Christmas

[Anonymous]

Ha,Ha,Ha, Out of all the people I have talked to in my life I am amazed at the number of people here on fornits who get offended by analogies.  I think that many don’t understand that an analogy is just a connection between two things that have nothing in common except maybe one thread.  For example,  If I said you were honest as Abe Lincoln.  This wouldn’t imply that I thought you were old or had a beard or wanted to run for president.  I am merely making a thin connection between you and him on a very small level in an effort to make a point.  Its amazing how many people this escapes here.

It doesn't escape any of us.  Most of us just feel that our kids mental well being is a little more important than saving a few bucks while getting our car fixed.

[TheWho]

Ha,Ha,Ha, Out of all the people I have talked to in my life I am amazed at the number of people here on fornits who get offended by analogies.  I think that many don’t understand that an analogy is just a connection between two things that have nothing in common except maybe one thread.  For example,  If I said you were honest as Abe Lincoln.  This wouldn’t imply that I thought you were old or had a beard or wanted to run for president.  I am merely making a thin connection between you and him on a very small level in an effort to make a point.  Its amazing how many people this escapes here.

It doesn't escape any of us.  Most of us just feel that our kids mental well being is a little more important than saving a few bucks while getting our car fixed.

Ha,Ha,Ha,  you cant be serious... that is just too funny..."saving a few bucks while getting our car fixed".  That is just priceless.  I bet you still have a straight face too.



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[dishdutyfugitive]

Quote:
"If 15 kids died......" That's the oldest TBS trick in the book.  

You are the one that brought it up. My point was, we don’t know. If 20 heart patients come in for a heart operation and 2 don’t do well is that acceptable? How do we measure that ? What is our benchmark? What would be the result if we did nothing?


Nope - you played the death card not me. I said 'mind warped'. And while we're on the "if 15 people....". You want to play 'what if's'  What if 15 sets of parents got their shit together and raised their kids properly. How come none of the programs call the parents out on their bullshit? Cuz they write the dam checks - that's why. It's the parents fault for failing their kids. It's twice over the parents fault for outsourcing parenting.



You are the simplest of simpletons. "If you have to ask you'll never know. You are a true follower."

" I don’t see anyone here willing to point out the advances the industry has made over the decades "

1. I'm sure that this site started as venue for survivors to vent. End of story.

2.And if someone wants to make this website, for whatever damn reason,  then so be it.  It's an american right to free speech. You're presence is big brotheresque. You're not fighting for a cause by posting here. Survivors posting here are doing the only real work. If you had your act together you'd be elsewhere fighting the good fight.

3. "Advances in the industry". Himmel and co. were very proud of the  advances in gas & oven fabrication at Auchwitz from 1939 to 1943. You can polish a turd until you're blue in the face but it's still a heaping pile of crap.


"Sorry, If I could I would. I am not sure where you are right now or all that happened to you. I would try to not let any one event in your life dominate who you are. We are all a product of everything that touched us not just our schooling experience or job experience or parental influences or our peer influences. "
Just don’t let it consume you like it has Anne Bonney, or people like her, and imprison you in the past so that it requires all your time and focus.

1. So it's of no concern to you the detrimental effects of TBS's past and present. You're not concered about the wrongdoings of The TBS's that paved the way so your kid could have the 'perfect experience'? It's of no importance to you to address this issue? Anyone that is 'pro-progam' is 100% obligated to address this issue. But not one of you have. That's what makes you so dispicable. You turn a blind eye to the ugly truth.

2. Please save your life coaching for the next time you give Dr. Phil a handjob. Me calling CEDU a crock of shit doesn't consume my life.  I've lived a great life and travelled the world since I left that fuckhole. I've had plenty of wonderful times since I left there. However, everything I've accomplished after my graduation I owe to me. I owe none of it to RMA. I come here to vent but my thoughts don't consume me.


CEDU was a joke and is a joke. amateurs - all of them. strongarming teens who grew up in a jackass household.

[Anonymous]

It doesn't escape any of us.  Most of us just feel that our kids mental well being is a little more important than saving a few bucks while getting our car fixed.

Programmie: "well, I've got good news and bad news."

Parent: "Oh no.. what's the bad news?"

Programmie: "Your son cut his throat out. I mean he fucking jammed a kitchen knife into the side and just ripped. Right through his whole fucking windpipe. I've never seen anything like it. He was DOA at the hospital."

Parent: "Then.. then what the hell's the good news?!"

Programmie: "I just asved a bunch of money on my car insurance by switching to Geico. Oh, and we're not refunding your tuition."

[dishdutyfugitive]

I liked that. That was very Tyler Durden esque.

