76-77 Seed Grads

[Seth]

Hey sorry about that!!!

   That previous messaged about the cottages was by me.   I forgot to log in and it seems that I accidentally posted anonomously.

[Stripe]

Something is kind of interesting here. While there are a few women who post here and speak of good times, etc., they are few and far between.

Most often, it's the males who seemed to have had "normal" things in their lives that they equate with happiness while they were involved with the seed. Maybe more balanced and less affected? I dunno.

True, most of that fun took place "off campus."  And too much of anything always seems to have been found out and busted up by the staff.  

Does anyone besides me see that striking difference between the female and male experience when it comes to off time and "fun"?  

Were there two standards of acceptable behavior -two kinds of fun that could be had? Boy fun and girl fun?  We all sat through the same program.

Just wondering.

[Magpie]

Well I had lots of fun.  We had crazy boat rides and camping.  We stayed up late playing games and cards.  Most of us girls in Apartments taught each other how to cook different things.  I remember great dinner parties, cooking thanksgiving dinner for a group of people.  I also remember going out to dinner to really nice restaurants.  Remember the French place in Ft. Laud. called LaDome--I think that was the name.  One of my roommates, Lourdes and I worked down at the Sunrise cinema at night part time and use to have a blast singing songs in the small booth while we sold tickets--she use to take me to Little Havana and we would eat Cuban food and go to movies with her Grandma.  We did a lot of fishing too.  The H sisters and I use to do lots of fun stuff, shopping, going to St. Pete.  It was like living the clean life of a teen--I missed it earlier in my teen life pre-seed.  It was fun and I wouldn't have it any other way.

[Seth]

Wow!   La Dome~~!   I went there lots of times.   It was a great spot for birthdays and anniversaries.

   Speaking for myself tho I used to have a great time "on campus" as well.  We used to fix all kinds of electrical and mechanical stuff.  Had a blast doing everything and working with the other guys.

   We rented a front end loader and filled in the back field so that it was level so we could play ball back there.  That was a blast.

   I remember one day working in the back with Johnny G.   I think we were bending some big pipes to use as electrical conduits for ballfield lights.   John had kinda a belly which ummm  somewhat "projected out" shall we say.  I remember teasing him because only the top of his belly had gotten sunburned.

   I remember hooking up the final leg of wiring for the ballfield and being asked "Are you sure you have it right".   And of course I replied "fuck yea" with a grin.  And then we flipped the switch and there was a small explosion.  Pretty embarassing but we all laughed our asses off.

   And then there was the singing.  We sang all kinda stuff and some played guitars.  Some of the harmony stuf we did rivaled Manhatten Transfer.  There was boxing too  The girls used to sometimes do some kinda line dancing.  There was even dirty jokes.

   Naaa I gotta say that I had blast.

[Ft. Lauderdale]

I married one of those chicks.  I remember in the Michael Jackson "Thriller" day, she taught a group of about 20-30 girls the whole dance.

  They also used to spend hours shelling at the beach. I still have of bunch of beautiful shells from another lady that passed on that fill two large lamps in my living room.

Trust me even when we got divorced it happened on leap year...so we only had to remember the day every four years...(there was alittle humor in everything)...

We all had fun...

I remember hours of riding waves..no boards...just body surfing... It still brings a smile to my face when I smell the beach air and feel the sunshine...lots of great memories...and yes football on the beach....I must admit I hated it for a couple of years...until I learned to catch a long pass...I still love playing football with my family to this day...

 :grin:

[GregFL]

I think, Stripe, what you are witnessing is not a difference in sex, but more of a difference between Art's favorites and the average seedling.

I mean, if you were on staff, no one was really telling you when to pee, marking your defecations down in that little book (just what the hell did they do with that book?  What was the purpose?) and no one was force feedling you wet PJ sandwiches and little cups of cool-aide, keeping you up all night writing confessionals and making you hokie pokie in the parking lot in front of your old "druggie friends"  hoping to break your spirit.

So yeah, these guys who bought all the way in and decided that yes, it was reasonable to have Daddie Art decide who you could date and where you should work, how you should dress and act and who you could talk to..sure they had some good times. They were doing exactly what they thought was reasonble, and had like minded people to do it with.   Those of us that were counting the days to freedom and trying to find private glimpses of our real selves without getting in trouble really didn't have much to celebrate.

It is all a matter of perspective.


_____________
"I think they're very dangerous and destructive. I don't think that anyone should think for you. And that's exactly what cults do. All cults, including Scientology, say, 'I am your mind, I am your brain. I've done all the work for you, I've laid the path open for you. All you have to do is turn your mind off and walk down the path I have created.'" - L. Ron Hubbard, Jr., 1983 Penthouse interview

[Stripe]

Maggie, Ft.L., Seth,

Thanks for the perspective.  

And Maggie, I'm glad to know the girls,whoever they were, had fun.

Can I tell you guys though, it was really different on the other side.  Do you all recall what Greg is referring to?

And even as weird and sad and disconcerting as my experience was, I don't think I would trade it for any of the happy ones you guys had. Personally, I think the price paid was way too high. No offense intended so please don't take it, okay?

