Author Topic: Reality Re-invention  (Read 2256 times)

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Offline Carmel

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Reality Re-invention
« on: October 04, 2007, 11:14:03 AM »
Ok, so I think I've ranted about my mother on here a few times, but I dont think I have about this....

My mom has what I refer to as selective reality re-invention.  We can be having a discussion and she will say one thing and if it turns out she might be wrong or inaccurate, she will immediately change her perspective to reflect the correction and then insist that she was right all along.  Its almost unnerving.  For example, we will be driving and she yells at me to get into the far left lane (which turns out to be a turn only lane) and then when i get stuck turning she asks why I didnt stay in the center lane because thats what she told me to do.  Today I hit a pothole on the road and she was mid-sentence and jumped like a cat when we hit it.....and then insisted that she had seen the pothole all along and was wondering why I hadnt seen it too.....SHE NEVER EVEN KNEW IT WAS THERE, but for whatever reason feels like she has to make herself superior over something that doesnt even matter.

IT DRIVES ME INSANE.

She re-invents the details of millions of things from my childhood, things I know werent true, and when I tell her they arent she says immediately that "thats what she meant" or thats what she said to begin with and why am I arguing?  We will even drive by a building and she will make up a story about how she remembered when they first built it and how she went there for this or that function.....AND THE PLACE HAS BEEN THERE before we even lived in the city it was in.  Its like random invention for the sake of god knows what.  She says shit like, "Well, I didnt know what I meant at first but then half way through I knew what I meant so now I know and you are wrong".

Does anyone else get this from parents?

She also tries to relate to me now about being in Straight as if she suffered it right along with me.  Forget that she put me there and that it was mostly my shit-assed family life and her beloved husband (my stepdad) who fucked me all up to begin with.  And if I mention that, she insists that no, she was against what straight did all along, and that she knew something was wrong and that she tried to change it.......how about trying to TAKE ME OUT OF THERE?  Theres a change for ya.  And she will bring up issues about cults and brainwashing and try to discuss them as if we were both vicitms of the abuse....its make me ill.

Anyways, i could go on....but I was just really wondering what this comes from or if you all get this from your 'rents.
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Offline Woof-a-Doof

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« Reply #1 on: October 04, 2007, 12:43:49 PM »
Yeah….could go on all day about my parents also. I have heard that mother-daughter relationships are intense. I can not write about that, because my mother has no daughter, and I have no sister…so I can only guess and think of my gf and her mothers relationship, which sounds similar to your relationship with your mother.

Selective Reality Re-Invention, as you put it  (and I love it), is as I see it an embellishment to the extreme. Delusional thoughts, memory and belief systems are tough nuts to crack, no pun intended. Recently in a post I made reference to my own thought process. Goes something like this…. Minding my own business… in my head… an idea bubbles up to the forefront of my conscious… The idea festers until I can articulate it, then further justify it and then sanctify it as valid, true, rational, logical… and quite obviously right/correct… And it is amazing to me how much I value being right. Because I now have placed a value on the being “being rightâ€
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Offline Carmel

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« Reply #2 on: October 04, 2007, 01:11:44 PM »
LOL.....yes, you are so RIGHT.  I have begun to just opt out of the conversations that lead thusly.

Just like this one, I mentioned several times during the argument that I would rather not argue and to just drop it, but she continued to try and get in a last word, when according to her, she had won already....I must have asked to not discuss it any longer 4 times.

When I went to pick her up...she apologized, then mentioned she had no idea WHY she had upset me but that she was sorry she had.  I simply said that it seemed that it never went anywhere when we argued about these sort of trivialities, and that it was best to drop them.....at which she agreed, dropped it, then  5 minutes later brought it back up and proceeded to recap the whole exchange trying to justify why I "missed" everything.  How she could understand how Id be so confused because "way back when" she didnt know which way to turn either so she can empathize with my confusion.  She says this with a little laugh and chuckle like "isnt it just so silly Carmel?" which infuriates me even more.  I just sat quietly and refused to respond.

You are right though Woof, choose your battles........its just so hard to tolerate at a sustained rate whether you fall into the trap or not.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
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Offline Anne Bonney

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Reality Re-invention
« Reply #3 on: October 04, 2007, 01:51:21 PM »
Reality re-invention.  That's perfect!  My dad used to do that and it would infuriate me to no end.  I haven't spent enough time around him since we've been speaking again to know if that part has really changed.  Back before our 'split' I think a lot of it was out of sheer avoidance of guilt or responsibility.  It seemed like he felt the need to maintain this superior 'parent' role instead of respecting me like he would any other adult.

