Author Topic: Two 14yr-olds dead *Update*  (Read 21702 times)

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Offline Anonymous

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Two 14yr-olds dead *Update*
« Reply #75 on: February 25, 2006, 09:47:00 AM »
"That's what they call pain compliance," Lewen said.

Camp rules allowed force

In 2004, state officials promised to use less force at juvenile facilities. But those rules never applied to Florida's boot camps.

By ALEX LEARY and CURTIS KRUEGER
Published February 25, 2006



TALLAHASSEE - A month into his job, Anthony Schembri already was making a splash.

The new head of Florida's juvenile justice agency ceremoniously declared the end of aggressive force toward children in state facilities.

"You can't teach compassion by modeling callousness, and you can't teach respect for the law if you are showing disrespect," Schembri said in the summer of 2004.

Unnoticed, however, was that Schembri's reforms did not apply to workers at juvenile boot camps.

Now, with the camps thrust into the spotlight, some question if the exemption cost a 14-year-old boy his life.

"When you have a policy to protect kids it has to go across the board," said Rep. Gus Barreiro, R-Miami Beach, who has become a leading boot camp critic since last month's death of Martin Lee Anderson in a Panama City, Fla., boot camp.

The death came after Anderson was pushed, punched and kneed by a half-dozen drill instructors and is the subject of a criminal investigation. It has also triggered policy changes that could ban the use of force at boot camps.

Critics say that means juvenile justice officials are now doing what Schembri did not do two years ago.

"What do you say to (Martin's) mother? Now we understand it wasn't a good idea not to apply that policy to everyone?" Barreiro said. "Sorry doesn't cut it. He'll never come home."

Schembri, the brash-talking New Yorker who was the model for the TV show The Commish, declined to be interviewed for this story.

A spokeswoman said Friday that he did not include boot camps in the Youth Rights Policy because boot camps have a different philosophy toward rehabilitation than other juvenile programs.

"It's not like one size fits all," Cynthia Lorenzo said. Schembri, she said, knew local sheriffs operated the boot camps and their staff had "superior training" to that of other juvenile justice personnel.

But that training provides greater latitude for the type of tactics used on Martin Anderson.

"They've created a culture that is susceptible to abuse," said Rep. Dan Gelber, D-Miami Beach, a former federal prosecutor.

Gelber said that even within the boot camps there are different standards of force. "With what we have now, I'm not sure what the limits are," he said.


* * *

Critics say the differing standards reflect the clout of Florida's sheriffs.

"Schembri doesn't want to offend the good old boy network, the guys that believe that bashing a kid's face into a wall works. Sheriffs have huge leverage," said Clearwater activist Cathy Corry.

"The sad reality is the multitude of kids who are abused or neglected and the public doesn't know about it because they didn't die," said Corry, who runs http://www.justice4kids.org. a Web site critical of the Juvenile Justice Department.

Lorenzo could not say Friday whether Schembri spoke to sheriffs about the policy change in 2004.

Whatever the case, he was not breaking tradition. Sheriff's offices have been permitted more leeway since youth boot camps began in Florida in 1993.

Manatee County Sheriff Charlie Wells, who opened the first boot camp, said the in-your-face tactics were seen as integral.

"It's a control factor ... The boot camp would fall flat on its face without that initial intake," he said.

Wells pointed out that Democratic Gov. Lawton Chiles and fellow Democrats controlled state government at the time and the concept was "unilaterally accepted."

The Department of Juvenile Justice did not exist then; the former Florida Department of Health and Rehabilitative Services oversaw boot camps. The thinking at the time was sheriffs' employees were already subject to extensive training and did not need what HRS could offer, Lorenzo and others said.

Those regulations come under the state's Criminal Justice Standards and Training Commission, a longstanding panel that governs law enforcement.

