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Offline mbnh31782

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63 days
« on: December 06, 2006, 02:21:30 PM »
check it out....
http://www.63days.com/

a friend sent me the link
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Offline Deborah

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63 days
« Reply #1 on: December 06, 2006, 02:55:30 PM »
Yeh, that's a good one. A bird's eye view into the reality of "parent choice" outdoor treatment.
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Hidden Lake Academy, after operating 12 years unlicensed will now be monitored by the state. Access information on the Federal Class Action lawsuit against HLA here: http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=17700

Offline exhausted

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63 days
« Reply #2 on: December 06, 2006, 03:52:37 PM »
I'll never find out most of what happened here, i can't read it, it's made me feel sick  :cry:
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Offline Anonymous

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63 days
« Reply #3 on: December 06, 2006, 04:00:51 PM »
Quote from: ""exhausted""
I'll never find out most of what happened here, i can't read it, it's made me feel sick  :cry:


Welcome to Fornits.

The Milk Gargling Death Penalty bows deeply.

It only gets worse.
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Offline exhausted

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« Reply #4 on: December 07, 2006, 06:38:46 PM »
I'm not one to bury my head in the sand Milk, but I can't read stories of child abuse, I'm a mother, I can't stand the thought of someone elses child being hurt, it'd keep me awake and I'd somehow manage to blame myself for not saving them all

It's just the way I am

I do still believe there are programs that benefit kids though, that aren't abusive
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Offline Anonymous

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63 days
« Reply #5 on: December 07, 2006, 07:02:07 PM »
Quote
I do still believe there are programs that benefit kids though, that aren't abusive


And as I've posted before, it doesn't matter.
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Offline exhausted

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« Reply #6 on: December 07, 2006, 07:22:11 PM »
How can anything that benefits a child that isn't abusive be anything but good ?

That is a serious question - I'm not taking about programs that aren't as abusive as another one, i'm talking about anything that is totally not abusive and the kid in question feels they have benfitted and are grateful for it, surely that can only be a good thing, only the child in question knows if they are truly thankful they got sent anywhere?
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #7 on: December 07, 2006, 07:48:12 PM »
It isn't the existence of a good place (TSW's Elysian Fields as described in the other thread) that would be the problem, it would be the fact that it would be almost impossible to tell what it is.

For example, take HLA. If you were to believe some of the anonymous posters claiming to be students on that board, you'd believe that HLA isn't nearly as bad as people were claiming. The problem? The "students" were fake. HLA is a hellhole.

Read the thread I linked to for a good analogy. There's so much slick marketing, lying, and bullshit tactics used that telling whether a place is any good or not is difficult to impossible.

Similarly there are some places that honestly try not to be evil, but only partially succeed.
.
Actually, most of the places that are fundamentally decent don't attach themselves to this industry in the slightest, and any place that is fundamentally decent really ought to stay the fuck away from it, to avoid the inevitable confusion.

Personally, I think there isn't many of them simply for lack of business; any parent really deeply concerned for the welfare of her kids will probably just keep them at home anyway, find solutions locally (yours is a special case- usually there are a LOT of non-residential solutions available, for these exact problems), and save a lot of money.

But if you're still interested in seeing if a good place for curiosity's sake, if anywhere has a level system for parent contact (or, really, a level system period- the concept has no place in therapy), warns parents against their children being "manipulative", uses ham-handed tactics to indoctrinate the parents into unconditional support, listens in on phone calls or reads mail, then, guess what- it's probably a shitpit, as they're trying to prevent the kids from telling the truth.

If there's anywhere that doesn't share these features (and good luck finding one!), it sounds fundamentally decent.

The best gauge, although an imperfect one, from telling the good from the bad is openness.
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Offline Troll Control

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« Reply #8 on: December 07, 2006, 07:52:37 PM »
Quote from: ""exhausted""
How can anything that benefits a child that isn't abusive be anything but good ?

That is a serious question - I'm not taking about programs that aren't as abusive as another one, i'm talking about anything that is totally not abusive and the kid in question feels they have benfitted and are grateful for it, surely that can only be a good thing, only the child in question knows if they are truly thankful they got sent anywhere?


You'd have to provide examples of the programs.  

There is a lot of information out there that shows that even if some of these places are not overtly abusive, in many cases they use methods and techniques that aren't based on any sort of appropriate treatment model and are shown to be ineffective at best and damaging at worst.  

