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Author Topic: Second Nature Wilderness Program  (Read 60739 times)

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Offline Lain the Odd

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Second Nature Wilderness Program
« Reply #150 on: December 29, 2007, 09:25:23 PM »
Get me in touch with these hundreds of pleased Second Nature families, if you would. I'd love to hear from them. Make sure the kids are in there too.

Yeah.. that sounds suspiciously like another cult: Scientology parishioners, whether professional auditors, Scientology Volunteer Ministers or one of the many millions of Scientologists belonging to groups, missions and churches around the world, continue to use the Scientology Creed on a daily basis to improve conditions in life.

Now, as anyone familiar with either that particular one or marketing techniques used by such can tell you, there aren't millions of scientologists. There aren't even 50,000. It's the same with 'pleased Second Nature families', only I would argue that those are probably even more a myth. The same argument applies here - show us the evidence. Given the mass of personal, professional, and researched thought against such programs, the burden of proof is with you. Give it your best shot.
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Very soon now the drug will cause the subject to experience a deathlike paralysis together with deep feelings of terror and helplessness. One of our earlier test subjects described it as being like death. A sense of stifling and drowning.
And it is during this period that we have found the subject will make his most rewarding associations between his catastrophic experience and involvement with the violence he sees.

Offline Che Gookin

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« Reply #151 on: December 29, 2007, 09:34:31 PM »
Funny how they say, "satisfied families" isn't it? Never knew the whole family was out tromping around in the woods being treated like an animal.

What the parents think and believe is not important. They didn't survive the experience they merely endured it from the comfort of their homes.
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Offline TheWho

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« Reply #152 on: December 29, 2007, 09:52:51 PM »
Quote from: ""Lain the Odd""
Get me in touch with these hundreds of pleased Second Nature families, if you would. I'd love to hear from them. Make sure the kids are in there too.

Yeah.. that sounds suspiciously like another cult: Scientology parishioners, whether professional auditors, Scientology Volunteer Ministers or one of the many millions of Scientologists belonging to groups, missions and churches around the world, continue to use the Scientology Creed on a daily basis to improve conditions in life.

Now, as anyone familiar with either that particular one or marketing techniques used by such can tell you, there aren't millions of scientologists. There aren't even 50,000. It's the same with 'pleased Second Nature families', only I would argue that those are probably even more a myth. The same argument applies here - show us the evidence. Given the mass of personal, professional, and researched thought against such programs, the burden of proof is with you. Give it your best shot.


I think what we know is thousands of kids have gone thru second nature.  What have we seen maybe 5 here on fornits who didnt benefit?  I think that is the evidence.
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Offline Lain the Odd

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Second Nature Wilderness Program
« Reply #153 on: December 29, 2007, 10:06:54 PM »
Alright.

Now, consider this.

Not all of such victims are familiar with this random forum.

Either way, you're dodging the point. You say all these families were so wonderfully helped (and as noted, it doesn't matter in the least what the families think.. but still)? Show us.
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Very soon now the drug will cause the subject to experience a deathlike paralysis together with deep feelings of terror and helplessness. One of our earlier test subjects described it as being like death. A sense of stifling and drowning.
And it is during this period that we have found the subject will make his most rewarding associations between his catastrophic experience and involvement with the violence he sees.

Offline Che Gookin

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« Reply #154 on: December 29, 2007, 10:19:20 PM »
I wouldn't bother showing me. I don't give a damn if the program is helpful or not. Any program that disregards civil liberties and human rights is a no go for me.