Most boot camp employees are trained under the defensive tactics component, which in 624 pages spells out how to take down subjects and apply some of the very moves - hammerlocks, shoulderlocks and pressure points - barred in other juvenile facilities. Those facilities, which include wilderness camps and standard juvenile detention facilities, follow the more restrictive Protective Action Response policy.

"Too many youth have been injured in incidents with these techniques," Schembri said in 2004. "While these holds may be appropriate for an adult population, experience has shown us that it is too easy to injure a young person when applying these holds. Physical restraint should be applied only to prevent a youth from hurting himself or others."

His memo disclosing those reforms did not mention that boot camps were not affected.


* * *

The omission potentially affected scores of youths, including Sean Matthew Lewen of Pinellas Park, who went through the Bay County boot camp last year.

Lewen said he was sent to the camp after he faced charges of battery, burglary and violation of probation.

The 18-year-old told the St. Petersburg Times a drill instructor held down his thumb and pushed on a pressure point - the underside of his wrist. "It hurt," he said. "It made me shut up."

Although staff members at boot camps, jails and other institutions generally are trained in ways to restrain unruly inmates, Lewen said drill instructors in Bay County used some of these methods make inmates comply.

"If they saw we were doing anything wrong, that's when they hurt us," Lewen said.

One day, he said, he was sitting in the boot camp classroom when a drill instructor told him to put his things under his desk.

When he said he already had, the drill instructor pulled him out of his chair and called in on his radio a "signal 93" for "insolence," Lewen said. That brought another drill instructor into the classroom.

Lewen said he was squirming as the drill instructor pulled his hands behind his back, and "that's when he started to pull my thumb back and pressure point me."

Lewen said the drill instructors took him outside to a dirt field and had him do a "low crawl" through the dirt. He said he also was told to do sprints across the field and that he was given a dustpan and told to "paint the dirt," by smoothing it all out. He said he was then told to fill two buckets with dirt and sprint across the field carrying them.

Lewen said he saw drill instructors using the wrist pressure point technique on youths about a dozen times during his six months in the boot camp.

"That's what they call pain compliance," Lewen said.

Lorenzo, the juvenile justice spokeswoman, said state confidentially rules did not allow her to confirm if Lewen was an inmate at a state boot camp. However, she said: "Any allegation of abuse is taken very seriously by our agency. They are throughly investigated, and if substantiated further action is taken to the full extent."

Lewen said he received a high school diploma in boot camp. But half a year later, he said he is still angry about the experience.

"It filled my heart with hate, that's it," he said.


* * *

Chris Caballero, second in command at the Department of Juvenile Justice, said it is too early to tell if the Bay County boot camp guards exceeded the more lenient standards in the Anderson case.

But juvenile justice officials already have taken steps to create a more uniform policy. A tentative list of changes that surfaced this week bar use of pain compliance at boot camps.

Some could see that as an acknowledgement that past practices fell short of the principles Schembri extolled two years ago.

"Hindsight is always 20/20," Caballero said. "It's like when an accident happens at an intersection without a red light. The first thing everybody usually does is call for a red light."
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Offline Anonymous

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Two 14yr-olds dead *Update*
« Reply #76 on: February 25, 2006, 09:48:00 AM »
Here's the link to the story above.  http://www.sptimes.com/2006/02/25/State ... d_fo.shtml
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Offline nite owl

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Two 14yr-olds dead *Update*
« Reply #77 on: February 26, 2006, 11:50:00 PM »
Here's a reply to this story by someone from Panama City with the user name of Concerned Citizen. I asked this person what would be appropriate punishment for a child...


Punishment for me would be to be detained, unable to have the freedoms I am used to, forced to do things that I did not want to do and taken away from my job. The last time this happened to me it was called "jury duty".

I believe that detention alone is not good enough for criminals. They need to be required to work/exercise in some manner to pay back their detention as well as recognize that they don't get to decide what they want to do all the time. Unfortunately, if they don't agree and resist, we need to find ways to overrule their decision.

