Update from "former" program mom

[Truth Searcher]

I just wanted to offer an update of sorts ... not that anyone really remembers me or my daughters situation ... but more for my own benefit.  Our daughter returned home from a TBS about a year ago.  I was sold on this place.  I firmly believed that it was where she needed to be.  But, in the months since her return, she has really began to open up about her experience. My "beliefs" began to change ...

It (the program) was not always what the brochures and website led us to believe.  "Duhhh" you say ...

I just wish to say that I have come to appreciate what you all do in terms of advocacy.  While I think that your anger sometimes overpowers your message ... I do agree with what you are trying to say on most levels.  

So with hat in hand, I say that I understand your anger and your zealousness in attacking this industry.  

In hindsight (which I know is 20/20 vision) I wish I had not sent my daughter to such a facility ... and hers was mild in comparison with what some of you have experienced.

I am thankful that she is alive.  I am thankful that she is not drug addicted, or pregnant, or carrying a deadly disease.  I am thankful that we have been able to pick up the pieces and move forward.  

I had a couple come to me a few weeks ago - at the end of their rope with their out of control teen.  They wanted to send him to a TBS.  I strongly discouraged them from doing so.  I shared my reasons why.  I just want the powers that be at Fornits to know, that you were instrumental in challenging my thinking.  

Thank you.

[Nihilanthic]

Uh, why not tell us WHAT PLACE IT WAS SO WE CAN WARN OTHERS?  :roll:

Its STILL NOT ABOUT YOU!!! Its about your child, the fact that that program did NOTHING to help her or prevent her from being "drug addicted, or pregnant, or carrying a deadly disease", nor is this forum about you getting over your guilt and feeling better about it by making a useless admittion to us.

The programs make it about your feelings and your beliefs to make it good for *YOU*. WE are here to make it about saving them from being tortured and fucked up by people who fell for it (you) or people selling these programs to gullable parents.

If you actually want to do some good, why not tell us what place it was, and what they did specifically, and the names of people you know, so that we have FACTS and PROOF and telling people to avoid that place in particular, those people who are at that place, and to avoid warning signs that place exhibited.

Wow, you snapped out of it. Heres a cookie: you're now on the level of MOST NORMAL AND SANE PEOPLE ON EARTH. Feel better? Great. Why not actually do something tangible about it instead of "get it off your chest" like we're your damn support group?

Didnt you have plenty of time to commiserate with other program parents while your kid was busy being fucked with in the head? Yanno, being treated 24/7 by lots of people the way you are being treated now by me? Dont you want to stop anyone else from suffering from this?

Thats what hurts people so bad. Not a sepecific, theatrical/dramatic bad sounding thing like pepper spray or metal brushes to their gonads, not O.P., its being day in and day out ripped apart, and periodic LGAT seminars that are much more intense verisons of this, having no friends, nobody to rely on, no trust, no love, no affection, no pleasure of any sort that the program doesnt dole out and consider a 'priviladge', and her own parents turned against her.

It is just as bad as every other progarm, but it doesnt have stuff that the average idiot would consider 'worse'.

At least you bothered to register an account.  :roll:[ This Message was edited by: Nihilanthic on 2006-04-27 14:13 ]

[Truth Searcher]

Nihal ...

See... now here is a perfect example of what I mean ... your hostility is a bit overwhelming.  Honestly, you would do alot more in advancing your cause with a little diplomacy.

Ummm ... I don't believe I ever claimed that this experience was about me ... in fact, what I was trying to communicate was that I came to see things from her perspective.  And that your site was instrumental in educating me to the "other side of the coin".

Really no need to get your shorts in a knot ...[ This Message was edited by: Truth Searcher on 2006-04-27 14:24 ]

[TheWho]

On 2006-04-27 14:11:00, Nihilanthic wrote:

"Uh, why not tell us WHAT PLACE IT WAS SO WE CAN WARN OTHERS?  :roll:



Its STILL NOT ABOUT YOU!!! Its about your child, the fact that that program did NOTHING to help her or prevent her from being "drug addicted, or pregnant, or carrying a deadly disease", nor is this forum about you getting over your guilt and feeling better about it by making a useless admittion to us.



The programs make it about your feelings and your beliefs to make it good for *YOU*. WE are here to make it about saving them from being tortured and fucked up by people who fell for it (you) or people selling these programs to gullable parents.



If you actually want to do some good, why not tell us what place it was, and what they did specifically, and the names of people you know, so that we have FACTS and PROOF and telling people to avoid that place in particular, those people who are at that place, and to avoid warning signs that place exhibited.



