Where to really go to get help (for parents and children ali

[fletch699]

OK.  In a recent prior post, I said that Hyde isn't the place to get help.  We all realize that - some more than others.  This board's existance is proof enough that Hyde doesn't work the way it needs to.

But parents and children are finding this board and they're looking (desperately) for help!  They have problems, issues, troubles, difficulties, etc... and all they want is a way to find assistance.  So, while I won't blame anyone for continuing to talk about Hyde (it's good to get it all out), let's see if we can be of benefit to the people that are currently in need of help.

Please respond to this post and in the subject line, insert the City/State of where help can be found (and what subject matter of help) that you're going to share.  Then the body of the post would be a description of a facility, contact information, and any specifics you can give based on your experience.

For example:

Chicago, IL - Residential Substance Treatment Facility

and then the post would be the name of the facility, contact information, and any details you have.

Obviously, we're looking for GOOD recommendations.  Places that have certified/trained staff and know what they're doing and how to go about it successfully.

Oh, and if this is already being done somewhere else on this board or at another site, please post a link.

Thanks!

[Anonymous]

Hyde isn't the place to get help. We all realize that

Ah .... no we do not all realize that.  Hyde has helped many people thru the years.

[fletch699]

Two things.  First, I just "found" the rest of this forum and realized that there are already places to go to find the information I was suggesting people post.  My apologies.

Second, in response to Anon above... can you please share how, in detail, Hyde helped you and what your specific problem was that they were helping you with?  I'm really interested to know.

Thanks.

[Anonymous]

On 2006-06-19 06:41:00, fletch699 wrote:

"Two things.  First, I just "found" the rest of this forum and realized that there are already places to go to find the information I was suggesting people post.  My apologies.



Second, in response to Anon above... can you please share how, in detail, Hyde helped you and what your specific problem was that they were helping you with?  I'm really interested to know.



Thanks."

Hyde was there at juncture in my life when I needed a change in enviroment to deal with some emotional issues.  I found the culture at hyde to be challenging and a breath of fresh air for my family. Was it prefect? No, but nothing is. Is Joe  a little crazy? Yes, but normal is not all it is cracked up to be. BTW there where 500 alum and alum parents at the Hyde 40th. We stood and gave Joe a two minute Standing O for founding the school.  Maybe hyde did not help any of us and we are all deluded cult followers, or maybe not.

[fletch699]

Thank you for sharing with me.  I appreciate the response!  I'm glad that Hyde was able to be there for you when you needed it.

I never said that Hyde was a cult.  What I did say is that it can be cult-ish.  There's a huge difference.  I'm also not saying that Hyde has to be perfect.  Nothing ever is.  And, as I've said elsewhere, Hyde did provide me with some life lessons that were immensely valuable.

My chief complaint with Hyde, however, is that it has a one-size-fits-all (OSFA) program.  The trouble with that is that one-size NEVER fits all when it comes to attitudes, emotions, psychological and/or physical issues.  Which means that unless you fit the mold used to make the OneSize Program (OSP), the OSP is only going to frustrate you to some degree.

Think of it as a OSFA baseball hat, but without the elastic built into the band.  You and I both know that everybody's head is, at least, slightly different in size, shape or other features from anyone elses.  As a result, there will be a set of the population that will be able to wear the OSFA hat with an amount of comfort.  In terms of Hyde, I think that their OSP is for attitudinally-challenged students.

But the rest of the population wearing the OSFA hat is going to find out that it's too small, too big, too tall, too short, not stretchy enough, has a tag that scratches the head in some way, is the wrong color, has a baseball-brim and not a panama-hat brim, etcetera.  The list could go on forever.  Even if you limited it just to people looking for baseball hats, you're still dealing with a whole host of variables that don't fit into the OSFA product.

And again, the Hyde version of this is that they attempt to offer solutions for children with a laundry list of possible problems.  Substance abuse, physical abuse, learning disabilities, psychological problems, physical limitations, etcetera.  A person with one of those problems isn't going to enjoy the OSP as much - nor do I think they can benefit from the OSP, either - as would the person from/for whom the OSP was designed.

Imagine for a moment that a child with an undiagnosed learning disability is enrolled at Hyde.  Imagine that their problem is dyslexia, where they see written words/numbers in a reversed or jumbled order.  As a result, they have difficulty reading/writing, have trouble understanding and completing homework assignments, etc.  In the Hyde format, they're going to receive the same treatment that *I* did - which was based on my laziness and lack of desire to perform.  I was forced to apply myself, I was forced to address my laziness and generally poor attitude.  I was helped to understand that I had the ability to control my behavior.