Good luck with it.  Opting out of the conversations is probably the best way to get out of it without an all our brawl.  For me at least.

Woof, awesome reply.
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Offline Deprogrammed

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All out Brawls
« Reply #4 on: October 04, 2007, 10:16:53 PM »
I on the other hand have had many many all out brawls with my mother, and although they may have been painful at the time, she is my mother, and I honestly feel it has helped us to get our relationship back. I guess for me maybe it was different. I really needed her to see what happened to me, but I always tried to approach it without blaming her and in the most understanding fashion that I could. When I wasn't in her presence I would try and close my eyes and put myself in her shoes back then.At the time that my parents put me into Kids Helping Kids my mother and father had recently seperated, I was experimenting , getting bad grades at school, and getting into minor brushes with the law. I was still a good kid but was having some troubles due to an unhappy homelife for me. In saying this, my mother was extrememly stressed out back then. She did not know what to do about much. People, tough love groups preyed on this with her, and then the program preyed on this with her as well. I understand this, and what happened, and I have let my mother know this over and over. I also do feel that she did suffer from some brainwashing from them, maybe not to the degree that I did but definitely something. Just cause I understand these things about her does not make what I went through any less or trivialized it just makes me more patient with her and understand the situation as a whole instead of in parts that I only want to see, or choose to see.
Also when I did have verbal brawls with her, it was out of my need to reclaim my mommy. I really wanted my mom back as mine and not what I felt that "they" had stolen from me. Yes as I said earlier I had a miserable home life before the program but I still have always wanted and needed my moms love regardless, it is what happens when ye are someones child.
The verbal brawls mainly would take place over the phone, there would be hang ups on both of our parts at times, b/c it would get to heated. I am not going to lie I would cuss and scream b/c I had so much anger. She would say snide things that she knew would hurt b/c she had anger to. At that point I knew what I was angry about, but I am not so sure that she knew at that point just exactly what she was angry about from that place. For a long time I believe she knew I was "different" after that place but just couldnt put her finger on it, she kept to herself about it and it made her angry and bothered. Then I would be confrontative about it and the brawl would ensue. I still stand by that sometimes the brawls were necessary to get to the heart of the matter, but I had to remain focused to actually try and get to the heart of the matter. The heart of my part of the matter is that someone gave me major boo boos and I wanted my mommy to help "fix" them and repair them.
I realized that child mother instinct was strong with us and it simply just needed repair. I was willing to go through the veral brawls with her because it was worth anything to get that relationship back.
Unfortunately I cannot and am not able to say the same about my father because it is a way different relationship, as in we never ever had one anyway.  I needed my mother to see my wounds and acknowledge them. My emotional growth was stunted by that damn place, so in a way I needed to "revisit" adolescence  with her in a way through the brawls about that place to go back through, and "re-script" our relationship into a new one for future.

I totally do know what ye mean about re-invention with mothers.
I dont know exactly why they do it...being right could be one motive.....fearing the truth and failure is another and a big one as well. I am a mother and I personally would not like to know that I failed in a major area with one of my precious babies, but I am also a different person and I cannot see myself re-inventing, but what I could see myself doing is at least having the strong urge to re-invent if I did fail but I would be capable of making the right choice I would hope and own either what I had done or not done.

-DP
edited for typos.:)
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Offline Anonymous

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Reality Re-invention
« Reply #5 on: October 04, 2007, 11:33:42 PM »
wow.......interesting subject.   both my parents died in a car accident.  I kind of wish they could bug me once in awhile
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #6 on: October 04, 2007, 11:39:56 PM »
Wow.  I'm really sorry.  

I hope you're not suggesting that we should ignore what happened simply because our parents are alive?
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #7 on: October 05, 2007, 04:50:23 AM »
Quote from: ""Guest""
Wow.  I'm really sorry.  

I hope you're not suggesting that we should ignore what happened simply because our parents are alive?


where in the guests post was there any hint or suggestion that you should ignore what happened simply because your parents are alive? Because they wrote that they wished their parents were around to bug them every once in a while?