Appropriate, research proven effective treatment should be sought, not quackery.
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Offline Anonymous

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63 days
« Reply #9 on: December 07, 2006, 07:54:51 PM »
Ah yes, I forgot to mention the licensing. If it's not licensed or the "therapeutic" techniques they use aren't approved by real psychiatric organizations, stay the hell away.
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Offline psy

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63 days
« Reply #10 on: December 08, 2006, 01:31:04 AM »
Quote from: ""Milk Gargling Death Penal""
Ah yes, I forgot to mention the licensing. If it's not licensed or the "therapeutic" techniques they use aren't approved by real psychiatric organizations, stay the hell away.


i second that from personal experience.
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Offline exhausted

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« Reply #11 on: December 08, 2006, 10:07:15 AM »
I'm finding it so difficult to get my head round the fact that any old person can just set up one of these 'academies' without any regulation or proper qualifications, I mean don't get me wrong - i believe the greatest experts are those who have been through it themselves, you simply cannot learn that experience by reading a book, but it's truy disturbing that people who have no qualifications or even have kids of their own are allowed to just set up or work in a place like this, how can anyone possibly have understanding of what's going on if they haven't been there, seen that, worn the T-shirt?

Maybe it is just the American mentality to allow this - I just know for sure that in the UK absoutely no one would be allowed to go ahead and set it up, there would be regular courses that have to be attended, updates on illnesses, the kids would be allowed to call who they like when they like, social services would be forced to regularly check each chiuld (I know when I was in care, every child had a social worker assigned specifically to them) there would be check after check after check on how the kids are and who is running it

Sadly even here the odd one slips through the net and there has been many cases over the years where abuse has taken place within specialist boarding schools, prisons and schools alike, recently the government was sued for millions by a whole group for kids who suffered abuse in a childrens home specifically for out of control kids, I'm sorry i can't find a link, I only happen to know this because my best friend's husband was one of those kids, he is now 40 yrs old and this has only just come to court!

Then of course we have the sad case of Holly Wells and Jessica Chapman, who were brutally raped and killed buy a school caretaker, this is an outrage being that the bastard who did this to them had several previous on him, but it was never revealed to the college because he had never been convicted, oh they knew he did it before, but lack of evidence got him away and allowed him to work arounfd children - that's our wonderful justice system.

I'll leave you with the link because writing about it just makes me angry - but please don't base these stories on how it is on the whole, it is regulated & watched closely (because of matters such as the above unfortunately)

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/in_depth/uk/ ... efault.stm

Please be aware that 40 yrs is highly unusual, someone without such a high profile case would normally receive maybe 15 years and serve about 9 years of that with good behaviour

Myself I begged not to be returned home, i wanted to stay in the children's home where it was safe and secure and no one was mentally abusing me....but they made me go home anyway - talk about turning the tables!!
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Offline Oz girl

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63 days
« Reply #12 on: December 08, 2006, 09:54:24 PM »
This idea of whether this industry is an american cultural phenomenon or whether this happens because it is a nieche market in a big population is something i have been pondering a lot Exhausted. i just dont know.

 i do know that two of the big barriers to it here is the strongly enforced regulations of any industry dealing with minors and the expense. in a population with only 20 million odd people there are also only so many who can afford 30 grand a year which is around twice the cost of an elite private day school and still more expensive than regular boarding school. It is also reasonably difficult, tho not impossible for an underage kid to go to jail  for delinquent behaviour and near impossible to go to jail for taking drugs, tho not for other related crimes like dealing. Is it similar in the UK?

What about the US? what do people think? if the US did not have such  strong Zero Tolerance laws and had more strictly enforced regulations for youth related schools and facilities would there be any market at all for the TBS industry?
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Offline White Cracker Man

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63 days
« Reply #13 on: December 09, 2006, 12:07:59 AM »
Welll, there will always be parents who send their kids to programs  for reasons THEY CONSIDER LEGITIMATE, like for not liking their child's boyfriend/girlfriend, cursing at their siblings, and the like. What was the name of the teen from California who got sent to TB  because he cursed at his siblings? The one who made national news? The one who told his escorts  to go get a real job?
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Offline Deborah

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« Reply #14 on: December 09, 2006, 02:27:18 AM »
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Hidden Lake Academy, after operating 12 years unlicensed will now be monitored by the state. Access information on the Federal Class Action lawsuit against HLA here: http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=17700
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