I do not think that my children speaking to me is a privaledge. Now maybe my kids speaking to their friends could be counted as a privaledge, but its not a priveldege for my kids to speak to me. It is a GOD given right and no one should take that away.
My communication with my boys was cut off completely. As a matter of fact the judge who heard my case was really pissed at the boys father for that. The boys father may have chosen to not talk to his boys but I had not. I have always had JOINT custody with my ex of my kids. I never gave up my rights as a parent. I never would and I never will. He and Dundee both had no right to sever my communication in any way. They did. I have the email from Joe, telling me I was disrupting their progress and that I should not have communication with them. He also told me this several times over the phone. Keep in mind this is a 25 year old twirp I am talking about.
You know Mr. Kay always claims that those of us who oppose WWASP schools are trying to take away the rights of parents to choose what is in the best interest of their child. Well, I think Mr. Kay needs to be aware of the fact that schools within his association are taking away the rights of parents.
--- Quote ---My experiences were that I didn't always agree with the rules, but I don't always agree with the rules in my place of employment either. Breaking the rules in either place, have consequences that we are aware of, no matter if we agree or not.
--- End quote ---
You can not compare you breaking the rules at work to teens breaking the rules in a "program." You can make the statement that there are consequences, sure. The BIG difference is that you, at your place of employment, are not being held captive in an environment that has stripped you of all of your God given rights.
[ This Message was edited by: Carey on 2003-08-08 13:20 ]
[ This Message was edited by: Carey on 2003-08-08 13:37 ]
scottT:
lest anyone assume that i endorse the mindless ad hominem attacks against Carey (or anyone else), I have to agree with her on this one.
Simply reading your WWASP parent manual: inmates are punished for communicating "negative information" EVEN IF TRUTHFUL. In order to advance through the levels, Inmates are rewarded with points for telling their parents "positive" stuff like how much progress they're making and how great they think the program is EVEN IF FALSE.
Yep WWASP policy of monitoring mail is abuse, and is certainly illegal in state run institutions.
Posit a question: If your child writes a letter telling you that he is not receiving the medication which had been prescribed by your family physician, and your WWASP family rep decides that's negative and manipulation and declines to send it, would you not agree that is a very concrete manifestation of censorship as physical abuse?
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