Author Topic: The Real Problem Is ...  (Read 14109 times)

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Offline Anonymous

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The Real Problem Is ...
« on: April 15, 2006, 02:20:00 PM »
For every negative comment, there is a parent and child saying something entirely different.  Yeah, it doesn't mean it's the truth, but if they are willing to believe it's the truth, then what?

http://wwaspsrebuttal.com/parent_references.html
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #1 on: April 15, 2006, 04:27:00 PM »
My name is Dani.  I was at Cross Creek for about 3 years total and am listed as "Dani" on that site.  After leaving the program, I lived with someone who worked there and his wonderful family for 2 more years.  As a favor to someone who works there and called me, I agreed to have a post I wrote when I was 17 or 18, which was also written willingly but upon request, changed to include my graduation from college.  Also, I needed to come to a place where I could admit to myself that although many people who worked with me did care about me, I could hold on to that and simultaneously think for myself about the situation in its entirety, as well as about the astounding number of claims coming from programs all over.  I've realized that caring about kids and having qualified people as the decision makers are two different things.  I was 21 then, and I'm 28 now.  I was told that the article was for the program newsletter, which was compiled by someone I care about, and I didn't see the scope of this situation until maybe a year or so ago when I found some of this online.  I apologize to any families or students who feel I was part of a deception.  I hope that you understand that my views on the program have evolved in light of new information and education.  

After I began reading online about what is going on in programs, I became concerned.  Also, I began working with children and learned what is legal and what is not.  I now realize that some of what happened at Cross Creek that I once perceived as normal now concerns me.  Cross Creek appears to be one of the tamest WWASP programs, so I guess I should consider myself lucky.

I wanted to vomit after seeing the Hobbit, the dog cages, and Steven Frederickson and the others shaking years later while discussing their memories.  Amberly Knight described the conditions as similar to Abu Ghraib.  I work with children every day to make the world a better place, and it sickens me to think that I possibly had any part in hurting kids.

I never consented to have my photo or story online.  I emailed the program to have it removed, probably about a month or two ago, and see it's still up.  I know it can take a few weeks to do, especially if your computer techs are off-site.  Thank you for posting that link as I hadn't checked back myself.  I just left a message at Cross Creek and you should see one less picture pretty soon.  

I know that everyone who works there knows me and will probably be shocked that my opinions have evolved.  I know that there are plenty of people at WWASP who care about kids, or were when I was there from 11-13 years ago.  I do think that to some it was just a job or a paycheck, and major decisions made about the program appear to be financially driven.  I would list Brent Facer, Garth Lasater, Jana Moody, Bernie, Cameron Pullan (though he did dole out group consequences liberally), therapist Darryl if he's still there, Glenda Gabriel, Mary Beth Litchfield, Cathy Christiansen and the Pearts as people who stood out as going the extra mile to make the kids there feel comfortable and respected, who at least believed they were doing something good for kids.  They never belittled me or made me feel like trash, and I think that if they knew something was wrong, they would have wanted to fix it.  Cross Creek seems to have been run differently than some of the other programs, and again my heart goes out to anyone who was ever placed in a stress position, isolated/confined, or otherwise treated inhumanely in a program.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline emaree

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« Reply #2 on: April 15, 2006, 04:56:00 PM »
I think that points out another problem. Half these so-called testimonies are given in the program, or fresh out of the program, or before the person really understands the scope of what they had been through. Even I had positive things to say at first...it's just how they want it. By the time the damage has been done, nobody wants to listen anymore.
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Offline MightyAardvark

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« Reply #3 on: April 15, 2006, 07:18:00 PM »
Fortunately, there are people like me who do want to listen, and catalogue and record everything.
I'm surprised by what you've got to say about Cameron Pullan though. Would you be willing to talk to me about your experiences at Cross Creek?
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see the children with their boredom and their vacant stares. God help us all if we\'re to blame for their unanswered prayers,

Billy Joel.

Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #4 on: April 15, 2006, 07:48:00 PM »
Sure, I will talk to anyone who wants to talk to me.  I will try to message you.  

I do not mean to discount what everyone is saying on other forums about what they've been through.  Remember, I was in programs from 1992-1995, so I can't say what recent graduates went through.  

Cameron wasn't in charge of a program when I was at Cross Creek.  He was just a regular staff.  He used to organize games for us on the weekend, which was a nice change from the lame weeknight schedule of Zig Ziglar tapes and sing-a-long videos.  Anyone can change, and actually in light of those Hobbit pictures, I probably should have left him off my list of people who seemed to care.  It takes one sadistic fuck to actually plan a room like that, buy materials, envision how kids will fit inside, find a location away from the other buildings so you know it won't have heating during the Montana winter, and then build it and force a child inside against his/her will.  The doghouse I built last summer was planned with consideration for the weather, seasonal changes, entry, the view, etc.  That Hobbit is disgusting.

I was well behaved at Cross Creek.  As everyone knows, the better you were, the better you had it.  When I was there, they had locked isolation rooms, some with surveillance cameras.
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Offline MightyAardvark

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« Reply #5 on: April 15, 2006, 07:52:00 PM »
[email protected] then
as i have been posting ad nauseam on this site of late.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
see the children with their boredom and their vacant stares. God help us all if we\'re to blame for their unanswered prayers,

Billy Joel.

Offline emaree

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« Reply #6 on: April 15, 2006, 09:58:00 PM »
I guess you're right, aardvark. :smile:

I'm also surprised at what you said about Cameron. While I was at Spring Creek he was non-existant on the facility, except for the time he called staff central at 2:00 in the morning, drunk, and made all the students get up and go out to the court.