Wow, you snapped out of it. Heres a cookie: you're now on the level of MOST NORMAL AND SANE PEOPLE ON EARTH. Feel better? Great. Why not actually do something tangible about it instead of "get it off your chest" like we're your damn support group?



Didnt you have plenty of time to commiserate with other program parents while your kid was busy being fucked with in the head? Yanno, being treated 24/7 by lots of people the way you are being treated now by me? Dont you want to stop anyone else from suffering from this?



Thats what hurts people so bad. Not a sepecific, theatrical/dramatic bad sounding thing like pepper spray or metal brushes to their gonads, not O.P., its being day in and day out ripped apart, and periodic LGAT seminars that are much more intense verisons of this, having no friends, nobody to rely on, no trust, no love, no affection, no pleasure of any sort that the program doesnt dole out and consider a 'priviladge', and her own parents turned against her.



It is just as bad as every other progarm, but it doesnt have stuff that the average idiot would consider 'worse'.



At least you bothered to register an account.  :roll:[ This Message was edited by: Nihilanthic on 2006-04-27 14:13 ]"

Nihil ,Back off, almost all the people here are just getting things off their chest, they owe you nothing.  You have no idea what it is like to be on either end, you have never been involved with these places yourself.

[TheWho]

On 2006-04-27 14:23:00, Truth Searcher wrote:

"Nihal ...



See... now here is a perfect example of what I mean ... your hostility is a bit overwhelming.  Honestly, you would do alot more in advancing your cause with a little diplomacy.



Ummm ... I don't believe I ever claimed that this experience was about me ... in fact, what I was trying to communicate was that I came to see things from her perspective.  And that your site was instrumental in educating me to the "other side of the coin".



Really no need to get your shorts in a knot ...[ This Message was edited by: Truth Searcher on 2006-04-27 14:24 ]"

Nihil, I want you to sit back and listen and learn something.

[Anonymous]

Dear Truth Searcher,

Not all of us are like N. N, lay off......take a chill pill, or get your ass off the computer and go for a jog........something to get your aggression out.

On the other hand, N is a no nonsense kind a guy, and he obviously doesn't believe in sugar coating things. There were some great points that he made, and had he been able to say it in a little different way, then he would've gotten what it was that he was in search of.

Now, I am going to ask you.....What TBS did your daughter go to? What happened? Why do you feel diffrently now? How do you feel that they specifically deceived you? Feeling as strongly as you do now, you have a duty to warn other parents out there. If you choose not to, then you aren't doing anything but coming here to make some kind of confession to us. What's the point of that? The only way to bring about change in this industry is to take action.

[Deborah]

And....
how is your daughter? Did she ever move back home? Was it difficult to talk about her experience? What convinced you that it hadn't been helpgul?
Thanks for the update.

[shanlea]

I don't get it. It takes a lot for Truth Searcher to come here and admit a mistake. Do you know how many parents still assert 20 years later that X program saved their kids' lives? Even as their children, now adults, suffer from all types of hidden (and not so hidden) scars?

Why attack her? She ALREADY said she was able to warn one family to think twice.  And the truth is, while anger can be a driving force, it can overwhelm the message if you sound like a fucking lunatic. I'll save that for the Ottawas, who blatantly ignore program abuses, and celebrate the programs while simultaneously overlooking the loooooong list of SPECIFIC abuses we suffered.  

Truth Searcher is exactly the kind of advocate we need.  She understands the perspective of desperation that leads to bad choices and had the humility and grace to recognize her mistake.

And the truth is: these schools manipulate the hell out of our parents.  They have it down pat. Exactly what to say to inspire fear if you even consider pulling your child out.  Parents trust them to be experts.

My parents thought CEDU would be a REAL academic environment (not even close) with accredited therapists, with supportive group therapy.  It was a place in the mountains in a bucolic setting.  They had no CLUE what was going on. It was recommended by pastors/therapists.  I WANTED help.  

When my Dad got cold feet, the school told him I was  a Coke Head which was a blatant lie--I wasn't even there for drugs! THey told him if he showed any weakness I'd be in jail or dead.... Because we were mointored and isolated it was easy to mainatin that... they also told my parents I was lying if I said otherwise... More BS!  I didn't even go there for lying! I was the kid who left notes when I snuck out and never lied to a direct question.  (I might for example try and say I was going to a slumber parrt, but if my Dad said You're not really going to a slumber party are you? I would say, you're right I'm not.)

CEDU made a liar out of me, a liar out of parents, and we won't even discuss their end of it!