[dishdutyfugitive]

The Who is the kind of person who likes to throw a party and not clean the mess up afterwards.....

[Oz girl]

Oz Girl wrote:

ASR had at one stage a store that dave marcus spoke of the kids working in like a sort of kiosk. Tell us how much did they pay the kids to work there when your daughter was there? Places like turn about ranch also work on the premise that working as a Jackaroo or farm hand teaches kids a work ethic. They get the fruits of the kids labour without having to pay them.

She talked about the store.  It wasn’t more than a place where the kids could get snacks and such.  It wasn’t open to the public.  The kids didn’t get paid for it!! I wouldn’t let ASR give my kid any money without permission.  These were just chores that each child was assigned.  They would do general cleaning of the common areas, run the store etc…. its not that they were doing it to save money Ha,Ha,Ha, its like having kids make their own bed at home or vacuum the living room and hallway… it teaches them work ethic and being part of the school, chipping in etc.

You also mention that most schools dont have kids for 5 years but several kids have mentioned going to a variety of schools and having it add up to 4 or 5 years of their life. Are you suggesting that this is a lie?

ASR is a 14 – 16 month program (at least it was).  I am not aware of any programs which run for several years.  I guess parents could keep sending their kids away if that is what they want to do, but the schools themselves don’t do this.

I thought I would repost this as you ignored my question in favour of lecturing anne bonney. So how much was your daughter paid for working at the school shop? or did dave marcus make that section of the book up?

Oz girl

I don’t think Dave Marcus would have any reason to make anything up.  I never spoke in detail about the store at ASR with my daughter.  But if she was being paid without my knowledge then I would be pissed.  I set up payment with them and handled all her internal expenses with a separate account and her therapist was handled independently of the school.  There was no need for her to have money while she was there, everything was provided for her.
I will have to review the book because I don’t remember that issue in particular.



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To be honest of ll the crazy shit that Marcus described working in a kiosk for free was the least of those kids worries. At some normal boarding schools here kids do a stint staffing the counter at the non profit tuck shop. So I would even be inclined to agree with you that this is not an unacceptable ask of the kids. However you did lie in your original post by claiming you were not asked to work in a shop without pay. They were. I would also want to know if the kiosk was for profit in any way. If so I stand by original point that this is a form of exploitation in the same way that having kids work on a for profit cattle ranch for "therapeutic" reasons is if the proprietors are pocketing the money. Other kids may have to get a part time job for pocket money or to save for college but they get to keep the wages or benefit from them.

[TheWho]

Think about the concept of the collateral damage ratio. If the school legitimately helps 20 kids and mind warps 2 kids - that's OK? No, it's not OK.

(“"If 15 kids died......" That's the oldest TBS trick in the book.â€

[Troll Control]

Keep TheWho in perspective, folks.

I was abducted from my home, systematically sexually abused, worked as a slave, subjected to 6 hour a day peer denouncement sessions-public degradation-the sort practiced by the Chinese in thought reform prisons, not allowed to move unless another child gave me permission and then only with another 2 children holding me. These adolescents also had the authority to beat me whenever they felt i broke a rule, and they beat other children within inches of their lives. Other times you could be put in isolation, which had no time limit and went on as far as i know up to 6 months. You could also have your right to speak removed, which also had no time limit. Public forced nudity was another punishment. Adolescents forcibly bathed other adolescents. Kids became sick and weren’t allowed medical treatment. If you wanted not to be tortured, you had to torture other kids. Adolescents decided if you were “saneâ€

[TheWho]

To be honest of ll the crazy shit that Marcus described working in a kiosk for free was the least of those kids worries. At some normal boarding schools here kids do a stint staffing the counter at the non profit tuck shop. So I would even be inclined to agree with you that this is not an unacceptable ask of the kids. However you did lie in your original post by claiming you were not asked to work in a shop without pay. They were. I would also want to know if the kiosk was for profit in any way. If so I stand by original point that this is a form of exploitation in the same way that having kids work on a for profit cattle ranch for "therapeutic" reasons is if the proprietors are pocketing the money. Other kids may have to get a part time job for pocket money or to save for college but they get to keep the wages or benefit from them.