The thing that concerns me is that too many people are applying standards that they would succumb to, against the criminal trash that we should care less about. I'm not proposing we torture people in jail but we need some way to escalate the discipline to fit increasing resistance. It isn't like we can throw them in jail if they resist-- they're already there!

http://bb.emeraldcoast.com/ecforum/view ... 5&start=15[ This Message was edited by: nite owl on 2006-02-26 20:52 ]
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Offline Anonymous

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Two 14yr-olds dead *Update*
« Reply #78 on: February 27, 2006, 11:50:00 AM »
Boy, 14, tells of boot camp beatings

A boy who says he witnessed the beating of Martin Lee Anderson recalled what he saw and heard at the Panama City boot camp.

BY MARC CAPUTO [email protected]

The screaming guards. The pressure points. The knee takedowns. The acrid ammonia stick shoved in the face of a rubber-legged 14-year-old named Martin Lee Anderson.

Aaron Swartz can't forget any of it. Not because he saw it all the way most people did -- in a grainy videotape of the guards and Martin before his death -- but because Aaron was there, at Bay County Boot Camp, receiving much of the same violent treatment that still makes him shudder miles away from it all.

''They killed that boy. They didn't help him. They beat him,'' Aaron, also 14, told The Miami Herald in one of the first eyewitness -- and earwitness -- accounts of the dehumanizing experience of life at the Panama City lockup before, during and after Martin's arrival.

Like every kid who's about to enter the Bay Boot Camp, Aaron said Martin lost his first name. From the moment he arrived Jan. 5, he was called ''Offender Anderson,'' just like Aaron was ''Offender Swartz.'' Actually, the names -- and slurs and everything else -- were screamed at them by ''drill instructors,'' who slammed boys against concrete walls, shoved their thumbs in a painful pressure point behind their ears, and forced them to respond with a ``Sir, yes sir!''

And just like every kid's hair, Martin's braids were shaved off aggressively by a mocking DI. It was there, as Martin sat in the barber chair, that Aaron first saw him. And Martin had the look: ''scared, like everybody else,'' Aaron said.
As Aaron tells it, time at the camp was measured in fear and pain, in increments of forced exercise, wall-slams, pressure points, knee takedowns and hammer-fist punches by DIs who video-taped it all. When the boys would go to bed, he said, they could hear the DIs watching the tapes in a nearby room, cheering on their greatest hits as if watching a sporting event.
''The stuff they did to him, they do to everybody everyday. I've never seen somebody get pressure-pointed that many times at once, but it's pretty much like that everyday,'' he said.

The medical treatment wasn't much better. Aaron said the camp is a place where the nurse, Kristin Schmidt, more often dispensed the term ''malingerer'' -- rather than medicine -- when kids said they were hurt or sick.
Despite suffering from asthma and a chest infection, he said, Schmidt refused to give him anything but Sudafed for more than a month. After Martin's death, a doctor finally saw him and put him on antibiotics.

Martin's death is under investigation. No charges have been filed. A new medical examiner will review the autopsy -- and might exhume Martin -- to verify whether he died from an exertion-related blood disorder, as the Bay County medical examiner found. Sheriff Frank McKeithen said last week he'll soon close the camp.

COVERUP CHARGED
Like Martin's family, Aaron thinks there's a coverup. He believes he overheard one guard repeatedly talking of ''revising'' and changing a report or reports, but he doesn't know which ones. He said around 6 p.m. on Jan. 6 a camp counselor told the boys Martin had died of natural causes -- only about two hours after Dr. Charles Siebert finished the autopsy.

Siebert said Saturday that nobody could determine the cause of death that soon, and he later thought a sickle-cell trait might be to blame. But he had to wait for lab results.

''I had no physical evidence of any trauma or injury that could have caused or contributed to his death, therefore I had to wait for further evidence to determine his cause of death,''

Siebert said in an e-mail of his controversial autopsy report, which Martin's family disputes. Siebert said he later reviewed reports from the guards saying Martin resisted them. Siebert said the reports indicated Martin was aware and able to respond verbally.