Maybe when your parents are no longer living you will understand what I think that person meant.
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Offline Carmel

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« Reply #8 on: October 05, 2007, 09:54:18 AM »
De-Prog,

I get what youre saying, about how it is with your mom....thats not really far off the mark from where I am with mine or how we were back then.  She was a victim of very similar circumstances prior to my incarceration and we have established that repeatedly.  Its just I guess she takes any opportunity to skew the reality if i am not being vigilant about the truth of the matter.  She likes to pretend it was all someone elses fault, even if last month she took responsibilty, but only because I was trying to work it out with her.

One of her favorite things to do is blame someone else for anything bad thats ever happened to her since childhood.  She will talk about something hurtful and then end it with why it was her mothers or her fathers or my fathers or brothers or sisters fault for not helping her or supporting her.  I finally had to tell her that I was sick and tired of hearing negative things about my father over and over, even though my father and I dont even talk.  She'll blame my father for why she never went to Vegas or why she got fat or why she couldnt do the things for me that she ALWAYS wanted to, nevermind they divorced when I was only five....I had to live through two more absoulte losers and 15 more years of her poor judgement that im fairly certain my dad had no hand in, tangibly I mean.

We get along pretty good now, but its really only contingent on me allowing the continual twisting of truth without an argument.
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Offline Nikki

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Re: Reality Re-invention
« Reply #9 on: October 05, 2007, 11:23:15 AM »
My mommy is a debutont, "Freak", know-it-all and so stubborn. She never apologized for making me go in 2 Straight ! That's what really curls my ballz. Aftrer all these years. Oh well she is 76 n I can't teach n "Old Dog, New Tricks. So u r not alone.






"Carmel"]Ok, so I think I've ranted about my mother on here a few times, but I dont think I have about this....

My mom has what I refer to as selective reality re-invention.  We can be having a discussion and she will say one thing and if it turns out she might be wrong or inaccurate, she will immediately change her perspective to reflect the correction and then insist that she was right all along.  Its almost unnerving.  For example, we will be driving and she yells at me to get into the far left lane (which turns out to be a turn only lane) and then when i get stuck turning she asks why I didnt stay in the center lane because thats what she told me to do.  Today I hit a pothole on the road and she was mid-sentence and jumped like a cat when we hit it.....and then insisted that she had seen the pothole all along and was wondering why I hadnt seen it too.....SHE NEVER EVEN KNEW IT WAS THERE, but for whatever reason feels like she has to make herself superior over something that doesnt even matter.

IT DRIVES ME INSANE.

She re-invents the details of millions of things from my childhood, things I know werent true, and when I tell her they arent she says immediately that "thats what she meant" or thats what she said to begin with and why am I arguing?  We will even drive by a building and she will make up a story about how she remembered when they first built it and how she went there for this or that function.....AND THE PLACE HAS BEEN THERE before we even lived in the city it was in.  Its like random invention for the sake of god knows what.  She says shit like, "Well, I didnt know what I meant at first but then half way through I knew what I meant so now I know and you are wrong".

Does anyone else get this from parents?

She also tries to relate to me now about being in Straight as if she suffered it right along with me.  Forget that she put me there and that it was mostly my shit-assed family life and her beloved husband (my stepdad) who fucked me all up to begin with.  And if I mention that, she insists that no, she was against what straight did all along, and that she knew something was wrong and that she tried to change it.......how about trying to TAKE ME OUT OF THERE?  Theres a change for ya.  And she will bring up issues about cults and brainwashing and try to discuss them as if we were both vicitms of the abuse....its make me ill.

Anyways, i could go on....but I was just really wondering what this comes from or if you all get this from your 'rents.[/quote]
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Offline Anonymous

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Reality Re-invention
« Reply #10 on: October 05, 2007, 12:45:27 PM »
this is a rather interesting topic.  While I didn't go through this with my parents, I did with my Ex.  I was secluded when I was with him with little to no contact (whole different story), but it truely made me feel like I was going crazy.  AT the end of my time with him, and still to this day, I'm not sure what was real and what was not.  

I busted him though.  I started tape recording all our coversations. Of course this was after I left him and they were all over the phone (didn't know it was illeagal to do it at the time).  But when it came time for the child custody case, I offered to play the tapes for the judge.  The look on his face was priceless.  One would think that he would have just freaked.  No, not my Ex.  He sat there all arogant like there was no way that I was right and he was wrong.  Unfortunately (depending on how you look at it), the judge told me to hold on to them for a day when I needed them.