So please, I think Former Program Mom has a lot to offer here in her own way.  If she can warn others to rethink their choices and research carefully, that in itself has real value.

When I had my student yanked out of my school to be sent to some whacked out religious cult with JC in it's mission statement, I didn't have a leg to stand on with the parents. (Frankly, it was risky for me to even say what I said.) But if they heard from another Mom who sent their kid there, with the same Christian values, they may have been more receptive.

We need all the help we can get.

[Kathy]

Thank you so much for letting us know that, truthseeker.  That makes it all worth-while.  
 :tup:

[Nihilanthic]

On 2006-04-27 14:23:00, Truth Searcher wrote:

"Nihal ...



See... now here is a perfect example of what I mean ... your hostility is a bit overwhelming.  Honestly, you would do alot more in advancing your cause with a little diplomacy.



Ummm ... I don't believe I ever claimed that this experience was about me ... in fact, what I was trying to communicate was that I came to see things from her perspective.  And that your site was instrumental in educating me to the "other side of the coin".



Really no need to get your shorts in a knot ...[ This Message was edited by: Truth Searcher on 2006-04-27 14:24 ]"

Right. Youve posted here so you can feel better, but you still aren't actually helping anyone! You havent said which program, or anyone who works there. Why havent you yet?

BTW, the reason Im like this is Im sick of the stupid double standard. Everyone can be hard on the kids, but nobody can take their own medicine. Im sick of everyone getting a pat on the back for admitting they were wrong, and all the PARENTS get everything SOOOOooooooooooo sugar coated, but it was never like that for your kid. Maybe now after the fact, sure, yeah, but you definitely cant take what you previously dished out.

... and you still havent said what program, or who worked there, or any specifics at all...

which leads me to think youre trolling  :wstupid:

Thanks... try the roast beef!

[TheWho]

On 2006-04-27 18:40:00, Nihilanthic wrote:

"

On 2006-04-27 14:23:00, Truth Searcher wrote:


"Nihal ...





See... now here is a perfect example of what I mean ... your hostility is a bit overwhelming.  Honestly, you would do alot more in advancing your cause with a little diplomacy.





Ummm ... I don't believe I ever claimed that this experience was about me ... in fact, what I was trying to communicate was that I came to see things from her perspective.  And that your site was instrumental in educating me to the "other side of the coin".





Really no need to get your shorts in a knot ...[ This Message was edited by: Truth Searcher on 2006-04-27 14:24 ]"

Right. Youve posted here so you can feel better, but you still aren't actually helping anyone! You havent said which program, or anyone who works there. Why havent you yet?



BTW, the reason Im like this is Im sick of the stupid double standard. Everyone can be hard on the kids, but nobody can take their own medicine. Im sick of everyone getting a pat on the back for admitting they were wrong, and all the PARENTS get everything SOOOOooooooooooo sugar coated, but it was never like that for your kid. Maybe now after the fact, sure, yeah, but you definitely cant take what you previously dished out.



... and you still havent said what program, or who worked there, or any specifics at all...



which leads me to think youre trolling  :wstupid:



Thanks... try the roast beef!"

You havent read much around here,  you really think the kids get beat up more than the parents on Formits?  Do you just log-in, post and leave?

Nihils, you havent been reading at all or listening, what value have you added to this site?  Give me a link, I'll read it!!!

[Nihilanthic]

Nihils, you havent been reading at all or listening, what value have you added to this site? Give me a link, I'll read it!!!

http://www.askquestions.org/articles/teens/

http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?topic=7573&forum=9

And a few things Im not at liberty to share  :grin:

Still, regardless, why not DO SOMETHIGN TO HELP instead of being an attention whore for consolation after admitting you fucked up? You dont do that for the attention and for the personal release of responsibility and getting "awww that must be so hard" crap, its to make the OTHER person feel better, and to make good on it.

Shes helped nobody, shes done nothing but talk get attention from it. 50+ posts and wont say what program or any people involved? Shes done nothing to prevent anyone else from being hurt by those same people, or gotten justice for her kid for what they did to her.

I honestly think its just someone who wants attention, and doesnt even have a kid. Even if it IS a program parent, its about time to actually DO SOMETHING!!

Another thing. As HORRIBLE as this must be over the FUCKING INTERNET THAT SHE CAN WALK AWAY FROM, IGNORE, CLOSE THE WINDOW, OR WHATEVER, imagine if I was in her face doing this, with 20 of my best buddies doing the same thing, and she cant run away, or walk away, or turn it off. She doesnt have people speaking up for her - everyones turned against her, even her own mother. And it lasts all day. And its daily, for months, maybe years.

