Author Topic: Help At Any Cost - Not What I Had Hoped It Would Be  (Read 6845 times)

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Offline MomCat

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Help At Any Cost - Not What I Had Hoped It Would Be
« Reply #15 on: March 01, 2006, 01:41:00 AM »
I think Maia's book is well-written. It bothers me to see people here criticizing it. Perhaps you don't know how hard it is to write a book and then to have it published and all it takes to promote it. She shares stories that need to be heard, stories that I believe will make people think. The important thing is getting it out there so people will read it.
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Offline Antigen

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Help At Any Cost - Not What I Had Hoped It Would Be
« Reply #16 on: March 01, 2006, 11:28:00 AM »
Quote
On 2006-02-28 20:43:00, Anonymous wrote:

FYI ... Maia will be appearing on the Rachel Maddow show on Air America tomorrow morning at around 8:30am Eastern to discuss tough love programs, their political connections and the recent death of a 14-year-old boy in a boot camp.


Damn, I missed it. Now I have to pay $1.95 for a day pass.

I loved the book too. What I like so well about it is how she tells the ever important and too often neglected back story.

She employs mainly 4 stories to illustrate a few typical scenareos within the industry. Then she goes on to show how they all go back to Synanon, how their marketing is just the same and just as bogus (talk about the long con!) and how the entire industry is based on the tragic myths about kids ta' day. Now that's a difficult task to tackle. People cling so hard to their illusions, even the horrible ones about their own kids. But I think it's one of the more important aspects of the story.

Kids ta' day are better behaved, more responsible, more respectful and just overall better citizens than we were. Even if they were half as horrible as the Toughlove Hategroup makes them out to be, the troubled parent industry does not offer help, only punishment and forced compliance.

Our country right or wrong. When right, to be kept right; when wrong, to be put right.
--Carl Schurz, German-born U.S. general and U.S. senator

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Offline Goodtobefree

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Help At Any Cost - Not What I Had Hoped It Would Be
« Reply #17 on: March 01, 2006, 12:04:00 PM »
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On 2006-02-28 18:58:00, concernedparent wrote:

""Help at any Cost" serves exactly the purpose it should serve.  Why get down on anyone or anything that is serving your cause?  Wake up!  It is parents, not survivors, that need to be reached - we are the ones in panic decision mode, we are the ones , making these placement decisions, these "therapeutic" decisions, and, and  WE NEED INFORMATION!.  We need someone other than an "educational consultant" to turn to.  I have already made the mistake with my son - I made a very bad choice, a choice based upon the information I had at hand.  I hired a "professional" ( I now know that ed cons are really not professionals at all by other standards).  I read, I googled, but now I know, I needed to google all the way to the bitter end.  I did my due diligence in the best way I knew how, and it was not nearly enough.  I only wish this book had been available to me two years ago.  It explains this teen rehab industry fully, in a way, perhaps, that parents only can understand.  And if I had read but one chapter of this book two years ago, if just one website like this, or isaccorp, had popped up, in my initial searches, my decision would have been so different, and my son would have never been abused.

I understand fully that as survivors you are in rage and in pain.  But the best and only way to effect change for other kids, is to reach parents.  You have your stories and they are more than valid - my son has his story, and it is an injury to our entire family.  The cause at hand is to educate parents on a national basis - in doing that, other kids will be protected.  I have financial resources, I have connections to the mainstream media, and I have cause to act.  Get together; take action.  There are parents there, like me, ready to take on the cause.  My reasonmay be selfish....this is for Sam...but it is also for you."


     I couldn't agree more.  It's unfortunate that there aren't always answers for those of us that have been through these programs.  It's really fucked up that we have to navigate our lives without the compasses and maps that everyone else seems to have for their well-established paths through life.  It flat out fucking sucks that we have to go through all of this, but I think it's even more important that we make sure that these atrocities be stopped so that NOBODY ELSE HAS TO GO THROUGH THIS!  
     For that purpose, I think the book accomplishes what it needs to.  It's almost all new information to those unfamiliar with the industry.  I think that the in depth stories of the worst of these cases are what makes it real to the reader.  I think it has more impact than a large multitude of accounts of systemic abuse.  I think that the focus on the specific cases, those which highlight the ultimate results of these systems, is the best way to get the point across to prospective paretns, concerned friends/family, doctors, lawyers, shrinks, etc.
     Maybe I'm wrong but I think that the reasoning behind the way the book was written had more to do with the target audience being those I just mentioned.
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Offline try another castle

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Help At Any Cost - Not What I Had Hoped It Would Be
« Reply #18 on: March 01, 2006, 12:28:00 PM »
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On 2006-03-01 08:28:00, Eudora wrote:

"
Quote

On 2006-02-28 20:43:00, Anonymous wrote:


FYI ... Maia will be appearing on the Rachel Maddow show on Air America tomorrow morning at around 8:30am Eastern to discuss tough love programs, their political connections and the recent death of a 14-year-old boy in a boot camp.