I later did some investigation into sociopaths and this is one symptom (of many - but there are more sociopaths in this world the people think!).  Something to think about.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #11 on: October 05, 2007, 04:50:32 PM »
Quote from: ""Guest""
wow.......interesting subject.   both my parents died in a car accident.  I kind of wish they could bug me once in awhile


of course not, I just miss them.  nothing more
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #12 on: October 05, 2007, 05:18:52 PM »
Quote from: ""Guest""
Quote from: ""Guest""
wow.......interesting subject.   both my parents died in a car accident.  I kind of wish they could bug me once in awhile

of course not, I just miss them.  nothing more


I think you meant to quote this.  

Quote
I hope you're not suggesting that we should ignore what happened simply because our parents are alive?


Forgive the paranoia.  You know how it is around here sometimes.  Thought maybe it was some programmie telling us how grateful we should be just to have parents.

I really am sorry for your loss.  
 ::dove::
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #13 on: October 06, 2007, 11:27:52 AM »
Quote from: ""Guest""
wow.......interesting subject.   both my parents died in a car accident.  I kind of wish they could bug me once in awhile


Both of my parents are dead, and I don't see anything offensive about these comments.  Sure, I miss them sometimes, but I'm not going to paint an idealized portrait of them.  That's one of the most terrifying moments, when you realize your parents are human, with human flaws, just like you.  Idealizing them isn't the answer, anymore  than blaming them for all of our problems.  YEah, sometimes it would be nice if they were around to bug me, but they aren't, so I cope with it and go on.
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Offline Deprogrammed

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Hope I have helped , even just a lil bit.
« Reply #14 on: October 08, 2007, 04:06:30 AM »
Quote from: ""Carmel""
De-Prog,

I get what youre saying, about how it is with your mom....thats not really far off the mark from where I am with mine or how we were back then.  She was a victim of very similar circumstances prior to my incarceration and we have established that repeatedly.  Its just I guess she takes any opportunity to skew the reality if i am not being vigilant about the truth of the matter.  She likes to pretend it was all someone elses fault, even if last month she took responsibilty, but only because I was trying to work it out with her.

One of her favorite things to do is blame someone else for anything bad thats ever happened to her since childhood.  She will talk about something hurtful and then end it with why it was her mothers or her fathers or my fathers or brothers or sisters fault for not helping her or supporting her.  I finally had to tell her that I was sick and tired of hearing negative things about my father over and over, even though my father and I dont even talk.  She'll blame my father for why she never went to Vegas or why she got fat or why she couldnt do the things for me that she ALWAYS wanted to, nevermind they divorced when I was only five....I had to live through two more absoulte losers and 15 more years of her poor judgement that im fairly certain my dad had no hand in, tangibly I mean.

We get along pretty good now, but its really only contingent on me allowing the continual twisting of truth without an argument.




I understand completely!
I just wanted to offer my support to you since I am female and have a mother too etc...
I still stand by and encourage the battles , and I do so b/c I know that in the end they are worth it. I had to help my mother become un-brainwashed (if ye will) b/c I knew how to do it better than she did.
She didnt even realize that she was brainwashed for the longest time. Just like us I believe that she has "residuals left over from the brainwashing as well (the mindfuck), and I love her a great deal, so I was willing to do it. I just set my mind to having our relationship back and try and make it better than it ever was, and it is better than it ever was now, even before I went into the program. I am extrememly greatful that it is but it was a hard won battle on my part, and on her part. I guess what I am trying to really say is first decide if things are worth it for you, meaning do ye love her enough to get super frustrated and possibly lose your patience at times to get through it all? Ye know? God, can it be frustrating, I know!
I had to make that decision, and then had to stick to it, and keep faith that things would eventually work out. I have had to constantly remind myself that I had made the decision and that I was sticking to it, and that the reason was is that I loved and cared about my mother and loved and cared about myself.

I also found out some things about myself in this process. One thing I found out is that the more grounded I became, and the more that I loved and cared about myself,; the more patient and caring I was able to be towards my Mom. It enabled me to be more understanding in general towards a lot of people, particularly her, though.

I hope something I have said has helped you.
I am really glad that ye brought this topic up, as it is a very important topic. I also believe that possibly this topic in part may apply to children and parents in general and/or also the father-son relationship.

warm regards,
-DP
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