The Bay County Sheriff's Office will not discuss the case. The DIs could not be reached. The nurse won't comment.

Florida public-records laws prohibit access to juvenile records for living children such as Aaron. He was convicted for a store break-in; Martin for joyriding in his grandma's car.

Aaron's mother, Shuana Manning, spoke in general terms last week to the news media about what her son saw. She produced copies of handwritten letters that Aaron sent from the camp -- signed: ``Offender Swartz.''

Aaron spoke to The Miami Herald for more than an hour at his mother's Tallahassee-area home during a weekend break Saturday from a Panhandle wilderness camp. He was sent there three weeks after Martin's death.

Aaron said he hasn't seen the video of Martin's beating.

The video opens up with youths running around in a circle, typical on ''intake day'' when the DIs made them run 16 laps and perform multiple push-ups and sit-ups. Martin was doing well, but then he staggered, stopped and fell.

''They should have known he wasn't faking because it was his last lap,'' Aaron said.

DI Charles Steven Enfinger made a beeline for Martin and ''slammed him up against the wall,'' he said.

''He's one of the most violent ones, he likes to slam you and stuff. They all come to work, every day, and try to slam somebody. It's like you can tell by the way they act,'' Aaron said.

DI Henry Lincoln McFadden soon joined Enfinger, said Aaron, noting the two men yelled in Martin's face.

Soon, everyone had finished their exercises and had to sit down nearby, eyes forward. Aaron said he shifted his glance slightly to watch Martin. He said he was too far away to hear everything Enfinger and McFadden were yelling, but never heard any type of response from Martin.

Here's what he heard: ''Point 99 on Offender Anderson.'' It was McFadden and Enfinger reporting in radio code that they had applied a pressure-point behind Martin's ear. After seven of those, Aaron stopped counting. He said he also saw and heard the ''knee takedown'' on Martin.
One DI watching over Aaron and the others laughed: ''Offender Anderson's going to have a long day.'' Aaron said multiple guards joined in, and Cpl. Joseph Walsh used so much exertion that he worked up a sweat. He said Enfinger struck Martin repeatedly on the arm, which is reflected in the video.

''And the nurse comes over there. She's watching. She's standing there,'' he said. Soon she applied an electronic pulse reader to Martin's finger that beeps with every heart beat. ''It was like beep-beep-beep-beep,'' Aaron said quickly.

SUDDEN CONCERN
Finally, the tone of the DI screaming started to change from angry to concerned when Walsh said: ''Get the red bag!'' The bag had ammonia sticks in it, which the guards would crack open and press against the offenders' noses to revive them to perform more exercises. A DJJ official said last week that using ammonia in this nonmedical way was against policy. Aaron said he had been dosed once when he was about to pass out from exercise. ''It burns,'' he said.

But the ammonia didn't revive Martin. And soon they could hear the sirens. The boys were led inside. Martin was whisked away only hours after arriving at the camp.

The following evening, about 15 hours after Martin was pronounced dead, Aaron said, the mental health counselor named ''Ms. Miki'' told them that ``it was completely medical. . . . Athletes die every day, all the time, for medical reasons -- that healthy athletes stop and die so it's not unusual.''

Said Aaron: ``I don't think that's true at all. Even if it was medical, when he passed out, if they would have set him down and then gave him medical help right then, I think they could have saved his life and everything. But instead, they did all pressure-pointing, slammed him, beating up on him and everything.''
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Offline Anonymous

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Two 14yr-olds dead *Update*
« Reply #79 on: February 27, 2006, 12:01:00 PM »
Interesting Google results for ?Boot camp death.
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Offline Anonymous

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Two 14yr-olds dead *Update*
« Reply #80 on: March 07, 2006, 07:44:00 AM »
http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/14034885.htm

BOOT CAMP DEATH  Boot camp nurse who walked away is under fireThe actions of a nurse assigned to monitor the health of teen boys at the Bay Boot Camp in Panama City are under scrutiny after the death of Martin Lee Anderson.