Damn, I missed it. Now I have to pay $1.95 for a day pass.



I loved the book too. What I like so well about it is how she tells the ever important and too often neglected back story.



She employs mainly 4 stories to illustrate a few typical scenareos within the industry. Then she goes on to show how they all go back to Synanon, how their marketing is just the same and just as bogus (talk about the long con!) and how the entire industry is based on the tragic myths about kids ta' day. Now that's a difficult task to tackle. People cling so hard to their illusions, even the horrible ones about their own kids. But I think it's one of the more important aspects of the story.



Kids ta' day are better behaved, more responsible, more respectful and just overall better citizens than we were. Even if they were half as horrible as the Toughlove Hategroup makes them out to be, the troubled parent industry does not offer help, only punishment and forced compliance.

Our country right or wrong. When right, to be kept right; when wrong, to be put right.
--Carl Schurz, German-born U.S. general and U.S. senator


"


I loved the book too. Maia has amazing insight. What shocked me was how much the Mormons are involved in these places.

My friend who is studying to become a teacher had some really good insight on "kids ta' day" and why so many of them are unjustifiably incarcerated. He said "parents are less involved yet have higher expectations." which I think is exactly right.
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Offline Antigen

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Help At Any Cost - Not What I Had Hoped It Would Be
« Reply #19 on: March 01, 2006, 02:04:00 PM »
Come to think of it, she tells each of those selected stories better than most. Long as I've known Rich, I never did quite put it together what Community Improvement Foundation really was. Smart dude, that Rich! And she tells the Aaron Bacon story in the style of an investigative journalist (which, unlike me or you or most of us) she actually is. She interviewed the people around the subject, found out what they thought, read through all of the court documents and news accounts. She really explained well how these unbelievable events can happen, what motivates the people involved to do what they do.

That's another really hard nut to crack. Can you imagine, for example, a guy like Mel Riddile being in charge of a program like Straight, Inc.? How could a guy like that go along with things like coerced sexual confessions in group confrontation settings? Well, he did. Daily. He was in charge of Straight, Springfield for a number of years. And while, by all accounts he never was the sadistic monster Virgil Newton is and the program was less horrible in some ways when Mel was in charge, he did indeed enforce extremely damaging program policy on a lot of kids.

Why? Cult experts call it "sacred doctrine". To the people involved, it's just like administering surgery or chemo or some other highly traumatic medical intervention. The difference is that, despite their strongly held beliefs, these treatments are not helpful and the supposedly troubled patients are mostly not disordered to begin with.

They believe absurdities and so they commit atrocities.

The legislature is to society as a physician is to the patient. If a physician ignored side effects of medications like today's legislators ignore the side effects of their legislation, the physician would be accused of malpractice. I accuse today's legislators (with rare exception) of legislative malpractice. Many of the ills that are so obvious in our society are a direct result of previous legislation. Their solution? More laws!
-- John A. Bennett, DO

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
"Don\'t let the past remind us of what we are not now."
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Offline Anonymous

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Help At Any Cost - Not What I Had Hoped It Would Be
« Reply #20 on: March 01, 2006, 07:27:00 PM »
Everybody is entitled to their own opinion.  Some may like it and some may not.  That is what makes this place in which we live so great.
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Offline Nihilanthic

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Help At Any Cost - Not What I Had Hoped It Would Be
« Reply #21 on: March 01, 2006, 10:03:00 PM »
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On 2006-03-01 16:27:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Everybody is entitled to their own opinion.  Some may like it and some may not.  That is what makes this place in which we live so great."


Damn straight.

However, opinions do not supercede facts, and everyone is not entitled to their own 'truth'.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
DannyB on the internet:I CALLED A LAWYER TODAY TO SEE IF I COULD SUE YOUR ASSES FOR DOING THIS BUT THAT WAS NOT POSSIBLE.

CCMGirl on program restraints: "DON\'T TAZ ME BRO!!!!!"

TheWho on program survivors: "From where I sit I see all the anit-program[sic] people doing all the complaining and crying."

Offline MomCat

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Help At Any Cost - Not What I Had Hoped It Would Be
« Reply #22 on: March 02, 2006, 01:47:00 AM »
A couple of years ago, I might have had a tough time believing the things I read in Maia?s book. But that was before receiving the call that would forever change my life. The call came from a boy who I dearly loved, who had lived with us as a teen, and who was abducted from our home in the middle of the night by a teen ?escort? service hired by his parents. He would spend the next two years of his life in another country far from home where he suffered serious forms of abuse, where he witnessed abuse, and where he was forced to commit acts of abuse to others.