BOO FUCKING HOO.

[TheWho]

On 2006-04-27 18:59:00, Nihilanthic wrote:

"

Nihils, you havent been reading at all or listening, what value have you added to this site? Give me a link, I'll read it!!!

http://www.askquestions.org/articles/teens/



http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?topic=7573&forum=9



And a few things Im not at liberty to share  :grin:



Still, regardless, why not DO SOMETHIGN TO HELP instead of being an attention whore for consolation after admitting you fucked up? You dont do that for the attention and for the personal release of responsibility and getting "awww that must be so hard" crap, its to make the OTHER person feel better, and to make good on it.



Shes helped nobody, shes done nothing but talk get attention from it. 50+ posts and wont say what program or any people involved? Shes done nothing to prevent anyone else from being hurt by those same people, or gotten justice for her kid for what they did to her.



I honestly think its just someone who wants attention, and doesnt even have a kid. Even if it IS a program parent, its about time to actually DO SOMETHING!!



Another thing. As HORRIBLE as this must be over the FUCKING INTERNET THAT SHE CAN WALK AWAY FROM, IGNORE, CLOSE THE WINDOW, OR WHATEVER, imagine if I was in her face doing this, with 20 of my best buddies doing the same thing, and she cant run away, or walk away, or turn it off. She doesnt have people speaking up for her - everyones turned against her, even her own mother. And it lasts all day. And its daily, for months, maybe years.



BOO FUCKING HOO."

So you:
1.   Asked a Question  and
2.   Started a thread
3.   are very angry at parents.

I still think based on your response that you do not read much, I think you post and leave and maybe feel better after dumping.  People take baby steps sometimes, let the info come out naturally, why force people?  Why be so cruel

[Nihilanthic]

I still think based on your response that you do not read much, I think you post and leave and maybe feel better after dumping. People take baby steps sometimes, let the info come out naturally, why force people? Why be so cruel

I think you

• Need to stop doing a bad Dr. Phil impression
• Need to know that I've already answered your stupid questions
• Need to support constructive actions, not flame me behind anonymity
• Stop ENABLING (to use one of your terms) an attention whore. Whether its an actual program parent, or just a troll (which I really, really think it is...) it does nothing to just keep lavishing on "oh you poor thing omg youre so brave" when the only person who was brave or did any suffering was the kid who got fucked up for a year or more with mommy helping them out.

Again, if THIS IS "cruel" just imagine how fucking awful it must be to have this in person, 24 hours a fucking day. Nobodys saying anything for the kid, nobodys doing anything for the kid, just this poster with some fucked up twist on Munchausen's syndrome.[ This Message was edited by: Nihilanthic on 2006-04-27 19:19 ]

[TheWho]

I just wanted to offer an update of sorts ... not that anyone really remembers me or my daughters situation ... but more for my own benefit. Our daughter returned home from a TBS about a year ago. I was sold on this place. I firmly believed that it was where she needed to be. But, in the months since her return, she has really began to open up about her experience. My "beliefs" began to change ...

It (the program) was not always what the brochures and website led us to believe. "Duhhh" you say ...

I just wish to say that I have come to appreciate what you all do in terms of advocacy. While I think that your anger sometimes overpowers your message ... I do agree with what you are trying to say on most levels.

So with hat in hand, I say that I understand your anger and your zealousness in attacking this industry.

In hindsight (which I know is 20/20 vision) I wish I had not sent my daughter to such a facility ... and hers was mild in comparison with what some of you have experienced.

I am thankful that she is alive. I am thankful that she is not drug addicted, or pregnant, or carrying a deadly disease. I am thankful that we have been able to pick up the pieces and move forward.

I had a couple come to me a few weeks ago - at the end of their rope with their out of control teen. They wanted to send him to a TBS. I strongly discouraged them from doing so. I shared my reasons why. I just want the powers that be at Fornits to know, that you were instrumental in challenging my thinking.

Thank you.

--------------------------------------------
Nihils,  I repeat, read !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  Munchausen's syndrome??

What is your problem?  You log in write something and leave, engage in the conversation !!!  You did not answer squat !!!! You dont know what it is like to be a parent with that type of dicsion to make, you do not know what it is like to be a child in a program.  You are angry and decided to take it out here, why not chose a canine abuse forum , spca !!!
What is your point ?  You have no idea what you are talking about and what it feels like, dont pretend and try to get mad for other people, it wont work.

Try saving the whales !!!! (but read up first)
People like you are ignorant