[Ft. Lauderdale]

Nope...

No one ever told me who to date.  I asked my wife to marry me no else had anything to do with it...

Sorry Greg there is alot more to it than you know.
I was never really a favorite.  In fact more times probably not the favorite.

[Johnny G]

I was somewhat rotund, and that wasn't PbJs.  We ate pretty well at night (2 fridges, both full)

I also recall getting zapped up on the top of a light pole, (another "fuck yea" moment as in  "is it off?")

I always had a ball fixing stuff around there.  sometimes I think it is a wonder we didn't kill ourselves.  I got chased around the roof by a pissed off bunch of bees after we tried to smoke them out of the wall.

Thoise were definitely some good times!

G

[cleveland]

I can say that in some ways, I agree with Maggie - there were times when I felt like I was living a 'normal' life and that we were having fun without feeling the pressure to 'be cool' - and that was great. But, on the other hand, there were people who had a certain amount of freedom that I and others didn't share, so there were people who could work on projects and use front-end loaders (I remember that day - I spent hours digging a drainage ditch) and stuff. Usually I got stuck with manual labor-type jobs, or being in a rap, but I didn't really have a choice and that's the problem with it for me. So - I learned how to have some fun without drinking or being cool, which was great - but I did feel that my life was really, really REALLY constricted, especially the longer I was there. I am sure I had my own freedoms, but I was envious of people who worked at better jobs than mine, or who were allowed to have more freedom, or were favored with more attention. Stripe's posts seem to reflect someone early in the program, Seth's and FL's are from the standpoint of long-term guys. For whatever reason, we each havce our own perspectives.

I think part of the problem I had is that I really thought I was supposed to be humble, and that meant the I didn't aspire to much when I was at the Seed. I thought that was being grateful for whatever came my way, and not pushing for recognition or privileges.

As far as dating goes, it simply didn't exist when I was at the Seed. I remember Cindy and John were allowed to date, but he was a staff member so he had contact with the girls that I did not. I rarely ever even had a conversation with anyone but a female staff member. My contact with the opp. sex was limited to saying 'hi' (maybe) or 'nice catch' on the football field. Literally. So, I'm not even sure how FL got far along enough to get married! I wouldn't have had the option, not during my time.

I didn't go to La Dome or the movies (I remember seeing exactly one movie - Alien) and I took one trip to the Keys, which was kind of unsanctioned and never repeated. I remember going out to dinner once in my seven-year stint with a couple of seed friends - the rest were always with family when they made once-a-year visit.

I think I kind of took pride in my austere life style, but it also kind of sucked, too. My life was work, group, home - work, group, home - work, group, home - football/baseball on the weekends, then back to work, group, home. Fishing? I did it three times in seven years. Hiking? Never. Making non-Seed friends? Never. Having a stimulating, open conversation where I disagreed with a staff member or someone with more senior status than me? Never! Taking a class, going to a lecture, museum or concert? Never. Reading a good book? Not approved of. Listening to any music besides jazz, big band and 1950s pop? No.

I have some good memories and some good times were had, but lots of days were just kind of gray for me...kind of lonely, since I wasn't free to be my true self. Whenever I did start to have fun, staff would disallow the activity or move me to another apartment. Really, that's what I remember more than anything, was my lack of freedom. More than any fun I had.

[Anonymous]

My God. Will you get over the bathroom list. As far as I can remember it just gave the young kids something to do and also just kept you thinking Ok I better not cop out by going to the bathroom too many times.  There were alot of kids and not alot of bathrooms. (At one time the list may have even been taken to determine if more toilets needed to be added on) That stopped when the group got smaller.  That was the only reason bathroom usage was delayed.

[cleveland]

No. Sometimes I asked to go and was ignored for a while, to demonstrate power. I clearly remember this when I was a newcomer.

[Anonymous]

All these things we did were after I had graduated and I was over 18.  I am sure some people felt differently and had a rough time of it.  Before that time, I was concentrating on getting better.  After I graduated, I was relieved to finally have the freedom (not care what other people thought) to be and do what I wanted to.  I would have invited you along if I knew you.  By the way, I was no one's favorite--I just wanted to get along with people and make the best out of my life.  Remember I ask to go in which was different than some of you that were put there by your caring parents.

[cleveland]

If you were a girl, I wouldn't have been allowed to tag along. I would have to have advanced approveal from staff, and I am sure they would have strongly discouraged me from doing it. I never hung out with anyone exept for another Seed kid from home or work, unless I was assigned to do something with someone else by staff. In my experience, it was pretty rigid.

[Seth]

Stipe no offence taken at all man.   I think its great for all of us to say what we think, regardless if we are in agreement or not.

   And honestly I didnt really percieve things quite the way that Greg had pointed out, and was not even aware that there was "another side".

   I guess it is just the way of the world that people can have differnt views and feelings about the same thing.

   Gotta say tho that I am very touched by the message in a differnt thread that Greg is raising his daughter to have drug free values.

   Is she getting any type of music or dance lessons?   Jesus I wish my parents had done that for me.  I could have been the next Elton John.