It was three years later that I got his call, pleading for my help to rescue his sisters who, too, had been abducted and who were taken thousands of miles from home to WWASP programs. I learned very quickly that what Maia has written in the pages of her book is real and that many of the tactics that were used back in the 80?s in Straight, Inc., in KIDS, in the Seed, are still used today. It is disturbing and the story needs to be told.

I remember when I first learned about this industry I would shutter to think ?how could this be happening here in the US.? The more research I did, the clearer it became how this industry has evolved to what it is today.

The fact that it has gone on since the 80?s, that it is thriving, and that it has become a billion dollar a year industry is very disturbing. Seemingly plenty of lawmakers and government officials know about the abuse and neglect suffered by so many. Yet it continues to thrive. So many believe the kids incarcerated into these programs are druggies, they have a lot to learn. I've been told by dozens of survivors that most children in these programs are far from druggies, far from alcoholics, far from sex fiends. Most of them are children who have been abused, who have been adopted, who come from broken homes, who have ADHD, ODD (oppositional defiance disorder), eating disorders, and a myriad of other conditions. They are children who need help from trained professionals, not children who need "tough love". Not children who need to lose their rights, not children who need to be abused. What are these programs teaching these children? What are they doing to their families?

The programs tout that they build families up yet I have personally heard from dozens of families who claim their families have been broken down as a result of their involvement with them. Maia?s book helps bring that point across.

Program owners claim the children are the liars, the manipulators, and they convince the parents that this is true. Yet they encourage parents to lie to their children and to deceive them. They encourage parents to have their children abducted and taken against their will. Don?t they see that when parents do this they become the liars and the manipulators? Don?t they care? Don?t they realize this very act alone can break a bond between a parent and a child? The very act of hiring someone to abduct a child is unforgivable and unforgettable.

They don?t care because they are motivated by one thing ? money. Each child that comes into the program brings in between $40,000 to $100,000 a year, depending on the program.

What would you call a mother who deceives her 17-year old daughter, a daughter who, by the way, is a straight A student who has never tried drugs, never drank alcohol, has never had sex, by telling her that she is taking her to lunch when in reality she has hired an ?escort? service to abduct her? What would you call a mother who jumps out of the car, watching as these strangers jump into the passenger seat, as they handcuff her daughter who cries out for help, but who lets them take her away, right before her eyes? What would you call a mother who has her taken thousands of miles from home to be incarcerated, taken her from her friends, her siblings, her school, her life, to live in a place where she will lose all of her basic human rights? A liar, a manipulator? This happened to a girl I know personally, and it happens to many other children.

The things Maia has shared in her book could seem unbelievable, but they are very true. I believe the majority of the population has no idea about the truth of the ?tough love? industry. And I believe it is our job, those who do know, to spread the word, to support one another, and to not criticize each other?s efforts.

I want to say thank you to Maia for the time she has taken to research the industry, to travel long distances to interview key players, to sit through what had to have been a heart-wrenching trial (Lulu?s), to interview parents and survivors, and then to take on the incredible task of putting it all down on paper. It?s no easy task writing a book, getting it published, and then getting it out there so people will read it.

Survivors have talked about their experiences in Tranquility Bay, about how they and others have been forced to lie on their faces in OP (observation placement) for days, weeks, and even months. I think about how these children must hope beyond all hope that we, the adults who know what is going on, will come to their rescue. I believe it is our job to try.

In my opinion, anyone who is concerned about this industry and who wants to get the word out to the general public, to lawmakers, to social workers, to educators, to mental health professionals, should all be promoting this book. I challenge each and every one of you to purchase an extra copy to give to your local public library. People need to read this. I have never met Maia, and I have no personal thing to gain if Maia?s book becomes a best-seller. The ones who have something to gain, in my opinion, are the children who might be spared from becoming a victim because someone read this book.

What I think some of you are missing is that we know this industry inside and out, we know most of the stories told in the book, so it?s not news to us (though I do have to admit that I am learning some new things about the history of the industry by reading Maia?s book).

Parents who are on the verge of sending a child away might not if they were to read this book. A judge about to sentence a child to one of these facilities might change his mind if he reads this book. Educators who once promoted sending kids away might think twice if they read this book. Mental health professionals may reconsider their recommendations that parents place their kids in programs away from home and their own communities.

Those people, the ones who know nothing about his industry, like I knew nothing until a year and a half ago, will find this book very shocking and incredibly informative.