BY CAROL MARBIN MILLER [email protected]

On the morning of Jan. 5, eight officers in wide-brimmed military hats stood prepared to do whatever was necessary to guard against the vices of sloth and disobedience at a Panama City juvenile boot camp.  Nurse Kristin Anne Schmidt had a different task. Clad in a white lab coat, Schmidt's job was to guard against other dangerous threats: fatigue, dehydration and hidden ailments that can lead to physical distress among youths engaged in rigorous exercise at the camp.

That morning, in what were certainly the most fateful moments of Schmidt's medical career, the eight officers punched and kneed 14-year-old Martin Lee Anderson while Schmidt stood a short distance away looking on. Minutes later, after Schmidt examined him with a stethoscope, the teen left the boot camp on a stretcher, unconscious and not breathing. Within hours, he was dead.

Medical ethicists say Schmidt's actions that day are the most telling example, since the 2003 appendicitis death of a teen at the Miami juvenile lockup, of how the decisions of healthcare workers in jails or prisons are fraught with danger if they conflate the ethics of a penal system with those of their own profession.

''When judgment calls have to be made, you must err on the side of protection,'' said Arthur Caplan, chairman of the medical ethics department at the University of Pennsylvania School of Medicine. ``She was there as a nurse. She was not there as a guard.''

`A REAL RISK'
In penal settings, Caplan added, ``There's a real risk that nurses and doctors will grow a pair of handcuffs, or grow a baton.''

Schmidt, 52, may face trouble on two fronts: a special prosecutor, who is investigating the circumstances of Martin's death, and the state Board of Nursing, which oversees the profession. Both Benjamin Crump, the attorney for Martin's family, and an unidentified Florida nurse have filed complaints against Schmidt with the state.
There is precedent for charging healthcare workers with a crime when prosecutors feel they failed to help juveniles in distress.

In Miami, a grand jury indicted two nurses on charges of second-degree murder and manslaughter in the death of 17-year-old Omar Paisley. The youth died of a ruptured appendix at the Miami-Dade juvenile lockup after medical staff allegedly ignored his pleas for help.
The nurses are awaiting trial. The prosecution, which is extremely rare, will not be easy -- essentially trying to prove something should have been done and wasn't -- said Miami-Dade State Attorney Katherine Fernandez Rundle.

''We had a lot of lawyers with different opinions about the case,'' Rundle said. ``But I'm a parent. And you just think of a child treated in this way, and it's heart-wrenching. It is intolerable in a civilized nation like ours. It is unspeakable that these things happen here.''
Schmidt, a registered nurse, has declined requests for an interview. She has worked at the Panama City boot camp, which operates under a contract with the state Department of Juvenile Justice, since it opened in 1994. Unlike the guards involved in the incident that day, who have been placed in positions where they have no contact with the youths at the camp, there was no change in Schmidt's status.

Schmidt attended Alfred University School of Nursing in New York, from 1977 to '79, according to her Florida Board of Nursing application.
From 1984 to 1986, records show Schmidt worked at the Anneewakee Hospital, a treatment center and wilderness camp for about 150 troubled boys in Carrabelle, in the Panhandle. The treatment center was closed in 1986 amid allegations of widespread abuse and molestation of children.
The Herald has found no evidence Schmidt was involved in any incident.

Following Anneewakee's closure, Schmidt went to work at Florida State Hospital, a 1,100-bed locked mental hospital in Chattahoochee, where she was a senior registered nurse coordinator.

FINED $250

In 1991, Schmidt worked at the Rivendell Psychiatric Center in Panama City. In August 1992, while at the mental hospital, state medical regulators charged Schmidt with failing to keep proper records of how she dispensed tranquilizers. Schmidt was reprimanded and fined $250, records show.