Is that the right way to treat that learning disabled child?  Personally, I don't think so - and I don't think that the majority of other people would think so either.  A dyslexic person does not have the ability to self-correct.  They need specialized training to help them learn how to read, write and work in an environment that isn't exactly friendly to people with this difficulty.  

If Hyde wants to accept these students, then, I think it should be done with the understanding that they're going to find REAL solutions for these individuals.  Which means external counseling, extensive testing (to ferret out the problems that have gone undiagnosed), lots of understanding... and the abandonment of the OSP.  For a learning disabled child, this also means an adjustment of the model to deal with the fact that the child isn't able to perform because of something not entirely within their control.  For an ADHD child, as another example, kicking their chair to get their attention is not going to be proper treatment.  They need specialized teaching, as well as medication in certain instances.

My continued fear, however, based on my own experiences as well as affirmation by people on this board as well as others, is that Hyde is unwilling or unable to abandon or modify their OSP to a degree that allows for proper treatment of the types of children that they're trying to help.

My prior post

I said that Hyde isn't the place to get help. We all realize that - some more than others. This board's existance is proof enough that Hyde doesn't work the way it needs to.

is based on this fact.  Until Hyde adapts their program model for the differences inherent in the different types of problems presented by their students, it almost doesn't matter that Hyde has good intentions.  The result is that children are not getting the help that they need... and instead are getting "help" that can actually lead to more damage.

Hyde isn't an inherently bad place.  Joe Gauld isn't a bad person.  Their collective "heart" is in the right place.  But there needs to be the realization that OSFA doesn't ever fit all.[ This Message was edited by: fletch699 on 2006-06-19 11:22 ]

[Anonymous]

On 2006-06-19 11:17:00, fletch699 wrote:

"Thank you for sharing with me.  I appreciate the response!  I'm glad that Hyde was able to be there for you when you needed it.



I never said that Hyde was a cult.  What I did say is that it can be cult-ish.  There's a huge difference.  I'm also not saying that Hyde has to be perfect.  Nothing ever is.  And, as I've said elsewhere, Hyde did provide me with some life lessons that were immensely valuable.



My chief complaint with Hyde, however, is that it has a one-size-fits-all (OSFA) program.  The trouble with that is that one-size NEVER fits all when it comes to attitudes, emotions, psychological and/or physical issues.  Which means that unless you fit the mold used to make the OneSize Program (OSP), the OSP is only going to frustrate you to some degree.



Think of it as a OSFA baseball hat, but without the elastic built into the band.  You and I both know that everybody's head is, at least, slightly different in size, shape or other features from anyone elses.  As a result, there will be a set of the population that will be able to wear the OSFA hat with an amount of comfort.  In terms of Hyde, I think that their OSP is for attitudinally-challenged students.



But the rest of the population wearing the OSFA hat is going to find out that it's too small, too big, too tall, too short, not stretchy enough, has a tag that scratches the head in some way, is the wrong color, has a baseball-brim and not a panama-hat brim, etcetera.  The list could go on forever.  Even if you limited it just to people looking for baseball hats, you're still dealing with a whole host of variables that don't fit into the OSFA product.



And again, the Hyde version of this is that they attempt to offer solutions for children with a laundry list of possible problems.  Substance abuse, physical abuse, learning disabilities, psychological problems, physical limitations, etcetera.  A person with one of those problems isn't going to enjoy the OSP as much - nor do I think they can benefit from the OSP, either - as would the person from/for whom the OSP was designed.



Imagine for a moment that a child with an undiagnosed learning disability is enrolled at Hyde.  Imagine that their problem is dyslexia, where they see written words/numbers in a reversed or jumbled order.  As a result, they have difficulty reading/writing, have trouble understanding and completing homework assignments, etc.  In the Hyde format, they're going to receive the same treatment that *I* did - which was based on my laziness and lack of desire to perform.  I was forced to apply myself, I was forced to address my laziness and generally poor attitude.  I was helped to understand that I had the ability to control my behavior.



Is that the right way to treat that learning disabled child?  Personally, I don't think so - and I don't think that the majority of other people would think so either.  A dyslexic person does not have the ability to self-correct.  They need specialized training to help them learn how to read, write and work in an environment that isn't exactly friendly to people with this difficulty.  