If I was a parent of a troubled teen and I read this book, there is no way I would even consider sending my child to any program away from home. It is my hope that other parents will feel the same and will seek alternative solutions for their teens and for their families.
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Offline Nihilanthic

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Help At Any Cost - Not What I Had Hoped It Would Be
« Reply #23 on: March 02, 2006, 02:15:00 AM »
Glad to have you on board, MomCat!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
DannyB on the internet:I CALLED A LAWYER TODAY TO SEE IF I COULD SUE YOUR ASSES FOR DOING THIS BUT THAT WAS NOT POSSIBLE.

CCMGirl on program restraints: "DON\'T TAZ ME BRO!!!!!"

TheWho on program survivors: "From where I sit I see all the anit-program[sic] people doing all the complaining and crying."

Offline Angel Lux

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Help At Any Cost - Not What I Had Hoped It Would Be
« Reply #24 on: March 02, 2006, 02:20:00 PM »
Any publicity bringing awareness to institutionalized child abuse is helpful.  However, I do agree that the book does not leave the common reader with a "we need to do something to stop this" mentality.  I'd like to see a compilation of survivor stories published: maybe give each contributor 1-5 pages to write about a specific experience or two.  Imagine 50 different personal stories, some with parallel themes but each still describing a one-of-a-kind, personalized walk through a living nightmare.  It would be very powerful.
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Offline Anonymous

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Help At Any Cost - Not What I Had Hoped It Would Be
« Reply #25 on: March 02, 2006, 02:32:00 PM »
A compilation may not have the results you'd like.  Middle America would just look at those and dismiss them as "disgruntled former patients".  That's usually what happens when those of us who have been through these places try to tell our stories.  We're written off as drug abusers who lie and manipulate.  That's why I see Maia's book as a great introduction to John and Jane Q. Public of the industry as a whole.  She ties those 4 programs together beautifully and, IMO, presents it to readers along with some explanation as to why there hasn't been an uproar about what's happened and why parents continue to turn to the programs.  It may not tell the entire story, but I don't think any one book can.  It's another piece of the puzzle, just like Fornits or FICA or NoSpank.  If it gets people interested in what's going on then maybe they'll do a little Googling themselves and put the whole thing together.
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Offline try another castle

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Help At Any Cost - Not What I Had Hoped It Would Be
« Reply #26 on: March 02, 2006, 04:20:00 PM »
I think that the most important thing Maia's book does is contextualize the problem. No more can people think of these as isolated incidents of abuse, but more as a systemic problem, how that problem developed, who is behind it, and why.
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Offline CCM girl 1989

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« Reply #27 on: March 02, 2006, 08:17:00 PM »
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On 2006-03-02 11:20:00, Angel Lux wrote:

"Any publicity bringing awareness to institutionalized child abuse is helpful.  However, I do agree that the book does not leave the common reader with a "we need to do something to stop this" mentality.  I'd like to see a compilation of survivor stories published: maybe give each contributor 1-5 pages to write about a specific experience or two.  Imagine 50 different personal stories, some with parallel themes but each still describing a one-of-a-kind, personalized walk through a living nightmare.  It would be very powerful."


Interesting idea.
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f you were never in a program, or a parent of a child in a program, then you have no business posting here.

Offline OKB4RMA

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Help At Any Cost - Not What I Had Hoped It Would Be
« Reply #28 on: March 02, 2006, 08:26:00 PM »
50 stories?...How about 500...hell...Ginger could probably get that many just by cutting and pasting off of fornits...it could be done in a way that shows the similarities between each program...for example...the "lifeboat exercise"...it sure sounds like that happened in many different schools.  I could go on and on about particular exercises...but really...we could make a book thicker than the DSM-IV
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Offline Goodtobefree

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Help At Any Cost - Not What I Had Hoped It Would Be
« Reply #29 on: March 02, 2006, 08:40:00 PM »
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On 2006-03-02 17:26:00, OKB4RMA wrote:

"50 stories?...How about 500...hell...Ginger could probably get that many just by cutting and pasting off of fornits...it could be done in a way that shows the similarities between each program...for example...the "lifeboat exercise"...it sure sounds like that happened in many different schools.  I could go on and on about particular exercises...but really...we could make a book thicker than the DSM-IV"


Has anyone read that book by Alexia Parks?  "An American Gulag" is the title.  I think that that's what it is, a collection of accounts from various programs.  Anybody know more about it than that?  I'm still waiting for my order to be delivered, so if I don't hear anything, I'll post about it when I get a chance to read it.
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cademy at Swift River 2001-2002, Peer Group 17
Freedom is the most precious thing we have.  Those who would take it from their fellow man deserve not mercy or compassion, only pain and suffering.