Between 1992 and 1994, Schmidt worked for a nursing home, a home health agency and the American Red Cross.

Since going to work at the Bay Boot Camp, she has earned consistently high marks on her performance evaluations. Schmidt, who is paid $38,155 a year, was praised in her June 2005 evaluation as ''a longtime employee that does her job well,'' as ''consistent and dependable'' and who ``works in the best interest of all involved.'' As for her observation of ''established rules and regulations,'' Capt. Mike Thompson wrote that Schmidt ``does things by the book.''

Shortly after Martin Anderson's death, Schmidt told a Juvenile Justice official that her role in the boot camp's exercise yard ``was to monitor the entire group [of new inmates] for labored breathing, irregular movements [and] any form of physical distress during the exercise drills.''
Schmidt made the comments to Dr. Shairi R. Turner, the department's chief medical director, who wrote a report on the teen's death.

Schmidt first noticed Martin while he was ''against the wall'' with 'drill instructors on either side of him to `maintain control,' '' Turner's report said. 'He was noted at times to be on his feet and then laying down during the `use of force techniques.' ''

`COULD NOT BREATHE'

While Schmidt was checking Martin's heart rate, he told her ''he could not breathe,'' Turner wrote.

But the nurse took no action, saying ``he appeared comfortable and in no respiratory distress.''

That was Schmidt's first mistake, said Nancy Hamilton, chief executive officer of St. Petersburg's Operation PAR drug treatment program and president of the Florida Juvenile Justice Association.

''In our world, your obligation is first to the client,'' Hamilton said. 'I don't care if the client is faking it. You call 911 and get him to the hospital. Then you deal with him faking it later on. You never take a chance when someone says, `I can't breathe.' ''

''I would rather deal with the expense of a hospital visit than a dead child any day,'' Hamilton added.


A videotape of the incident shows that 15 to 20 minutes elapsed between Schmidt's first contact with Martin and the next time she examined him. Schmidt spent most of that time observing officers as they punched, kneed and applied pressure points to Martin as he remained limp.
Schmidt 'stayed by the youth and watched for `any distress,' '' Turner wrote of her debriefing of the nurse. 'When she noted the youth stopped `fully complying' with the officers, she went inside to retrieve [the sergeant] to make him aware of the situation,'' Turner wrote.

'When they returned to the youth, he stated that `he could not see and he could not breathe,' '' Turner added.

Paramedics arrived within four minutes , the report said. On the tape, Martin is lifted onto a stretcher, his arm dangling from the side.
Kenneth Goodman, who heads the University of Miami's bioethics program, calls Schmidt's behavior a cautionary tale for medical professionals who work in corrections programs:

``In environments like this, all bets are off because you're not merely doing healthcare.

``You're in a highly charged situation, and I would imagine the pressure on her is to accommodate her law enforcement colleagues.''
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Offline Antigen

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Two 14yr-olds dead *Update*
« Reply #81 on: March 07, 2006, 02:45:00 PM »
Another interesting Google search

you Momma is a big fat's ________
--Leroy Brown

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Offline Anonymous

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Two 14yr-olds dead *Update*
« Reply #82 on: March 07, 2006, 09:32:00 PM »
You can find articles and view the video of Martin's death at http://www.caica.org/NEWS%20DEATHS%20Martin%20Main.htm
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Offline Anonymous

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Two 14yr-olds dead *Update*
« Reply #83 on: March 14, 2006, 04:00:00 PM »
When I read about this I cried for the boy and his family. It seems to me that Boot Camps are not the answer.  Try showing these kids love and respect and maybe they will give it back. The "system" has to take full responsibility for this cruel act of torture that killed a 14 year old boy.   The boy took his grandmother's car for a joy ride.  How many of us have done that as children. That has been going on since the car was invented. This boy did not have to be beat to death over an act of irresponsibility.
My God he was 14 years old, he has the right
to act irresponible. I pray for the grandmother who called the aurthorities on this boy.  She thought she was doing him good.  She has to live with this crisis the rest of her life. I think we need to pull our children closer to us and know that they will do things we don't approve of. They might even break the law. But they dont deserve to die for it!
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Offline Anonymous