Second Nature does this every single time they take a kid who was drug out of his bed.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #155 on: December 29, 2007, 10:52:54 PM »
Second Nature doesn't claim to be the final solution to teen issues. It is a therapeutic wilderness program which provides the opportunity (yes, the COERCED opportunity) for the teen to be away from the home environment and examine his or her issues and family relationships. The therapists are in the field TWO days a week with the kids in their group and the support staff is in constant touch with the lead therapist for the group.  I have spoken with at least 25 teens who believe their Second Nature time was well-spent and who respect the therapists and staff.  I have not spoken with any who feel this program was abusive or a waste of time, and this includes kids who are highly critical of RTCs and TBS programs.
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Offline Oz girl

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« Reply #156 on: December 29, 2007, 10:59:06 PM »
Quote from: ""Guest""
Second Nature doesn't claim to be the final solution to teen issues. It is a therapeutic wilderness program which provides the opportunity (yes, the COERCED opportunity) for the teen to be away from the home environment and examine his or her issues and family relationships. The therapists are in the field TWO days a week with the kids in their group and the support staff is in constant touch with the lead therapist for the group.  I have spoken with at least 25 teens who believe their Second Nature time was well-spent and who respect the therapists and staff.  I have not spoken with any who feel this program was abusive or a waste of time, and this includes kids who are highly critical of RTCs and TBS programs.


If this is genuinely the case what makes second nature unique?
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n case you\'re worried about what\'s going to become of the younger generation, it\'s going to grow up and start worrying about the younger generation.-Roger Allen

Offline Lain the Odd

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« Reply #157 on: December 30, 2007, 01:24:23 AM »
“GROUP FOUR!â€
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Very soon now the drug will cause the subject to experience a deathlike paralysis together with deep feelings of terror and helplessness. One of our earlier test subjects described it as being like death. A sense of stifling and drowning.
And it is during this period that we have found the subject will make his most rewarding associations between his catastrophic experience and involvement with the violence he sees.

Offline Oz girl

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« Reply #158 on: December 30, 2007, 03:11:12 AM »
Did this person go through with you lain? How long ago did you go through?
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n case you\'re worried about what\'s going to become of the younger generation, it\'s going to grow up and start worrying about the younger generation.-Roger Allen

Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #159 on: December 30, 2007, 07:14:57 PM »
What about compulsory education laws?
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #160 on: December 30, 2007, 07:43:05 PM »
Quote from: ""Guest""
What about compulsory education laws?


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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #161 on: December 30, 2007, 08:28:08 PM »
Do participants earn school credits for doing the wilderness course?

Sorry for being so dumb. I really don't know anything about this.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #162 on: December 30, 2007, 09:05:23 PM »
I'm gonna assume you're a genuine newbie and not a troll- most of the trolls around here don't do the uninformed-questions thing...

Think about it for a bit. Consider what school credits are supposed to represent. Seriously, what would they have credits in? Being abused in the desert? Force-marched through the woods 101? Why would a school give educational merit to an activity that doesn't involve education?

Similarly, most "therapeutic boarding schools" aren't legally recognized as schools at all, and their diplomas are about as valuable as ass wipe. No accreditation.

Now I'm curious: Why do you ask? You actually sound like the rarest of rare things on Fornits, a real parent. If you've already asked them I assume you've received the usual song and dance. Why not ask the school? Depending on how informed they are (and how badly they want to pass your kid through their system), they will probably let you know how he can "make up" the credits. Which means he's not getting any there.
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Offline Nihilanthic

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« Reply #163 on: December 30, 2007, 09:05:35 PM »
Quote from: ""Guest""
The hundreds of Second Nature families who are pleased with the program are not represented on this forum.  That says something....


They're free to speak here.

The thing is, kids in programs are not free to speak at all, and are coerced while in them and threatened with among other things various punishments and actually getting out to 'work the program'.

Which is not therapy, but rather coercive behavior modification.

Ho hum?
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DannyB on the internet:I CALLED A LAWYER TODAY TO SEE IF I COULD SUE YOUR ASSES FOR DOING THIS BUT THAT WAS NOT POSSIBLE.

CCMGirl on program restraints: "DON\'T TAZ ME BRO!!!!!"

TheWho on program survivors: "From where I sit I see all the anit-program[sic] people doing all the complaining and crying."

Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #164 on: December 30, 2007, 09:56:28 PM »
they give one credit,  but it's really 1/4redit since it's based on a quarter system, not a semester, of English and one credit for Physical Education for forced hikes.

the English credit is given in Creative Writing since the teens write in their journal daily plus write their life story and a response to the Impact letters.



http://www.snwp.com/subpages.asp?id=11

a bunch of Mormons run this scam.
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