Ranch For Adopted Kids Gone Wild

[Froderik]

You know this entire load of shit could be eliminated with a simple fix of making thinsg open and transparent.

Yeah. Don't lock them up in the middle of nowhere incommunicado and make a point of isolating them, and this shit won't happen because they won't be able to HIDE this shit. There is no need while in 'therapy' to keep someone isolated and incommunicado.

But, well, then it wouldn't be a program anymore.

Indeed; Straight would never have been able to cover its ass had there been no "confidentiality."

(confidentiality = "what you see here, do here, and hear here remains here.")

[TheWho]

You know this entire load of shit could be eliminated with a simple fix of making thinsg open and transparent.

Yeah. Don't lock them up in the middle of nowhere incommunicado and make a point of isolating them, and this shit won't happen because they won't be able to HIDE this shit. There is no need while in 'therapy' to keep someone isolated and incommunicado.

But, well, then it wouldn't be a program anymore.

Exactly right!!  If yiou read the book you would see that is what works about the place.  These other places that lock kids up are totaly abusive and parents should never do that.

[Nihilanthic]

You know this entire load of shit could be eliminated with a simple fix of making thinsg open and transparent.

Yeah. Don't lock them up in the middle of nowhere incommunicado and make a point of isolating them, and this shit won't happen because they won't be able to HIDE this shit. There is no need while in 'therapy' to keep someone isolated and incommunicado.

But, well, then it wouldn't be a program anymore.

Exactly right!!  If yiou read the book you would see that is what works about the place.  These other places that lock kids up are totaly abusive and parents should never do that.

Thats funny, that book and actual information about ASR differ vastly.

NOBODY CARES ABOUT YOUR PROPAGANDA.

[TheWho]

If you look at the informaton and some of the findings you will see that what you say, Niles, isnt accurate.  Which part did you see as different?

A portion from the study:

One hundred percent of parents and students that participated in this study said that they would recommend ASR to others…… My findings contradict the idea that making fundamental changes during late adolescence is nearly impossible (Loeber, 1991) and also dispel the myth that long-term treatment is detrimental to normal development. The most important finding of this study is that residential treatment for troubled adolescents has the potential to be extremely effective.

Here is a link:
What it takes to pull me through

The woman was a phd candidate from Colgate University and performed an independent study of one of the Therapeutic Boarding schools.

Here is the link for anyone interested in the facts:

http://groups.colgate.edu/cjs/student_papers/2002/VShapiro.pdf

[Froderik]

Hmm.. this ASR place sounds pretty good..how much does it cost per year?

And is there an age limit?

[TheWho]

Hmm.. this ASR place sounds pretty good..how much does it cost per year?

And is there an age limit?

With travel about $80,000 85,000 not a whole lot more than a car. The kids are high school age.  They do a nice job there and the kids are happy for the most part.

[Nihilanthic]

If you look at the informaton and some of the findings you will see that what you say, Niles, isnt accurate.  Which part did you see as different?

A portion from the study:

One hundred percent of parents and students that participated in this study said that they would recommend ASR to others…… My findings contradict the idea that making fundamental changes during late adolescence is nearly impossible (Loeber, 1991) and also dispel the myth that long-term treatment is detrimental to normal development. The most important finding of this study is that residential treatment for troubled adolescents has the potential to be extremely effective.

Here is a link:
What it takes to pull me through

The woman was a phd candidate from Colgate University and performed an independent study of one of the Therapeutic Boarding schools.

Here is the link for anyone interested in the facts:

http://groups.colgate.edu/cjs/student_papers/2002/VShapiro.pdf

All you did was just repost the same thing that was debunked already with another name to get around the ignore button!

It was NOT found to be effective, it was found to be in the opinion of the person making it to have the POTENTIAL to be, but it was currently inconclusive. That book does not count as a study or the work of a professional!

What the hell?

[TheWho]

If you look at the informaton and some of the findings you will see that what you say, Niles, isnt accurate.  Which part did you see as different?

A portion from the study:

One hundred percent of parents and students that participated in this study said that they would recommend ASR to others…… My findings contradict the idea that making fundamental changes during late adolescence is nearly impossible (Loeber, 1991) and also dispel the myth that long-term treatment is detrimental to normal development. The most important finding of this study is that residential treatment for troubled adolescents has the potential to be extremely effective.