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Two 14yr-olds dead *Update*
« Reply #84 on: March 14, 2006, 05:15:00 PM »
If I understand correctly:

1) Martin didn't actually take his grandmother's car himself; he was with several cousins who decided to go joyriding and he just went along for the ride (which makes him *legally* responsible, but not so clearly *morally* responsible).

2) The grandmother didn't want to press charges, but because the joyride ended in an accident, the authorities decided to prosecute anyway.  So she's pretty much blameless.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #85 on: March 14, 2006, 05:37:00 PM »
From what I've read I think you understood correctly.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #86 on: March 15, 2006, 06:56:00 PM »
There is only one kid who was killed Matin Lee Anderson. You might have been confused because his mother's name is Jones and not Anderson. I live in Panama City so this shit is even more real to me and my friend's brother is one of the drill instructors. I think that he is the stupidest SOB on the planet and I know that he is going to go to jail and that the Boot Camp WILL be shut down in April thanks to Sheriff McKeithen's efforts. I also know that this is also going to put a lot of innocent people out of their jobs.
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Offline MomCat

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« Reply #87 on: March 16, 2006, 01:06:00 AM »
Are you so sure many of those people are that innocent, that work in those places? How innocent can they be when all this abuse is so rampant? Don't they see, why don't they report it like they should? Isn't it law that if professionals working with children in any capacity must report abuse? I'm sure some employees are innocent and good, but I wonder how many are not?
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #88 on: March 16, 2006, 12:33:00 PM »
how can I send condolences to the family. I have been crying for days. It would help if I could express my sadness and outrage. please email me an address. [email protected]
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Offline Antigen

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Two 14yr-olds dead *Update*
« Reply #89 on: March 16, 2006, 12:36:00 PM »
I quite agree, MomCat. Ask any cop, DA or judge; ignorance is no defense.

Look, these people, from Guy Tunnell and all of his buddies in FDLE all the way down to the lowliest camera guy or kitchen lady all should know better than to treat human beings the way they do. But they don't know it. They really don't. They can't see it because they don't want to. What they see is rebellious, bad kids who deserve to be beat down for their own good and the good of society.

Same thing happened in Germany and Austria and Italy in the daze leading up to WWII. Remember this, if nothing else. Many of the people who provide political cover and protection for these toughlove hate group operations have done this to their very own children. If it were just a couple of errant, sadistic guards, we could just prosecute them and be done with it. It's not that at all. What we're looking at is deep seated and complete religious indoctrination.

I'm truly sorry for your friend and his brother. I bet he will land up in prison. And, having been not only a CO, but CO over children, he's not going to have an easy time of it. Worse? He'll start his time with his head still swimming, reeling with protestations "But I'm a good guy! I didn't do anything wrong! It wasn't supposed to be this way!" But it is this way and we each are responsible for our own actions, regardless of what the hell we thought we were doing.

But I believe there's a special place in Hell for those who lead others astray. I just hope there's a Janet Karpinski somewhere into this mix with the moxie, integrity and credibility to make sure that the people who have been responsible for this madness over the past 30 years get what's coming to them.

I'm not talking about tit for tat vengeance, either. I'm talking total dispossession of the authority to fuck with our children in the future. That may seem like light punishment, but it's not. Believe me, the worst hell you could wish on these people would be to have to see themselves for what they really are instead of the self serving  nobel hero fantasy world they live in now.

Hands that help are far better then lips that pray.
--Robert G. Ingersoll, American politician and lecturer

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
"Don\'t let the past remind us of what we are not now."
~ Crosby Stills Nash & Young, Sweet Judy Blue Eyes