If Hyde wants to accept these students, then, I think it should be done with the understanding that they're going to find REAL solutions for these individuals.  Which means external counseling, extensive testing (to ferret out the problems that have gone undiagnosed), lots of understanding... and the abandonment of the OSP.  For a learning disabled child, this also means an adjustment of the model to deal with the fact that the child isn't able to perform because of something not entirely within their control.  For an ADHD child, as another example, kicking their chair to get their attention is not going to be proper treatment.  They need specialized teaching, as well as medication in certain instances.



My continued fear, however, based on my own experiences as well as affirmation by people on this board as well as others, is that Hyde is unwilling or unable to abandon or modify their OSP to a degree that allows for proper treatment of the types of children that they're trying to help.



My prior post

I said that Hyde isn't the place to get help. We all realize that - some more than others. This board's existance is proof enough that Hyde doesn't work the way it needs to.

is based on this fact.  Until Hyde adapts their program model for the differences inherent in the different types of problems presented by their students, it almost doesn't matter that Hyde has good intentions.  The result is that children are not getting the help that they need... and instead are getting "help" that can actually lead to more damage.



Hyde isn't an inherently bad place.  Joe Gauld isn't a bad person.  Their collective "heart" is in the right place.  But there needs to be the realization that OSFA doesn't ever fit all.[ This Message was edited by: fletch699 on 2006-06-19 11:22 ]"

Fletch, you are wonderful.  I say this because you are a breath of fresh air to this board.  You make a statement and you follow it up with what you feel that way.  You are neither vicious or looking to hurt anyone.  It is obvious you are trying to help and I admire this.

You are absolutely right about getting the proper information out there so parents can look in the right places for information in order to make smart decisions for their children.  I think someone needs to make another board where we can post helpful hints for those who are at Hyde and those considering Hyde.  The phrase, "you are part of the problem or you are part of the solution."  You obviously want to be part of the solution and I agree with this.  We have bitched about Hyde, now let's try to help some people avoid the potential problems at Hyde.  Those who strictly need character adjustments might want to consider Hyde, but those with deeper issues including medical and emotional need the resources to try and find a more suitable place.

Do you have the ability to start a blog for Hyde?  I am not computer literate and do not know how to do this.  I think a blog could be very useful.

Thank you again Fletch for all your wisdom and sincerity.

[fletch699]

Thanks for the kind words.  I hope that what I type is somehow useful to someone.

I could start a blog, but I'm not sure that I have enough to warrant anyone listening to me.  The truth is that I'm just one person with one (limited) experience with Hyde.  Sure, I suppose I could expand it to my other private-school memories/thoughts/feelings, but again, there's only so much to my knowledge.

I think that keeping the information here is pretty valuable.  A parent doing research is going to find the information on this site to be quite informative and enlightening.  In the end, the decision on whether to send a child to Hyde (or any other board school for that matter) is based on the unique facts of their own particular situation.

If people, however, have specific questions for me, you can always find me at my username at yahoo dot com.  I'm happy to provide responses to any serious inquiries.

[Anonymous]

Is that the right way to treat that learning disabled child? Personally, I don't think so - and I don't think that the majority of other people would think so either. A dyslexic person does not have the ability to self-correct. They need specialized training to help them learn how to read, write and work in an environment that isn't exactly friendly to people with this difficulty.

I am dyslexic.  I went to hyde  I recieved no special consideration for my reading problems.  I learned to adapt.  I went on to great academic success.  BTW I have many OSFA ball caps w/ the adjustable clip. I love them the only fit to size ball cap I have I do not like.  So there you have it.

[Anonymous]

On 2006-06-20 05:32:00, Anonymous wrote:

"

Is that the right way to treat that learning disabled child? Personally, I don't think so - and I don't think that the majority of other people would think so either. A dyslexic person does not have the ability to self-correct. They need specialized training to help them learn how to read, write and work in an environment that isn't exactly friendly to people with this difficulty.

I am dyslexic.  I went to hyde  I recieved no special consideration for my reading problems.  I learned to adapt.  I went on to great academic success.  BTW I have many OSFA ball caps w/ the adjustable clip. I love them the only fit to size ball cap I have I do not like.  So there you have it."

You went on to great academic success?  What about your character?  

It is obvious you are saying that a child with ADD, ADHD or dyslexia can benefit from Hyde.  You are doing everyone coming to this board a disservice by saying this, and this is exactly what the problem at Hyde is. Hyde is NOT equip to help students with learning disabilities!  Hyde needs to stop taking people's money just to raise the student population.  Hyde School should only accept those who they can help. Stop accepting almost all applicants! As Fletch said they then end up hurting both the ones they can't help as well as the ones they can.  If you really want to become the best you can listen to what people are saying, Hyde!!!!