I don’t remember Marcus’ reference to the store in the book.  When I think of a store I think of a place which sells food or clothes, tires etc.  When my daughter mentioned that she can get things at a store I asked were it was because I had never seen it during my visit.  She said it was no bigger than a closet and they could pick up small bags of potato chips and snacks that they could take to their room or eat during movie time.  Parents or the public didn’t come by to purchase items…it was only open a short time each day and staffed by the kids themselves… each person had a chore to do i.e. clean the common areas, outside chores, it was to give kids responsibility for something…..its like doing chores at home… if the kids didn’t help at home you would have to hire a maid.
The kids are kept so busy with school,  groups, studying, sports that there isn’t much time for chores or manning a store front.
When someone here mentioned that at straight kids had to work in a store for no wages I didn’t make the connection… I don’t know if that store was a small closet type place that handed out snacks for an hour a day or whether it was a public entity where kids were required to work for hours on end.  I envisioned the later at the time.



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[Troll Control]

Keep TheWho in perspective, folks.

I was abducted from my home, systematically sexually abused, worked as a slave, subjected to 6 hour a day peer denouncement sessions-public degradation-the sort practiced by the Chinese in thought reform prisons, not allowed to move unless another child gave me permission and then only with another 2 children holding me. These adolescents also had the authority to beat me whenever they felt i broke a rule, and they beat other children within inches of their lives. Other times you could be put in isolation, which had no time limit and went on as far as i know up to 6 months. You could also have your right to speak removed, which also had no time limit. Public forced nudity was another punishment. Adolescents forcibly bathed other adolescents. Kids became sick and weren’t allowed medical treatment. If you wanted not to be tortured, you had to torture other kids. Adolescents decided if you were “saneâ€

[TheWho]

The Who is the kind of person who likes to throw a party and not clean the mess up afterwards.....

Now come on dishdutyfugitive, if I responded to you with a similar jab you (and others) would be upset because I was disrespecting a survivor.

[Troll Control]

Keep TheWho in perspective, folks.

I was abducted from my home, systematically sexually abused, worked as a slave, subjected to 6 hour a day peer denouncement sessions-public degradation-the sort practiced by the Chinese in thought reform prisons, not allowed to move unless another child gave me permission and then only with another 2 children holding me. These adolescents also had the authority to beat me whenever they felt i broke a rule, and they beat other children within inches of their lives. Other times you could be put in isolation, which had no time limit and went on as far as i know up to 6 months. You could also have your right to speak removed, which also had no time limit. Public forced nudity was another punishment. Adolescents forcibly bathed other adolescents. Kids became sick and weren’t allowed medical treatment. If you wanted not to be tortured, you had to torture other kids. Adolescents decided if you were “saneâ€

[dishdutyfugitive]

Damage Control Soldier

1.   You’re an odd bird. You’re a fornits junkie and claim to be a ASR parent. The time spent here would indicate that you’re financially vested in the TBS industry. Either way you’re spinning your wheels here.

2.    You frequently tell people to read up and do research. Until you do research on the long term effects of these places you’ve got no right to open your mouth. You want to open your mouth No thanks, not here. Go find your own sandbox where you can play Dr. Phil with all your other Oprah watching, can’t think for themselves drones.


3.   You best take your jabs. You asked for em you get em. For you to promote TBS’s and not spend any of your time addressing the long-term effects damage (intentional or unintentional) of the industry is laughable. Your digging your own grave – don’t put it on us.


4.   For the family with 1 ‘bad kid’ out of 5 ?  There are plenty of better options than a TBS. Do you know where the special Olympics came from? Kennedy guilt. They sent the bad apple Kennedy sister to the ward and they lobotomized her.  They don’t sleep well at night because they drank the lobotomy kool aid back then and finally realized it was wrong. One day you will realize this TBS shit is just as wrong.

[TheWho]

Damage Control Soldier

1. You’re an odd bird. You’re a fornits junkie and claim to be a ASR parent. The time spent here would indicate that you’re financially vested in the TBS industry. Either way you’re spinning your wheels here.

You claim to be a person who attended a program and if you cannot recognize that the industry is improving everyday then I believe you are spinning your wheels.  

2. You frequently tell people to read up and do research. Until you do research on the long term effects of these places you’ve got no right to open your mouth. You want to open your mouth No thanks, not here. Go find your own sandbox where you can play Dr. Phil with all your other Oprah watching, can’t think for themselves drones.

I am living the long term effects, my daughter is an example of the long term effects.  It appears you are the one who has not kept up with the industry.

3. You best take your jabs. You asked for em you get em. For you to promote TBS’s and not spend any of your time addressing the long-term effects damage (intentional or unintentional) of the industry is laughable. Your digging your own grave – don’t put it on us.

Nah, not my style to name call.  I have on occasion but its not pretty.  Someday you will wake up and see that TBS’s are the answer that many kids need.  Stop living in the past and look at some of the models of the future.
Sure we could all be blinded like you.  I could point to a car accident along the highway and say “See, car safety hasn’t improved in 50 yearsâ€