Here is a link:
What it takes to pull me through

The woman was a phd candidate from Colgate University and performed an independent study of one of the Therapeutic Boarding schools.

Here is the link for anyone interested in the facts:

http://groups.colgate.edu/cjs/student_papers/2002/VShapiro.pdf

All you did was just repost the same thing that was debunked already with another name to get around the ignore button!

It was NOT found to be effective, it was found to be in the opinion of the person making it to have the POTENTIAL to be, but it was currently inconclusive. That book does not count as a study or the work of a professional!

What the hell?

I think the reason it keeps getting posted is because you miss the point each time.  The book was never intended to be a study.  It was an independent account of someone who spent 16 months inside of a TBS.  There was nothing clinical about it, nor was it intended to be.  It seems the reason you are struggling so much with this is because you are trying to comment on a book you never read.

The "study" that was perfomed concluded that TBS have the "potential" to be extremely effective, which means much more effective then they already are.

[Nihilanthic]

1) a commentary is not a justification for or proof of the effectiveness of a program

2) a study showing potential does not mean that is is

3) given the vacuum of proof supporting TBS's and the fact that rights are completely stripped from the people inside who are held captive, incommunicado and with no ability to plead their case, have a day in court or ask for help, but that the apologists of programs cite such bullshit to support their side, I have to refute that.

4) given that there is no proof, after 30+ years of a huge industry existing to support what they do and their methods, I find it amazing anyone even tries to support them.

Only in America do terror detainees have more attention put on them then children who have not committed any crimes.

[Sue-Sue]

Despite what you may say, there are good programs. The trick is to be able to differentiate between the good ones and the bad ones. I have made a living doing just that.

[TheWho]

1) a commentary is not a justification for or proof of the effectiveness of a program

2) a study showing potential does not mean that is is

3) given the vacuum of proof supporting TBS's and the fact that rights are completely stripped from the people inside who are held captive, incommunicado and with no ability to plead their case, have a day in court or ask for help, but that the apologists of programs cite such bullshit to support their side, I have to refute that.

4) given that there is no proof, after 30+ years of a huge industry existing to support what they do and their methods, I find it amazing anyone even tries to support them.

Only in America do terror detainees have more attention put on them then children who have not committed any crimes.

If you look at the information and some of the findings you will see that what you say, Niles, isn't accurate.  There was no mention of abuse in either account and the doors were wide open.  There has always been this thought that the school were secretive.....the book and the study go a long way in dispelling that believe.

A portion from the study:

One hundred percent of parents and students that participated in this study said that they would recommend ASR to others…… My findings contradict the idea that making fundamental changes during late adolescence is nearly impossible (Loeber, 1991) and also dispel the myth that long-term treatment is detrimental to normal development. The most important finding of this study is that residential treatment for troubled adolescents has the potential to be extremely effective.

Here is a link:
What it takes to pull me through

The woman was a PhD candidate from Colgate University and performed an independent study of one of the Therapeutic Boarding schools.

Here is the link for anyone interested in the facts:

http://groups.colgate.edu/cjs/student_papers/2002/VShapiro.pdf



...

[TheWho]

 given that there is no proof, after 30+ years of a huge industry existing to support what they do and their methods, I find it amazing anyone even tries to support them.

There is no proof that it is abusive or ineffective either.

[Nihilanthic]

Despite what you may say, there are good programs. The trick is to be able to differentiate between the good ones and the bad ones. I have made a living doing just that.

Show me a good program.

Show me ANY good program!

[Nihilanthic]

 given that there is no proof, after 30+ years of a huge industry existing to support what they do and their methods, I find it amazing anyone even tries to support them.

There is no proof that it is abusive or ineffective either.

The fact that we're here is sufficient proof for any rational person.

[TheWho]

 given that there is no proof, after 30+ years of a huge industry existing to support what they do and their methods, I find it amazing anyone even tries to support them.

There is no proof that it is abusive or ineffective either.

Yeah, that seems to be the big stickler point.  Everyone here is asking for studies to be done but since there are not many out there then we have to go with what the opinions of past graduates and what the families have to say which has been positive with the exception of a few.


...