[fletch699]

I have many OSFA ball caps w/ the adjustable clip. I love them the only fit to size ball cap I have I do not like.

I think you misunderstood what I was saying.  When I was talking about a OSFA baseball hat, I wasn't talking about an adjustable hat (the ones with the plastic nibs on the back that allow for all head sizes).  I'm talking about the hats that are made in ONE size only - fitted, so to speak... but are sized for the "average" head.

But that's neither here nor there.  My point isn't that someone with a learning disability is bound to fail at Hyde.  My point is that someone with a learning disability isn't necessarily going to get the help they need, in a timely and complete manner, from Hyde - merely because Hyde isn't looking for learning disabilities or any other problems of that nature.  Hyde is only looking to fix "character defects."

That's not a problem in and of itself, obviously.  But it becomes a problem if/when you claim that EVERY problem is a character defect.  To use another analogy that might be more appropriate, Hyde has but one tool... a hammer (fixing character defects).  The tendency, therefore, is to treat everything they encounter as a nail (a character defect) when, in fact, they might be dealing with a screw.

Does that make more sense?

[Anonymous]

On 2006-06-20 10:06:00, Anonymous wrote:

"

On 2006-06-20 05:32:00, Anonymous wrote:


"

Is that the right way to treat that learning disabled child? Personally, I don't think so - and I don't think that the majority of other people would think so either. A dyslexic person does not have the ability to self-correct. They need specialized training to help them learn how to read, write and work in an environment that isn't exactly friendly to people with this difficulty.

I am dyslexic.  I went to hyde  I recieved no special consideration for my reading problems.  I learned to adapt.  I went on to great academic success.  BTW I have many OSFA ball caps w/ the adjustable clip. I love them the only fit to size ball cap I have I do not like.  So there you have it."

You went on to great academic success?  What about your character?  



It is obvious you are saying that a child with ADD, ADHD or dyslexia can benefit from Hyde.  You are doing everyone coming to this board a disservice by saying this, and this is exactly what the problem at Hyde is. Hyde is NOT equip to help students with learning disabilities!  Hyde needs to stop taking people's money just to raise the student population.  Hyde School should only accept those who they can help. Stop accepting almost all applicants! As Fletch said they then end up hurting both the ones they can't help as well as the ones they can.  If you really want to become the best you can listen to what people are saying, Hyde!!!!"

It is obvious you are saying that a child with ADD, ADHD or dyslexia can benefit from Hyde.  You are doing everyone coming to this board a disservice by saying this

The truth will set you free.  Truth is I am dyslexic.  I went to hyde.  I have no problems with my dyslexic - isms actually I like them so help me dog.  I said nothing about ADD ADHD.  My charater is fine thanks. How is yours?
Hyde is a player in a free market.  Hyde sells a service. They can and should offer to provide that sevice to whom ever they choose as thier target demographic.  It is up to the consumers to decide if they want to go.  If you want to send your kid to Hyde that is your choice as a consumer.  I don't know where you get off telling a private non profit that you are not involved in how to run thier business. They have a Board of Governors for that.  Hey if you care so much send Joe an email and tell him you want on the BoG.

[Anonymous]

The truth will set you free.  Truth is I am dyslexic.  I went to hyde.  I have no problems with my dyslexic - isms actually I like them so help me dog.  I said nothing about ADD ADHD.  My charater is fine thanks. How is yours?

Hyde is a player in a free market.  Hyde sells a service. They can and should offer to provide that sevice to whom ever they choose as thier target demographic.  It is up to the consumers to decide if they want to go.  If you want to send your kid to Hyde that is your choice as a consumer.  I don't know where you get off telling a private non profit that you are not involved in how to run thier business. They have a Board of Governors for that.  Hey if you care so much send Joe an email and tell him you want on the BoG.



"

Hey good buddy, the Board of Governors at Hyde is not based on people who have a sincere interest in Hyde unless you have the big bucks!  Take a look at the names.  These are mostly the inner circle and ones who give the big dollars to the school. Joe makes sure there is no one who is going to question his authority.

Where do I get off making suggestions to better a school?  I went to Hyde. They taught me to speak out. What's the matter, you aren't interested in hearing about ways to improve Hyde? I wouldn't have a chance in hell of getting on the board.  They are not interested in fresh, new, ideas!