Chaffin Pullan was the more present director, and you hardly saw him either. I think as they made more money they slowly stopped caring about the kids...
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #7 on: April 15, 2006, 10:23:00 PM »
I read all of the lying bull shit you have shared off the wwasp rebuttal in the Kids in Crisis glossy brochures Teen Help sends out to get us desperate,vunerable,stupid parents to believe you they caring and able to provide professional care to our kids.
 
WWASP is a fraud.  Save the bullshit for people who havent experinced the truth. Fucking koolaide drinker. Guzzle guzzle guzzle. You're dead.
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Offline Nihilanthic

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« Reply #8 on: April 16, 2006, 02:28:00 AM »
Quote
On 2006-04-15 11:20:00, Anonymous wrote:

"For every negative comment, there is a parent and child saying something entirely different.  Yeah, it doesn't mean it's the truth, but if they are willing to believe it's the truth, then what?



http://wwaspsrebuttal.com/parent_references.html"


Has it ever occured to you those boilerplate replies are only a few notches above "yes, please buy WWASPS product! *nodnod*"?

They just made it the fuck up! The only people who actually identify themselves and use specifics instead of nebulous "IT R GOOD" type statements are the people who are critical of the program. Pro-programmies have had their facilities to be critical removed in those fucked up seminars.

But, well, of course, the real problem is nobody knows how to be a critic anymore.[ This Message was edited by: Nihilanthic on 2006-04-15 23:28 ]
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
DannyB on the internet:I CALLED A LAWYER TODAY TO SEE IF I COULD SUE YOUR ASSES FOR DOING THIS BUT THAT WAS NOT POSSIBLE.

CCMGirl on program restraints: "DON\'T TAZ ME BRO!!!!!"

TheWho on program survivors: "From where I sit I see all the anit-program[sic] people doing all the complaining and crying."

Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #9 on: April 16, 2006, 02:32:00 AM »
Notice none of the testimonials say "my kid has been home for..." they are giving praise while their kid is still incarcerated. These are written during the seminars as homework. Also some parents get totally brainwashed, like the ones who financed the 'crisis' video. The parents get way more brainwashed than any of the kids do, IMO.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #10 on: April 17, 2006, 11:48:00 AM »
Quote
On 2006-04-15 16:48:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Sure, I will talk to anyone who wants to talk to me.  I will try to message you.  



I do not mean to discount what everyone is saying on other forums about what they've been through.  Remember, I was in programs from 1992-1995, so I can't say what recent graduates went through.  



Cameron wasn't in charge of a program when I was at Cross Creek.  He was just a regular staff.  He used to organize games for us on the weekend, which was a nice change from the lame weeknight schedule of Zig Ziglar tapes and sing-a-long videos.  Anyone can change, and actually in light of those Hobbit pictures, I probably should have left him off my list of people who seemed to care.  It takes one sadistic fuck to actually plan a room like that, buy materials, envision how kids will fit inside, find a location away from the other buildings so you know it won't have heating during the Montana winter, and then build it and force a child inside against his/her will.  The doghouse I built last summer was planned with consideration for the weather, seasonal changes, entry, the view, etc.  That Hobbit is disgusting.



I was well behaved at Cross Creek.  As everyone knows, the better you were, the better you had it.  When I was there, they had locked isolation rooms, some with surveillance cameras.  

"


Anon, your logic is clear, but you're relying on misinformation for your conclusions. From someone who knows, the building is pretty much in the middle of the campus, right next to therapists' offices and the dining room. It was always heated, and never even had locks on the door. There is no such thing as isolation, either. And your initial impression of Cameron is, in my opinion, pretty accurate: he's a good guy.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #11 on: April 17, 2006, 11:51:00 AM »
Quote
Anon, your logic is clear, but you're relying on misinformation for your conclusions. From someone who knows, the building is pretty much in the middle of the campus, right next to therapists' offices and the dining room. It was always heated, and never even had locks on the door. There is no such thing as isolation, either. And your initial impression of Cameron is, in my opinion, pretty accurate: he's a good guy.


The other day you said the hobbit didn't have doors, now you are saying that it didn't have locks, but there were doors? Why can't you get your story straight. The hobbit did have locked doors, and even though it had a very basic heater, it was kept freezing at night, as documented in the Pure lawsuit with the boy who's orange froze. No such thing as isolation? The hobbit is isolation, you are making no sense. Cameron is not a good guy, he just enjoys being comandant of his own prison camp.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #12 on: April 17, 2006, 07:14:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-04-17 08:51:00, Anonymous wrote:

"
Quote

Anon, your logic is clear, but you're relying on misinformation for your conclusions. From someone who knows, the building is pretty much in the middle of the campus, right next to therapists' offices and the dining room. It was always heated, and never even had locks on the door. There is no such thing as isolation, either. And your initial impression of Cameron is, in my opinion, pretty accurate: he's a good guy.



The other day you said the hobbit didn't have doors, now you are saying that it didn't have locks, but there were doors? Why can't you get your story straight. The hobbit did have locked doors, and even though it had a very basic heater, it was kept freezing at night, as documented in the Pure lawsuit with the boy who's orange froze. No such thing as isolation? The hobbit is isolation, you are making no sense. Cameron is not a good guy, he just enjoys being comandant of his own prison camp."


Entryway, silly . . . a door on the entryway to keep the heat in. It never had a lock.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #13 on: April 17, 2006, 07:36:00 PM »
Yet it was cold enough for an orange to freeze. Riiiiiiiiiight.
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Offline Antigen

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« Reply #14 on: April 18, 2006, 11:05:00 AM »
The silliest thing about this conversation is that one side is going on personal experience and the other has only seen the brochure.

I can very well do without God both in my life and in my painting, but I cannot, suffering as I am, do without something which is greater than I am, which is my life, the power to create.
--Vincent Van Gogh, Dutch painter

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