[fletch699]

Hyde is a player in a free market. Hyde sells a service. They can and should offer to provide that sevice to whom ever they choose as thier target demographic. It is up to the consumers to decide if they want to go.

OK... so hypothetically, are you saying that I, as a car rental agency, perhaps, should rent a vehicle to someone who is visibly intoxicated?

I would hope that your answer is "no" - that you would want me to exercise sound business judgement and realize that even though I lost the "sale" for the day, I might have saved the life of the intoxicated individual... and that of anyone s/he may have hit while trying to drive the car.

You are correct that Hyde does operate in a free market... and they can (and do) offer their services for sale to anyone who is willing and able to pay the fees for such services.  The point some of us are trying to make here is that by selling these specific services, Hyde has created for themselves somewhat of an obligation to make sure that they're providing the right services to the buyer.

Maybe we could look at it another way.  I don't know what you do for a living or how many service people you have hired to do something for you... but let's assume that a toilet in your house is clogged because you used too much toilet paper for a single flush.  You call the plumber to come fix the toilet (as the plumber advertised in the yellow pages and online that they can fix clogged toilets).

When they get to your house, the plumber tells you that they sure can fix your toilet... and they quote you a price.  You think the price is fair (let's say $300) and they say ok, pay me in advance, leave the house and come back in an hour and the toilet will be unclogged.

When you return home, you are really distressed to find the fire department at the street.  Your house is a mess.  There is a huge gaping hole through the wall where your bathroom used to be... charred wood and drywall drips with water from the fire department hoses.  You're simply stunned to find out that while you were gone, the plumber used dynamite to blow out the clog in your toilet.  Just then, the plumber walks up to you, shakes your hand and thanks you for your business, gets in his van and drives away.

How do you feel at this moment?  Hurt?  Scared?  Upset?  Angry?  Ripped off?

The truth is that you bought a service (toilet unclogging), you relied on an "expert" to do the job (the plumber), and you trusted them to complete the job as they said (left for an hour).  Are you allowed to be feeling those negative feelings now?

Because even if you asked questions in advance, I'm guessing that you did not think to ask if they were going to use explosives to clear the clog.  I'm also guessing that you didn't ask whether the rest of your house was going to be intact when you got back.  Rather, you put faith in the "expert's" ability to do what they said they could do.

And while this is an extreme example (note: it's somewhat based on a true story), the applicability to the Hyde experience for many parents and students rings true.  Hyde promises a fix for a problem, but they do not exactly explain how they are going to get there... nor do they confess that if there are any non-character problems, that those won't be directly addressed.  Parents, especially those of so-called troubled teens, don't think to ask in detail what they probably perceive to be common sense issues.  (ie: my kid isn't going to get blown up in the process)  Or, in other words, they're assuming that the child is going to be safe.

The problem is that because of the particular service that Hyde is selling, there is a chance of harm.  And it isn't usually mentioned.  Hyde does not disclose, in detail, that students with problems other than "character defects" aren't going to get attention for those other problems.  Parents (and I'm guessing even more so for desperate parents) make the incorrect assumption that a school such as Hyde is fully equipped to handle a myriad of problems - not just one.

So, when you say:

If you want to send your kid to Hyde that is your choice as a consumer. I don't know where you get off telling a private non profit that you are not involved in how to run thier business.

the choice should be predecated on being fully informed.  And, for the most part, prospective Hyde parents are not fully informed.  Which, from a legal perspective, negates the ability to make a "choice."

What many of us are now saying, then, is that Hyde needs to do one of two things.  They can either change their advertising and recruiting practices so that they only accept students who have the very limited defects that the Hyde solution was designed to fix.  Or they can increase the social-services-types of offerings, as well as modify their other programs, so that they can adequately treat students with other types of problems.

[Anonymous]

How do you feel at this moment? Hurt? Scared? Upset? Angry? Ripped off?

No I only hire bonded tradesmen to work on my property.  I collect from the trademan's insurance.

[Anonymous]

choice should be predecated on being fully informed. And, for the most part, prospective Hyde parents are not fully informed. Which, from a legal perspective, negates the ability to make a "choice."

An uninformed choice is a choice. If some one wants to drop 35K with out gaining a level of information  that meet _your_ standard of "fully informed" that is thier business.

BTW how did you become fully informed?  How do you become fully informed that most of the parents that chose hyde are not "fully informed"  Do you interview each and ever parent or do you do a statisical sample?

I would like to become fully informed of the nature of your fully informedness so I can make an informed decision at to whether you are full of ..... information.